 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: srattle
Date: 2009-09-23 13:31
Hi,
I have a question for people who know about repair. Two questions actually.
First, and most importantly, I've been having trouble with my bridge keys on both my A and Bb.
If I have it in the correct position (lined up) it works ok, but my 1+1 Bb doesn't speak at all, and I get some unwanted back pressure on my left hand from the rings.
If I rotate it one way, the back pressure is gone, but the Bb still doesn't work and I feel a loss of resonance in the instrument.
If I rotate it the other way, I get the Bb, and the resonance improves, but I lose most of the right hand notes (F and E are completely gone)
Is there a way to fix this so that I get everything that I want? I've taken it to 3 different techs. All of who I believe are proficient at their art, and this problem has never gone away, they have just managed to improve it a little, for a little while.
Second problem. I've had my clarinets for about 1.5 year, so relatively new. Bb RC Prestige, A is Vintage model. For some reason these instruments refuse to hold their adjustment. I have to take it in for fairly major work about 3 times a year, and should take it in for something small every month, or more. I have gotten very used to playing on these instruments in not particularly good working order.
Does anyone know why this is happen, or if there's anything I can do to improve this. My old instruments didn't seem to have this problem, so I don't think it is me. I try to take good care of my instruments.
It's really frustrating, please I could really use some advise. I've even thought about just giving up, and buying new instruments, but I really don't have the spare money around.
Thanks
Sacha
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-09-23 15:08
Set the long Bb linkage up so when the joints are lined up how you want them to be, when playing long Bb (xoo|xoo) there's more pressure on the LH2 ring key pad than the RH ring key pad.
Buffet use a very soft synthetic material for this linkage which isn't great, so replace it with something tougher - the only problem with a hard wearing material is key noise when you release LH2, so what I usually do is fit a piece of thin ultrasuede and to slightly over adjust the linkage (so there's more pressure on the LH2 ring key pad) which takes into account the compressiveness of the ultrasuede so the long Bb will still work, and there's no noise when releasing LH2.
Ideally the material should be hard like gasket cork if you don't mind the key noise.
If you are comfortable with bending the linkage to make it work, then do that - but don't take a pair of pliers to the linkage and start bending it around as you could mark the keywork. As the adjustment is small, you can bend the link (on the top joint) with your fingers or the heel of an old reed.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Steve L
Date: 2009-09-23 20:09
I didn't feel confident with bending any keys so I just put a small piece of ductape on the lower part of the bridge key. It was just thick enough to keep the top pad closed. Its been on a year now and hasn't moved.
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2009-09-24 16:08
The adjustment issue (long term adjustment) has more to do with the materials used for pads and dampers. Personally I much prefer cork pads in all but the last four at the bottom, the top pad of the lower joint and the pad inbetween the first and second fingers of the left hand (the last two because of the "One-and-One" Bb).
Cork will not move much at all so it holds steady to where the keys have been seated. As for the two pads for the "Bb," play the "One-and-one," while playing, press on the padded key below the index finger with the second finger of the left hand. As long as there is NO change in sound/resistance this is good. You must also check the sound of the clarion "F" to ensure that the linkage is NOT keeping the top pad of the lower joint from closing all the way.
I check more often than not by looking at the link holding it up to the light while holding down the two rings. You should not really see any light. But if you press directly upon the top pad while you do this, you should observe a sliver of light at the linkage. To adjust, I bend the linkage at the top joint UP if the top pad goes down too much, or DOWN (hold the linkage and press on the top key/pad).
And though I hate myself for even suggesting this (because I hate the sound you get with them), Valentino pads will hold adjustment and seal for a very long time...........at the cost of clarity to sound.
...............Paul Aviles
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-09-24 16:40
If you do feel you're able to bend the linkage, with the top joint only, hold the LH2 ring down (but not closed if you've got cork pads as that'll compress them) while pushing down on the linkage to bend it. Then put the joints together and check the long Bb.
If you do happen to compress a cork pad, they can be ironed back out again by warming up a pad iron and holding it against the face of the pad. Then let it cool down before trying it.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2009-09-25 04:59
Both problems you have really shouldn't happen with a good adjustment done by a good repairer. I don't know how likely it is that all the repairers you tried are not very good.... but everyhing's possible.
If the repairers tried to fix it by adjusting the bridge linkage, maybe there is an underlying problem, like one of the pads (or both) not sealing completely with a light touch, or free play in the hinges. "Adjusting" the linakge might not help if the mechanism that operates it is unstable.
I prefer it the opposite of Chris P. I prefer to have the top pad of the lower stack close with slightly more pressure than the upper stack pad that closes with it. For the bridge I prefer a stable, non-squishy material like rubber-cork or synthetic felt (the fomer is the most stable, the latter especailly has good stability considering how quiet it is).
Re your second problem, that depends. More than a few repairers claim Buffet now use pretty low quality pads. Are the problems you have related to pads tearing, or other problems with pads?
I can't be sure what you call "major work", but from what I can imagine, if your clarinet needs that several times a year, in addition to a small adjustment at least every month, then something is seriously wrong. There are some possibilties:
- You are doing something to cause to the clarinet to get out of adjustment. Some people constantly bump their clarinet and have keys bend, etc.
- An underlying problem that is never repaired. Sometimes these can be tricky, probably more likely you should try a another repairer.
- No underlying problem, but the repairs you have are just not good, and you need to find someone better.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2009-09-25 06:05
Often, there are additional problems associated with these two keys:
1. Sloppy pivots.
2. Pads closing at the 'back' before they close at the front, so that excessive finger pressure is needed for a seal at at the front.
It is not much use adjusting linkages until these two are right.
For whkat it is worth, personally I do not use springy materials such as ultrasuede in this linkage. It interferes with the idea of realable transfer of motion, hence closing force on pads.
I use composite cork, about 0.5 mm thick, or for a little more silence in the action, very firm synthetic felt, about the same thickness.
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