 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: CarlT
Date: 2010-07-22 13:11
I've been playing no. 3 reeds (mostly VD V-12s) for sometime now on an M-13 Lyre mp. These reeds play well for me once I have adjusted them.
About a week ago I thought I'd just try a 3-1/2 (only bought one at a local store) just to see how it would blow. Boy, was I surprised I could hardly get a sound out of it. I really didn't think that a 1/2 step harder reed would be that hard to play. Even after adjusting the 3-1/2, it was way to hard for me.
Is this normal, or do you all think I just might have purchased a difficult reed?
Sorry for the dumb question, but I still consider myself fairly ignorant when it comes to some of the basics of clarinet playing.
Okay, I might have found the answer. The 3-1/2 I bought was a Zonda. I should have bought a VD, but the clerk said try the Zonda, for she really liked it better than the VD. I do believe that the Zonda could be more like a no. 4. When I go back I may get a 3-1/2 VD to try.
Do you agree, as I could not find a strength chart that compares Zondas to VDs, etc.
CarlT
Post Edited (2010-07-22 13:28)
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Author: A Brady
Date: 2010-07-22 14:04
When you do try the Vandorens in a 3.5 or different strength, remember that Vandoren deliberately puts a variety of microstrengths into each box, so a typical box of 3.5s will have everything from around a 3.2 to a 3.8 (all approximate.) They do this so that more players can find an appropriate strength reed for their set up in each box, but it makes the reeds extremely variable, and makes it impossible to judge a new strength from testing only one reed, so always buy a full box to get a true idea of what will work for you.
Zonda packages their reeds by microstrengths, as each number is subdivided into 3 smaller units (ie, 3.5 soft, 3.5 medium, 3.5 hard, indicated by letters), so if you can find your proper strength, each box should be much more consistent (at least theoretically!)
Good luck!
AB
AB
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Author: clarinetguy ★2017
Date: 2010-07-22 14:25
I don't use Zondas or Vandorens, but I can give you some general answers.
Sometimes moving to a harder strength can be a big jump. A couple years ago I tried some Gonzalez FOFs (I think they were 3 1/2s, but I'm not sure) and couldn't get them to do anything. Going down a half strength made all the difference in the world. My main reeds now are no. 3 Rico Reserves. I've had great success with them, but when I tried 3 1/2s I couldn't do anything with them.
Perhaps those of you who are Zonda enthusiasts can clear up a mystery. I always thought (perhaps wrongly) that Gonzalez made Zondas. When I checked the Gonzalez web site, I couldn't find anything about Zonda reeds.
There is a clarinet reed comparison index on the Gonzalez site that you might find helpful, but Zonda reeds are absent.
http://www.gonzalezreeds.com/english/faqs.html
Post Edited (2010-07-22 14:27)
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Author: Bassie
Date: 2010-07-25 18:01
Yes, I remember Vandoren steps being /massive/. It makes finding the right strength Vandoren out of the box really difficult.
I think it's just the character of the reed: they're cut so they work best if you have exactly the right strength.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-07-25 18:48
You can't tell anything by buying one single reed because that may be the one best reed in the box or the worse reed in the box. All manufactures have their own number guide and many differ from one cut to another. If you want to see if a half step stronger is better for you, and you like what you're using, you should invest in a box of the same brand. Then hope it's a decent box because sometimes the cane is just not up to par and you're stuck with a lousy box. That can, and does sometimes, happen. ESP http://eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: Loliver
Date: 2010-07-28 12:25
Try several reeds from the box, as they have variable strength. I seem to recall that Vandoren Rue Lepic reeds are slightly softer that standard ones.
ie. that a strength 3 rue lepic = a 2.7 or 2.8 standard vandoren.
Also, I found it odd that I can't distnguish any difference between 3.5 and 3, but I find that 4s are like blowing onto bricks!
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Author: William
Date: 2010-07-28 16:28
"Vandoren deliberately puts a variety of microstrengths into each box"
LOL. That is because it is impossible to manufacture cane reeds that are consistant. Because of the inconsistant way that arundo domax grows, it's xylum fibers are never even or of the same density, even within the same stalk of cane making. So just because two reed blanks are cut the same way by the most precise machine known to Vandy, they will never have the same inner strength nor will the play exactly the same. That very fact has given rise to a vast number of publications on how to adjust reeds with all sorts of knives, clippers, sanders, dutch rush and reed profilers, including the venerable Reed Wizard (which, btw, works very well). That is why the above statement made me smile.....and then, laugh uncontrollably.
But now, having given up cane reeds in favor of the new synthetic Forestone reed, I am once again a 'happy clarinetist'. A combination of plastic and bamboo fibre, they are remarkably consistant, reed-to-reed, requiring only extremly minimal adjustment--for me, often none--for top performance. They always are ready to go (never needing moistening) and never 'die' half way through a gig. In fact, some of mine have lasted for over a year and still are in concert ready condition. The Forestone reed's sound is just as good--if not better--than cane and allows you to play the music without also having to "play the reed". I use them all the time and have never been disapointed.
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Author: srattle
Date: 2010-07-28 16:43
William,
I have to say that I find with my Rico Reserve Classic reeds, I find almost exact matches of strength. I would say 8 out of 10 are the same strength (and the right strength), 1 is a little soft, and one is a little hard. On average I have found this.
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Author: A Brady
Date: 2010-07-28 17:30
"LOL. That is because it is impossible to manufacture cane reeds that are consistant. Because of the inconsistant way that arundo domax grows, it's xylum fibers are never even or of the same density, even within the same stalk of cane making. So just because two reed blanks are cut the same way by the most precise machine known to Vandy, they will never have the same inner strength nor will the play exactly the same. That very fact has given rise to a vast number of publications on how to adjust reeds with all sorts of knives, clippers, sanders, dutch rush and reed profilers, including the venerable Reed Wizard (which, btw, works very well). That is why the above statement made me smile.....and then, laugh uncontrollably."
Single reeds are cut to the same specifications by brand/style; the reeds are then measured after the manufacturing process is complete, by machines that can measure relative strength to increments of .10, and then labeled and packaged accordingly. Cane is extremely variable and can and does change between manufacturing and retail sale, but the initial measurement of tensile strength is no great mystery.
One can visit the Vandoren studio in NYC and try reeds that are accurate to tenths of a strength; Gregory Smith told me in an email that he knows the exact substrength of V12 that works for him, and selects them accordingly from Vandoren. This is not to say that every reed will be perfect or a great player, but will at least be in the ballpark strengthwise.
Synthetics certainly can and do have a place in any professionals case (I keep Legere Signature with me at all times, just in case), but cane reeds are not the unfathomable enigma that so many attempt to make them out to be. Higher maintenance, yes, but well worth the effort and knowledge required to produce a beautiful sound on them.
AB
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2010-07-28 17:49
srattle, I agree with you. The Rico Reserves are cut from only the very lowest part of the stork of cane making them much more consistent in strength then other reeds. When you only use the same part of the cane the reeds will be more alike. I really think it is a myth that Vandoren, or any other company, purposely puts bad or different strengths in the same box to force the buyer to buy more reeds. That's a classic way to lose costumers. There's far too much competition today to do that. They may not cut them with the consistency that they should but I can't believe it's done on purpose. And of course, as pointed out above, cane is inconsistent itself. ESP
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2010-07-28 19:38
Dear Loliver,
My experience is just the opposite........sort of. 56 Rue Lepics are stronger than their regular "blue box" equivalent. The difference is in the length of the vamp which is longer on the 56s making them a better match for all you long lay players out there.
Of course I've used them on B40s without much of a problem.
.................Paul Aviles
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