 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: dporter1624
Date: 2010-09-15 03:14
I bought what was represented to be an old Selmer Bb clarinet (30's L??) and it turned out not to be either a Bb or a Selmer.
The markings are an A over LP on both joints. These appear to be hand scribed. The upper joint is marked in the typical space but on the bottom joint the marking is off to the right side. There are no serial numbers. It is wood (very tight grain) and the bell is marked "France" near the upper metal band. The keywork is similar to an old Selmer and has 7 rings. The case is of the style one would expect from a 60-80 year old instrument.
Anyone recognize this marking? A over LP? I am assuming the A represents the key. I would really like to know what I am now the proud owner of!
Thanks
415-595-3484
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: sfalexi
Date: 2010-09-15 11:52
Are there ANY markings from a particular maker? And close up pics will help people identify it. There are some VERY knowledgeable techs here, and I know that Dave Spiegelthal (you can find him on this board) knows a LOT about older and vintage instruments. I bought an A LP clarinet from him that is at LEAST 80 years old (the stamp of the maker had stopped being used in 1930)
Alexi
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Tony Beck
Date: 2010-09-15 12:11
LP stands for Low Pitch (around A=440), it's not maker specific. Back around the turn of the 20th century, a lot of bands and orchestras played High Pitch (A~452), especially in Europe. The LP marking went out in the 1920s or 30s as everyone settled on low pitch.
If the left hand pinky C# and B keys share a single post, your clarinet would be no newer than the 1930s. Does it have a wrap around register key?
Hopefully Dave S will chime in here. If anyone can get to the bottom of this, it would be him.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: dporter1624
Date: 2010-09-16 00:36
Great information. The left hand pinky C# and B keys are single post and it is not a wrap around register key. The throat A/G# is single post as well. There are no markings other than the A over the LP which appear to be hand scribed. The grain is so tight I almost thought it was an early composite. However after looking closely with a magnifying glass it is wood.
So if I understand you correctly any number of makers might have used this type of marking to identify pitch and key but then not identify themselves?
Very strange marketing!
Thank you all. I would still like to find out more and I very much appreciate your comments. I will attempt to photograph the instrument this weekend. The marks are very hard to see with out magnification and a lot of light.
Thanks
David
415-595-3484
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Lelia Loban ★2017
Date: 2010-09-16 12:46
>>I am assuming the A represents the key. >>
Yes, you're right about that. Putting the key above the LP or HP designation was normal. Not all manufacturers used High Pitch and Low Pitch marks, but they were used over a wider period of time than some people realize. The extremes in my own collection, instruments I can definitely date (from the serial numbers), are an 1898 Buffet E-flat sopranino clarinet and a 1947 C. G. Conn "Naked Lady" E-flat alto saxophone.
Lelia
http://www.scoreexchange.com/profiles/Lelia_Loban
To hear the audio, click on the "Scorch Plug-In" box above the score.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: dporter1624
Date: 2010-09-16 17:33
Once again thank you for your input.
I am curious if I am looking at a short list of makers or a really long one? Logically one would expect only very skilled makers would be producing A clarinets since I assume the market even back then was dominated by Bb production. My hope was to find some pictures and try to determine who the maker is from a visual comparison. Is there a good library of photos on-line that I might access?
Thanks
David
415-595-3484
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: yearsofwisdom
Date: 2010-09-18 01:10
I have a Bb LP Selmer.... Plays so wonderfully.... much better than any of the new buffets i have yet encountered.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: chris moffatt
Date: 2010-09-19 00:44
A lot of these unmarked horns were sold early C20 by importers such as Bruno or Carl Fischer. They are very difficult, if not impossible, to track down. You might find some small ID marks if you take off all the keys and look closely at the wood but they likely wouldn't tell much anyway. There were a number of suppliers, among them Couesnon, Buffet and several smaller makers (of whom there were many around Paris and La Couture/Boussey). If there is a serial number it may be possible to identify a little more. There's a decent chance that it's a quality horn. If you search the archives on this board you will find a highly informative post by Ken Shaw regarding how to ID older Buffets.....search on "Ken Shaw Buffet" and it'll come up. The same comments apply largely to Couesnon horns of the same era....Edinburgh University (google EUCHMI) has an online catalog that is sometimes helpful as does the NMM.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: dporter1624
Date: 2010-09-21 06:22
Good information all around. Mechanically it sems pretty good. Not unlike some of my old Selmers which I collect. My hope is that it is an old gem that I can bring back to life.
Many thanks to all.
David
415-595-3484
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
