 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: yearsofwisdom
Date: 2009-06-08 03:03
Its a professional model. its better than most buffet r13s out there. now what model is it?? and what year??
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Author: Molloy
Date: 2009-06-08 13:52
Late 1940's, I think. A little web searching will easily turn up the list of Selmer Paris clarinet serial numbers and years of production. The usual list is dubious before 1940 but I think you can assume its dating of your N-series clarinet will be accurate.
Some Selmers are not marked as being of any particular model. People often call them "Brevete" or "Depose" depending on which of those words is marked on it -- yours will be a "Depose". Alternately, people refer to them by the digit at the beginning of the serial, so yours is an "N-series". Determining whether your clarinet is structurally identical to one of the named models, like maybe the 55, may be more than you can hope for. A look at the Selmer catalog from the appropriate year would be a good start.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-06-08 16:56
I've got two N-series Selmers - one of them (N69xx) has 19/7 keywork with the two part domed speaker bush which was paired with a P-series 'Centered Tone' A, and the other (N84xx) is a standard (17/6) 'Centered Tone' which has the hexagonal speaker bush.
Both are great clarinets and pack a lot of punch - the altissimo is so easy to produce on these which my teacher (a Buffet RC player) was envious about.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Clarence
Date: 2009-06-08 18:02
I have a Selmer 'Centered Tone' with the serial 'N76xx'. My favorite Bb Clarinet.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2009-06-08 18:44
My C T [marked as such] P97xx, 1956 is also a fine player as Chris described. It has the "hex" speaker bush giving a good/clear pinch Bb. I believe the previous Sels were known as Series 9 cls, so might your's be a late 9 or an early C T ?perhaps? Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: yearsofwisdom
Date: 2009-06-08 19:10
ahh so thats what the top of my clarinet says: despose. This is equivalant to todays best selmer professional model right? the signature model?
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2009-06-08 21:45
To ?clear-up the use by Selmer, and others, of the use of Depose and Brevette in their cl logos, the B referes to an actual [FR] patent issuance and Depose referers to depositing [filing] a patent application, as fer as I know. Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-06-08 23:02
Don, the Series 9 and 9* were the models that succeeded the CT - the BT and '55' were the models before the CT - although like most things, production of some models did overlap (until the previous model was discontinued), so at some point in time you'd have being made and sold both the BT and 55, the 55 and CT, the CT and Series 9/9*, the Series 9/9* and Series 10/10G, the Series 10 and Series 10S, the Series 10S and Series 10SII, etc in production.
At that time, Selmer were only producing the one pro level of clarinet - there wasn't an intermediate or prestige model until the Recital was launched (and later on the Prologue intermediate model), so I think you're wise in insuring it against a top model Selmer such as the Signature or even St. Louis model (though in my opinion, these older Selmers are far better).
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: yearsofwisdom
Date: 2009-06-09 02:27
ahh thats exactly what i heard!!!my selmer is better than all r13 store bought ones.
i just wanted to make sure that my instrument was a professional one
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Author: Jeroen
Date: 2009-06-09 08:35
Better? Well, the R13 is a very different instrument. For orchestral work I would certainly prefer an R13. The older Selmers are very good for jazz.
These older Selmers could be very fine instruments but many of them are detoriated by time. Unfortunately I've seen more nasty examples than good ones. I own a beautiful Selmer R I (Radio Improved) from 1930 with a surprising good quality of wood. I use this instrument for jazz only. For acoustic playing in ensembles and orchestras I miss some projection that e.g. Buffet and Wurlitzer can provide better.
Jeroen
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-06-09 10:18
Listen to recordings of the Boston Symphony Orchestra under Charles Munch - the principal clarinettist at this time (Gino Cioffi) played on large bore Selmers of this era and the rest of the section also played Selmers.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Jeroen
Date: 2009-06-09 10:56
Well, I did not say it is impossible to use the large bore Selmers in orchestra.
It can be done and it has been done.
But for me there are better working options, this is personal of course.
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Author: Molloy
Date: 2009-06-09 13:02
"my selmer is better than all r13 store bought ones"
That's a bit of a stretch... but I think you can confidently say your Selmer is *not worse* than an R13.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2009-06-09 13:04
Yer rite, Chris P, Series 9 etc came later, I should have said, "either a late B T, or an early C T" in my post above. Guess my "years of wisdom" have slipped ! Sorry, Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: yearsofwisdom
Date: 2009-06-10 02:24
well this is inspected by Al in CT idk his last name but he is one of the premier repairmen in this country. and he says its made of wood much better than buffet. and as for my own playing, i have no projection problems or antying. the sound of this selmer is onpar to many professionals.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-06-10 11:37
If only I could remember word for word what Artie Shaw mentioned in the TV documentary "Artie Shaw: Quest for Perfection", though it was along the lines of he played a Buffet in the Gramercy 5 as it was more 'intimate' sounding but played the Selmer with the big band 'cos it had more 'shout' to it.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2009-06-10 11:44)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-06-23 10:25
There is no direct equivalent if this clarinet on the market today as there's nothing being built like it, but insurance-wise I'd value it against the cost of a Selmer Arthea or even a Signature.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: yearsofwisdom
Date: 2009-06-23 17:10
w8 so ur saying its worth like 4000 dollars? orrr do u have a good estimate? or range
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Author: Koo Young Chung
Date: 2009-06-23 23:08
$2,200 would be too much for almost 70yrs old clarinet no matter how good it is (was).
Post Edited (2009-06-24 04:18)
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Author: susieray
Date: 2009-06-23 23:37
Sorry to burst your bubble, but as nice as it may be, it's does not have a lot of monetary value....it's still a very old clarinet and you really can't compare it with a new Selmer. I would think $600 to maybe $800 tops, and that's if it's in really good condition with new pads.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-06-24 08:42
Remember that insurance value is going to be a lot more than the resale value - best idea of that is by looking up similar clarinets listed on eBay to see how much they go for.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: yearsofwisdom
Date: 2009-06-26 04:56
wow.... i got ripped off by my own teacher.... she did include a buffet LP A clarinet though.
in a sense though, i guess this was the best option for me considering new instruments arnt as good in tone and wood and woodwork as this.
what are ur thoughts?
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2009-06-26 09:54
"in a sense though, i guess this was the best option for me considering new instruments arnt as good in tone and wood and woodwork as this. "
Those are my thoughts exactly - I'd rather buy an older Selmer and rebuild it than buy a brand new one (and rebuild it).
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Molloy
Date: 2009-07-03 02:41
"Sorry to burst your bubble, but as nice as it may be, it's does not have a lot of monetary value....it's still a very old clarinet and you really can't compare it with a new Selmer. I would think $600 to maybe $800 tops, and that's if it's in really good condition with new pads."
I'd consider $600 a bargain, if it's in excellent condition. $800 sounds more like what a vintage instrument dealer would ask. Sure, a Selmer of this vintage would only bring a few hundred at the auction site, then you'd spend another few hundred getting it overhauled and might end up with only about $500 invested, but when you go that route you're running a significant risk of getting a damaged or worn out instrument.
Online auctions are a good indicator of how much you might get if you try to sell your clarinet, but they're not a direct measure of what you should expect to pay for a clarinet in a hands-on, non-auction purchase.
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