 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: bob gardner
Date: 2000-11-30 19:26
First of all the tech. says everything is fine, so it must be me.
All of the notes in the lower register are perfect, good tone and high volume.
Problem: as soon as I hit the register key the horn dies. The note ( B & C) are really hard to get out and the volume is cut in half.
I have a bundy mp and a lousy lig. Using a #2 rico reed. The lig was so bad I made my own out of valcro.
That the problem--what the solution.
Thanks
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2000-11-30 20:47
Its not necessarily YOU, Bob, the bass cl is a beast when it comes to the clarion register, and the mid-staff B,C,D,are the marginal notes even with a double register keying system [the high register key is on the neck!], what is yours like?? We have discussed this business numerous times here, so look those threads up, give us a bit more info on your horn, perhaps we can give a bit of help! Don
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Author: Willie
Date: 2000-11-30 21:17
I agree with Don about the register key. Also the bass and contras can be real finnicky with a minute leak anywhere. I'd check the register key first and then get or make a leak light and check all the pads very carefully. Try having someone press on the different pads while playing one of the offending notes.Don Berger wrote:
>
> Its not necessarily YOU, Bob, the bass cl is a beast when
> it comes to the clarion register, and the mid-staff B,C,D,are
> the marginal notes even with a double register keying system
> [the high register key is on the neck!], what is yours like??
> We have discussed this business numerous times here, so look
> those threads up, give us a bit more info on your horn, perhaps
> we can give a bit of help! Don
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Author: Don Poulsen
Date: 2000-11-30 21:45
Contrary to what Don B. suggests, bass clarinets are not necessarily beasts in the clarion register. If they are leak-free, they (or at least the good ones) can play quite freely and clearly in all registers. I suggest following Willie's advice to help double check for leaks.
Once you are certain that there are no leaks, you might consider your mouthpiece/reed combination. I am not familiar with the Bundy mouthpiece, so can't address it specifically, but ordinary (orange-box) Rico reeds don't have the greatest reputation. Rico Royals, La Voz and others may be better choices. And you might try out a different mouthpiece. Vandoren B45s are popular bass clarinet mouthpieces. There are others you might consider as well such as the Selmer C*. (But try before you buy.)
Let us know what you find.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2000-11-30 22:21
Even if the tech says its fine, it might not be right for you. On a couple of occasions, on my soprano clarinet, the technician adjusted the low B, C, etc because of leaks. With his finger strength and technique, it was fine. With my finger strength, it still leaked. So have it checked while *YOU* are trying to play these notes. i.e. Have someone move their hand around the horn to determine if any air is coming out the wrong places.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2000-11-30 22:39
Our BBoard is getting nearly as busy as "bass-clarinet@e-groups.com" !! Yes, Don P, I did go a bit far, should have said "can be" instead of "is". As said, very slight leaks in the UJ pads, for me particularly in the thumb pad, really creates problems during rapid fingering passages. I judge, Bob that you have a single reg. key model. Is its tone hole clean, as Dee frequently suggests it must be, and does its pad rise sufficiently? It sounds to me that your problems are prob. not mp or reed related at this time. We will all jump in with suggestions!! Don
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Author: Kurt
Date: 2000-12-01 04:26
It may be a combonation of problems. My single key Vito is a bit stuffy with the B/C just above the break but not too much trouble when adjusted fairly well. I had a heck of a time with reeds/mp/ligiture combos and finally ended up using a unnatural reed called Fibercore which sounds pretty good if not a bit too bright but perfect right out of the box and even accross all registers. Used with a fabric lig. it sounds pretty good. It has helped me by being a constant when issues like this rise up as they seem too with the bass. I've really never had these problems till I started playing the bass. Best of luck to you and keep at it,,,,it may be frustrating now but patience will pay off in the end.
Kurt
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Author: Ken Rasmussen
Date: 2000-12-01 05:42
I bought a very old Selmer Series 9 bass which I'm thinking of naming Christina, sort of like Stephen King's malevolent self repairing car, Christine. I'd just as soon avoid the malevolence, so I wouldn't want to name her exactly the same thing. I started a few weeks ago with a similar observation to yours: The low notes were OK, but after the register key was engaged, yucch. It was particularly bad at the top of the clarion register. I haven't had the horn overhauled, and the mouthpiece is some unidentified piece of plastic, so I wasn't too concerned. I figured there was plenty of mechanical things that could be haywire. I kept tooting on the horn while I waited for the technician's schedule to open up, and for my three mouthpieces that I want to audition to arrive. Every day Christina, the magical self repairing horn, played a bit better. About a week ago, she sang to me!! I stayed up way past midnight listening to her sing. She sang beautifully everywhere, and most beautifully of all right at the top of the clarion register. Either Christina really is a magical self repairing horn, or I just didn't know how to blow a bass. I think maybe I didn't know how to blow a bass. It is pretty different from a soprano--like almost opposite. A person could be forgiven for not figuring it out right away. The exhilerating thing is that my soprano embouchure improved simultaneously. I'm playing altissimo better, and I have more consistent breath support, so the intonation is also better. I find that going back and forth between the horns is giving me new insights as to how to manage both better. I'm up to my 4th C on the bass now, and I'm pausing there to assimilate the new fingerings. It plays easily to that point. There is a whole octave left to explore above that. I haven't started to figure out those fingerings yet. I've got three fingering charts. They all disagree. I have had to invent or modify several fingerings to get exactly what I wanted, and I'm sure that will be even more true of the final octave. It is an awfully interesting instrument.
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Author: Willie
Date: 2000-12-01 06:27
Just wanted to add that the neck joint could be the culprit too. I had this problem with one of the school horns that was well used but recently overhauled. We just wrapped electrical tape around it and the show went on.
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Author: graham
Date: 2000-12-01 09:41
If the technician thinks it's OK then the chances are that Ken and Don are right on target. The bass is a different proposition to the soprano.
One of the more extreme issues is that of air use and air pressure. The clarion B is a high resistance note. Approach it from the throat A or B flat and you have a significant pressure change on your hands. That is also combined with the fact that in general a slightly more relaxed embouchure is what is needed for the upper register as compared with the upper parts of the lower register, and you can easily choke off the note just by failing to juggle these difficulties. That's why Ken's instrument cured itself. He just gave himself time to acclimatise.
Try moving from low E to clarion B, F to C etc.. The resistance will be similar as you go over the break and you will be more likely to avoid pinching on the mouthpiece. Stick your stomach muscles out and the bass will probably start singing to you. Then you can "bottle that" and use it when moving across the break via the throat notes.
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Author: bob gardner
Date: 2000-12-01 14:41
Thanks for all of the great feedback. What you are telling me is right on. I would like to introduce my horn to Ken's because mine is named Butthead. I also believe that the bass is helping my playing of the normal clarinet (was going to say my Bb, but they are both Bb).
Anyhow i love the horn and find it a real joy. The main thing I like about the bass is that the fingering is the same as the normal.
I sold my sax because I didn't want to learn differant fingering.
Again thank you very much.
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Author: Ryan Simpson
Date: 2000-12-03 01:00
Ive got an r13 bass, and my bass is very picky about the alignment of the middle joints. The lower notes come out fine, no matter how i have the joints lined up, but with b,c,and d (just abouve the break), EXACT anlignment is very crucial. This might be what is troubling you.
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Author: bob gardner
Date: 2000-12-03 14:39
Ryan
Mine is a one piece bundy --selmer. I think the alignment is ok.
Thanks
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