 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2009-05-19 15:46
Some people are convinced that they can judge the playing quality of a cane reed by its appearance -- its cut, or color, or fiber pattern, or some combination thereof. I'm sceptical, so please permit me to propose an experiment that each of us can do at home:
Take a nice quantity of your current reeds, say, about twenty total. Mix them up randomly, then assign each a code number.
Without looking at them (as far as possible), play them and then set them down in order, ranked by best to worst (or segregate them into piles of "excellent", "good", "fair", and "poor", or whatever grading method you might have). Make a table of their playing 'rating' vs. code number.
Finally, after you've rated all twenty or so reeds 'blindfolded', mix them up again, then do a careful visual inspection of each, and make another table (vs. code number) of how the reeds 'look' to you.
Compare your visual observations to your playing ratings.
Report back to the forum with your findings. Good correlation? Slight? Statistically none?
The scientific world awaits your results with bated breath. Extra credit for calculating the correlation coefficient and/or standard deviation of your experiment (no cheating, Dr. Omar!).
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2009-05-19 16:37
Attachment: ttt-reed.jpg (18k)
The attached shingle is my current "good" reed.
It's not the first one that plays better than it looks...
--
Ben
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Author: johnniegoldfish
Date: 2009-05-19 17:13
I have found that when i am logging and we corral thelogs in the river to float down to the mill, I can pick the logs that will produce the reeds that will not only play perfectly, but will indeed outlast any others.
Of course this is after a few Vermont lagers and I am blind in one eye and don't see out of the other one real well.
But then again there are marsh reeds, oh be right back, time for meds
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2009-05-19 17:16
Thank you, johnnie, I'll "log" your results. So far we have two good data points for the research study. I believe I'm ready for that US Government grant now.......
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Author: justme
Date: 2009-05-19 20:41
David Spiegelthal said:
" Thank you, johnnie, I'll "log" your results. So far we have two good data points for the research study. I believe I'm ready for that US Government grant now......."
I think you have it pegged... ![[grin]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie5.gif)
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Author: sbrodt54
Date: 2009-05-20 00:01
David,
Through the years I have sold thousands of reeds and there have been quite a number of folks that need to look at the reeds before they buy them because they can pick out the best ones. They hold the reeds up to the light and judge them from there. I think it's mostly hooey but I smile and say, thank you for your patronage.
Around the year 1984 I started to ask each and every person that did this, what they are looking for in the reeds. Almost all of them had the same answer, I'm looking for the most even color, the perfect balance of thickness, the shape of the dark area near the heart to be a perfect arowhead.
I decided to take boxes of reeds home and do exactly what you're proposing, test them all and check them to see if the best playing reeds were also the best looking.
After about 100 reeds over the period of about two months, the results were the same every time, totally random.
I could not find any correlation between the color, tip, heart, balance or any other aspect of visual inspection and the playability of the reed. Some that were great looking did play well and some that were horrible and didn't match any pattern that I was looking for played just as well. Some of those that fit the perfect profile played very poorly, it was an interesting experiment.
I don't tell customers that I think they are wasting their time by looking at the reeds, I just buy them by the box and play test them before I toss them out or place them on a podium and pray to them at night.
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2009-05-20 01:35
I have very good success knowing the way a reed will respond with visual and physical inspection like bending it in my fingers to feel the way it flexes. I have also noticed that 'good' reeds have a certain 'crisp' sound when if flick the bark with my nail.
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Author: C2thew
Date: 2009-05-20 05:44
it's more of experience when it comes down to subjectively anticipating a reed, however even the pros work on their reeds.
the basic steps is
1) holding the reed to the light to see a good balance in wood density with a almost "n" like curve
2) stress test: holding the reed with one hand, and pressing the tip lightly with a finger, you can determine the resistance of where the wood is and how you need to balance.
3) look: arrowhead design
4) seal: moistening the reed with some saliva, place the reed on a flat surface such as glass or a piano to see if the reed warps or not. if it adheres to the surface while hugging the flat surface, your good to go.
5) Play test the reed
6) make adjustments using a knife.
