 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: pelo_ensortijado
Date: 2009-01-21 18:22
hi
in the college where im studying the woodwindplayers like to tell eachother how much they have practiced during the day. i guess its the same everywhere?
everyday i hear my fellow clarinetists say " today ive only played for 6 hours."
and i just dont understand how they do it!!!!
a good day i manage 3,5 hours practicing(210 min. pretty much the same every day). its not that im getting tired. there just isnt time enough in the day!!
im in my practicingroom before 07.30 every morning and never leaves before 20.00! (first in, last out of the clarinets. allways!)
there is lunch and dinner. and 15-20 min break every 45 min.
then there is lessons and homeworks and concerts and all the other stuff that one need to do( that i dont. like shopping and cleaning.
they do all of above(cleaning as well!) and STILL have time to practice 6 hours...
my questions are:
how do you guys/gals measuring the time in the practicingroom? and how much do you practice each day?
how do you schedual(sp?) your days?
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Author: bmcgar ★2017
Date: 2009-01-21 18:56
Not answering your question, but when my students tell me how many hours they've played in a day, my response is, "But how many hours have you *practiced*?"
- "Playing" isn't the same as "practicing."
- The amount of time practicing is nearly irrelevant compared to how, and how efficiently, you practice.
B.
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Author: pelo_ensortijado
Date: 2009-01-21 19:12
all true. but when (allmost)all time is effective and the only thing there is, is to increase the amount of time to practice?
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Author: pelo_ensortijado
Date: 2009-01-21 19:26
also very true. but i just thought precious time was lost as everyone else is getting. like: what am i doing wrong to get so few hours out of it?
i know its not about hours. but still if you practice 2 hours or 4 hours does make a difference!!!
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Author: MBrad
Date: 2009-01-21 19:29
The best advice I ever received was to try and play for at least 20 minutes every day otherwise your embouchure starts to get out of shape. 20 minutes is usually a convenient amount of time to do long tones, major and minor, whole tone, chromatic, and diminished scales. Time allowing I will add excercises by in the order of my personal priority: staccato, sixths and octaves (slowly), sight-reading, Klosé excercises, etc.
It's different for everybody. I've noticed especially with warm ups and technical excercises that we all have different things we like to refresh and warm up each day. I think it's important to make this the most versatile practice time.
Besides: if you only have two hours that day to practice you can still get in a solid foundation and have time for learning music if you say something like "Ok, I'm just going to do all the minor scales slowly, since I have three pieces to learn for rehearsals on Friday". With 24 hours in a day you might find yourself after supper with a bit of bonus time to do more. Organizing the time you have available is far more important than the raw number of hours. If you take a moment to set some goals then it's likely you'll get more done with two or three hours than with six.
This has become crucial for me now that I have finished school and have to deal with an extremely variable schedule--balancing part-time work with rehearsals, looking for students and gigs, working on reeds, getting in some solid practice time, and trying to have a life, too!
I don't think I ever met a clarinetist who admitted to *practicing* six hours a day unless I suspected they were trying to show off..with my pacing and breaks it'd probably take me 9 hours to get in six hours of practice. If you factor in rehearsals, you could easily blow your chops away!
Post Edited (2009-01-21 19:32)
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Author: clariknight
Date: 2009-01-21 20:22
I try to fit in about 2-3 hours a day. I agree with you, though, there just isn't enough time in the day. I have school from 7:30 in the morning until 2, and then I go to work around 4, which means I have to leave for the bus stop around 3:15. I have 1.5 hours during the school day in which I can practice, but still, 6 hours a day would be impossible. Hopefully when I go to college my schedule will allow more practice time.
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2009-01-21 21:28
niclas wrote:
all true. but when (allmost)all time is effective and the only thing there is, is to increase the amount of time to practice?
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I'd say that it takes a long time before you get to the point where your sessions can't be any more effective. In my experience, thinking that *all* my time is effective is often a sign that I should try doing things differently. I often thought I was having very effective practice sessions, then learned another technique which would greatly improve things, sometimes cutting in half the time I would have spent otherwise.
That said, I go crazy if I practice more than a couple hours at a time (with breaks).
If people are going for high estimates of how long they practice, they're likely including the time it took to get settled, put together their clarinets, fuss with reeds, pace around, think about the music, answer the cell phone, take breaks, etc. that occur during "practice time". If they're bragging about how long they've played, they probably include how long they've been in rehearsal, even if much of the time was spent resting.
People also probably round up, and make broad estimates.
In my undergrad, one year my Thursdays consisted of conducting class from 9:30 to 10:45 (in which we played as the orchestra for each other), practice mixed with lunch from 11 to 1, wind symphony rehearsal from 1 to 3:15 (with a 20 minute break), then dinner and hanging out in the practice rooms, maybe practicing some, until another ensemble from 6 to 7:45 or thereabouts. Since a *lot* of that time was spent playing, by 8:00 I felt that I had been playing pretty much straight since 9:30 in the morning. I was probably only playing for 4 hours, but I would have estimated it at 6-8 because I was doing playing-related stuff for at least that long.
