 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Franklin Liao
Date: 2010-06-26 09:09
Hmm! It would seem that the solo Clarinetist and one other member of the band use a Tosca + Backun barrel...
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Author: USFBassClarinet
Date: 2010-06-26 12:09
according to the comments... This is the band of the Guardia di Finanza in Rome. The soloist Julius Cuseri.
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Author: William
Date: 2010-06-27 16:02
The band is very good, however, the clarinet's style is too "classical" for Artie's Concerto--especially the interpretation of the cadenzas. He is a good clarinetist, just not 'in touch" with the music.
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Author: mrn
Date: 2010-06-28 05:02
DavidBlumberg wrote:
> I didn't expect much more.
The only rendition of this piece I've heard that really does it justice is the original by Artie Shaw himself....
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HLVytcPtWwM
One of my pet peeves about the way people often play this piece (including in this video of the Italian group) is that they tend to "over-swing" the first "allegro" section, because they don't know the difference between swing and boogie-woogie. When players/bands do this, they miss a lot of what is musically interesting about this piece, namely the rhythmic interplay between the straight-8ths of the boogie accompaniment and the somewhat more relaxed feel of the clarinet and other lines.
The other rather notable problem with this interpretation is that the drum beat in the final section is supposed to sound like Gene Krupa's drumming in the Benny Goodman version of Sing, Sing, Sing (in fact, this Concerto was basically written in response to Sing, Sing, Sing, or at least that's what I've been told), and this group's drummer gives it more of a Latin beat, which doesn't make as much sense.
This is one of the better performances of this piece I've heard, though. Artie Shaw is a hard piece to pull off because you have to have superb technical ability, a highly developed ear for intonation, AND an excellent command of the style(s)--not a lot of people have all three. Even some highly accomplished pros struggle with this piece.
Post Edited (2010-06-28 05:36)
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2010-06-28 11:41
mrn,
Great points and a great extension to what William was saying.
OK, I'm a jazzer and always have been but I can play very legit on clarinet as well as alto sax when required. But to go the other way, from legit to jazz, is a little trickier as you know. The danger is to get a "too mechanical" and the even 8ths are a tip off.
I have not heard Eddie Daniels play this but I suspect it would be great. Larry Combs used to have a regular jazz group in Chicago so I suspect he would pull this off well.
Knowing how to get the jazz feel and sound takes a special set of ears as well as a few technical tools. Otherwise things will come out sounding like Lawrence Welk performing Take Five (ah1, ah2, ah3, ah4, ah5).
HRL
PS I remember playing for a Jewish wedding once and my clarinet professor was in attendance. The band was a jazz group and we did a little Klezmer stuff once in a while. He and I laughed at the break when we chatted. His comment was "OK, I took lessons for Gigliotti but I can't do that stuff!"
Post Edited (2010-06-28 12:06)
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Author: Gobboboy
Date: 2010-06-29 12:40
I'm most likely setting myself up for a slaughtering here, but whilst we're on the subject...
I recorded this a few years ago (gave it my best shot anyway!) I'd be interested in any feed back you guys might have.
<www.myspace.com./benwoodgate>
hope the link works...
Hope you're all well! it's been a while since I've been on here!
Ben
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Author: Gobboboy
Date: 2010-06-29 12:41
I'm most likely setting myself up for a slaughtering here, but whilst we're on the subject...
I recorded this a few years ago (gave it my best shot anyway!) I'd be interested in any feed back you guys might have.
<www.myspace.com/benwoodgate>
hope the link works...
Hope you're all well! it's been a while since I've been on here!
Ben
Post Edited (2010-06-29 12:42)
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Author: William
Date: 2010-06-29 15:37
Ben--very nice clarinetting, however, I did notice ALL of the subtile mistakes that were made. But that is only because I know this Concerto so well, having performed it seven times here in Madison. I would give anything to be able to play it with that wonderful orchestra of yours. I especially liked the solo piano after the introduction and the addition of the other solos throughout, although the sax sounded too "prepared" and still for real improvisation. I liked the paceing of your cadenzas, but felt that you got to the final C7 a bit too fast. I like more "drama" at the end and make the audience think I might not quite make it--but I always do (LOL). As for the boogie-swing "feel", I think you really got into it after the first cadenza where you and the percussionist started your duet. That really swung nicely and was well played--minor mistakes aside. However, after first piano solo, I felt you overdid the syncopation of the 8th notes and played it too ridgid. It should feel more relaxed, like you played it later on. The opening, to me, should be played more legit, but still with the gliss you did so nicely. Their were just some notes that seemed overly rushed. It should be classical with hints of swing interjected here and there.
OK--you asked for it, so here I go. Great clarinet playing, wonderful ensemble backing you up, but with the very minor note, articulation and interpretive errors I did notice, if your were playing at my WSMA district music festival, I would still you a "starred" class A First Division rating that would send you on to our State WSMA Event, but would also warn you that unless some improvements were made, you would most likely earn a Second Divison rating there--especially if I were the State Adjudicator (as I often am). But that is all hypothetical and in the FWIW catagory. You played very well and your performance was--while not "perfect" to my ears--quite enjoyable. Congradualtions and thanks for posting.
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Author: Gobboboy
Date: 2010-06-30 10:52
Hi William
Thankyou for your kind words and thanks for taking the time to listen to to it!
It was recorded in London about 6 years ago (i think) and was a lot of fun. (although I was given less than an hour to get it down, so there are things on it i'm not all that happy about either!)
Thankyou for your comments too, it's always good to hear other peoples opinion about my playing.
I do think though that an 'Interpretation' shouldn't really be classed as an error if you dont mind me saying so. There are many people who have played this piece and i'm think i'm safe in saying that not many of them have played exactly the same as Artie Shaw did. (if i could do that then I wouldn't be asking for critisism!) An interpretation is exactly that, a performance of that particular artists feel for the piece. Have a listen to Sharon Kam's excellent disc 'American Classics' where she plays Shaws & Coplands Concertos along with Bersteins Prelude Fugue & Riffs. All very different from the original recordings by the various artists but none the less very enjoyable. To try to 'mimick' Artie Shaws performance would be futile and pretty pointless as its only him that can be him so to speak!
I have also played the Shaw concerto many times and have a great time each time! it is a real showcase for our instrument and I just wish there were many more pieces out there that could match it!
The Ensemble behind me is the Band of the Royal Artillery based in London. I was it's principal Clarinet player for 15 years and got to play most of the repertoire for band (and orchestra). A great bunch of musicians that play all different styles of music.
any way thanks again for listening and thanks for my second division rating!
Best
Ben
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Author: William
Date: 2010-06-30 16:58
I totally agree with you on interpretation and the futility of trying to mimic Artie Shaw--who, btw, made up most of the Concerto "on the spot" from a lead sheet for the old 1940 film, "Second Chorus". John Bruce-Yeh also put out a CD with much the same content as the CD you mentioned, and for what it is worth, I am not totally in agreement with his rendition either. BTW, I do think you did a better job with the cadenzi that he did. I'll try to find Sharon's CD and give it a listen.
As for the "Second Division" rating, if you will re-read my posting, it was only a prediction, not a certainty. I am 100% sure that you would have taken EVERYTHING I said to be absoluted words of wisdom (as most high school kids do, lol) and would have made the necessary "improvements" that would have resulted in a SOLID FIRST DIVISION STATE WSMA RATING. So (hypothetically) congradulations on "what may have been" had it been.....:>) As the old TV program said, "YOU ASKED FOR IT"--opps, gave away my age on that one.
Bottom line: we agree on almost everyting and it was a pleasure to hear you play. Good clarinetting to you.......William
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