Repeat
Our inventions are wont to be pretty toys, which distract our attention from serious things. they are but improved means to an unimproved end, an end which was already but too easy to arrive as railroads lead to Boston to New York
-Walden; Henry Thoreau
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Author: JWBLennon
Date: 2009-05-23 01:18
I love that!!!!LOL I am going to have to work up a good way to like test reeds now!!!LOL I doubt Marshalls Music will like that but heck what they do not know wont hurt them!
How big of a difference does the brand of the reed make? I see reads come in all price ranges! Also do they dry out and go bad becasue I often see New Old Stock on online auctions for case's of reeds? Can these old reeds still be used?
Life is hard so play hard!
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Author: Alfred
Date: 2009-05-23 02:57
justme said:
"I think you have it pegged... "
Wood you stop making puns, please? d:
Me. I go by taste and appearance when I'm trying candidates, or to clarify, I try the ones that look and taste the best. Of course, I go by sound when I'm wrong most of the time...
Post Edited (2009-05-23 02:57)
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Author: Pam H.
Date: 2009-05-23 15:10
I guess I should start praying for the reeds then instead of just hoping for mostly usable ones per box. ;-)
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Author: L. Omar Henderson
Date: 2009-05-24 02:14
(Disclaimer - I sell Xilema and Gonzalez reeds)
I guess that I am a sucker for any scientific testing but, I also grow my own cane and make reeds so I may be a ringer in the contest.
I can choose a nicely playable reed 70 +% of the time by looking at it with back lighting - they won't let me look at reeds any more at the local music store because I only leave bad ones left to sell!
L. Omar Henderson
www.doctorsprod.com
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Author: rsholmes
Date: 2009-05-24 21:35
Hmm, I notice several people here claiming they can spot good reeds visually -- but none who have proved it by performing the suggested experiment and reporting the results.
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Author: cxgreen48
Date: 2009-05-25 01:40
I have similar reed experiences as David.
The reeds that look good almost always play and sound better after adjusting.
The reeds that look bad will play better after adjusting, but usually don't sound as good as the better looking reeds. The sound is usually dull with a little airyness to it.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2009-05-27 01:29
I don't have to do that to know that that method doesn't really work half the time. I've had many great reeds that I would have tossed if I used the look and see method instead of simply playing them for five seconds.
When I was a student Joe Allard took me on a short tour of the music stores on 48th St. in New York when there were a dozen stores on one block. Back then they let you pick over opened boxes of Vandoren reeds. Joe took me from one store to another showing me how to choose the best reeds by color, grain etc. After about an hour or so I had about four dozen reeds, almost two boxes back in the late 50s. They came 25 in a box back then, about $2.50 - $3.00 a box. Sad isin't it, we didn't get any more good reeds from the box of 25 then we do now from a box of 10. Anyway, I thought I had great reeds for years but the majority of them were no better then the average reed in a new box. I kind of remember getting 5-6 decent reeds from my "hand picked" 48-50. If you don't know, Joe Allard was a respected clarinet, bass clarinet and saxophone teacher who taught at Julliard and freelanced with the NBC Symphony, Radio City Music Hall orchestra, commercial recordings etc. ESP http://eddiesclarinet.com
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Author: johnniegoldfish
Date: 2009-05-27 13:26
I have had my clarinet for about 8 years, doews this mean i am supposed to change the reed that came with it?
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2009-05-27 13:41
If you're happy with how it plays and how it looks, why bother?
(I always giggle when browsing That Auction Site and the description for some "Vintage Clarinet" reads: "The little wood piece that goes on one end looks damaged and might have to be repaired")
--
Ben
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2009-05-27 14:38
When I was in college (not as a music major, but playing in a number of musical ensembles) the professor of clarinet there used to brag about playing the same reed for months before changing it. And guess what? He sounded horrible -- spitty, fuzzy, nasty tone. Good technique though, and because he was a super-nice guy nobody had the heart to tell him how bad he sounded on his grungy old reeds.
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Author: stimsonaa
Date: 2009-05-27 18:43
Alfred (et al),
I think it's an excellent idea to bring some mathematical precision to the clarinet world...
Just don't forget to practice your LogaRhythmic Scale!
<ducks and waits for flying objects to cease>
Albert Stimson
Midwest Musical Imports
www.mmimports.com
albert@mmimports.com
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