These days, I'm lucky to get 2 hours per day, though I expect that number to jump once I start grad school.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: Nessie1
Date: 2009-01-22 08:13
I agree with many of the other posters - there are those who practise for two hours a day who get a lot more done and attain a much higher standard than others who practise for six because they have used the time wisely, practising the right things in the right way rather than fooling around with pieces they already know well or in ways that won't really get their performance better.
Also, at college, if you're going to do well you have to keep up with other commitments and courses which you obviously are but may be these other people aren't.
In the final analysis, ask yourself what you think of their performances, their technique, their musicality and how it compares to yours. Don't let yourself be put off by their claims if you think you are doing what's going to work for you.
Vanessa.
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Author: mrn
Date: 2009-01-22 12:50
Three things: 1.) It's not how many hours you practice--it's the results that count. 2.) Different people require different amounts of practice to get the same results (some of us can accomplish more with less). 3.) There is a law of diminishing returns with practice--at some point fatigue will limit your effectiveness.
My advice: Do what works for you. Don't worry about everyone else.
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Author: Lelia Loban ★2017
Date: 2009-01-22 13:07
>>People also probably round up, and make broad estimates.
>>
That's a kind and generous way of putting it. People also flat-out lie, one-upping one another in a competitive environment where students eye each rival jealously while judging worthiness, diligence and so forth.
Lelia
http://www.scoreexchange.com/profiles/Lelia_Loban
To hear the audio, click on the "Scorch Plug-In" box above the score.
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Author: pelo_ensortijado
Date: 2009-01-22 18:37
what i ment was IF i practice with most effectiveness, which im probably dont even if it feels like it, then how should i do to get the extra hours in there?
i shure need them. i never manage to do all the etudes and stuff i are suppose to, not properly anyway. i dont have time cause there is so much to do, and im a slower reader than average(have a "earbased" childhood), but i cant practice that any more than i do right now. its just gonna take the time it takes. meanwhile i have to practice more hours to get the work done.
but i dont seem to be able to. even if everyone else is(supposedly) doing alot more than me and still have "evenings of".
so, how do you guys schedual a practiceday? how much, and what before and after lunch etc?
edit: i probably should have named the thread "increasing practicing time" or something. sorry. my english isnt the best. im doing the best i can though...
Post Edited (2009-01-22 19:05)
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2009-01-22 19:17
If you're spending three and a half hours a day and feel like that isn't nearly enough, then you'll probably get a LOT more mileage out of new practice techniques than just throwing more time at it. Has your private teacher given you advice for *how* to practice, or just *what* to practice?
In my experience, practicing well is an extremely taxing undertaking, somewhat physically but especially mentally. If I've been at it for more than an hour straight and don't need to take a break to recover, I haven't been doing it effectively. (taking breaks is a necessity anyways, to avoid repetitive strain injuries) So I'd argue that nobody out there practices with the greatest possible effectiveness, though some are closer than others.
If you want more hours, you'll just have to find something in your day that you're currently doing and stop doing it. In college, I never had the problem of finding more time to practice, only of being distracted during the hours I was in the practice rooms. The practice room area doubled as our social hangout, so I'd be there as many as 6, 8, even 10 hours many days, though only a few of those were spent actually practicing. If friends were around, I'd chat. If they weren't, I'd practice... facing the window meant I was interruptible, facing away meant I wanted to be left alone.
In my experience, a performer who thinks they are doing everything they can musically is the one who isn't, and just doesn't know it.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: tdinap
Date: 2009-01-23 04:10
As a non-music major, this is a bit skewed, but it's happened to me more than once: when discussing practice time with a teacher, I said that I had been managing about 1.5-2 hours per day and was trying to fit in more, and was told that what I was doing was plenty and I shouldn't worry about doing more. Again, it's possible they just don't expect much of a non-major, but it seemed as if they wouldn't tell any of their students to try practicing 6 hours a day (in fact, in one case I was studying music exclusively at the time anyway, so my major shouldn't matter much).
Also, with practice room space as limited as it is in many conservatories, I don't see how they could expect you to play that much. Perhaps it would be useful to make attempt to do so, but it's not terribly realistic in many places unless you're practicing elsewhere.
Another interesting question to ask is how much actual physical, note-producing time is realistic to expect of oneself in a day? Obviously stamina can be built up over time, but I would assume there is a limit at some point.
Tom
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Author: pelo_ensortijado
Date: 2009-01-23 05:03
EEBaum wrote(i dont know how to quote. help.
In my experience, a performer who thinks they are doing everything they can musically is the one who isn't, and just doesn't know it.
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i didnt say that. im sorry if i express myself badly.
i was talking about not be able to do any more about the reading JUST NOW!
i do sightreading, etudes and the general clarinet repertoir. learning to read notes is a big part of the day as it gonna get, which is about 1,5/3hours.
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EEBaum wrote:
Has your private teacher given you advice for *how* to practice, or just *what* to practice
yes he has. and the fact is that we do have so much to do in one week that its barely is manageble, but i allways have to give up some stuff, or do some of it a little bit less good than the other.
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EEBaum wrote:
In my experience, practicing well is an extremely taxing undertaking, somewhat physically but especially mentally. If I've been at it for more than an hour straight and don't need to take a break to recover, I haven't been doing it effectively.
"more than an hour" is to much. our doctors at school recommends maximum 45 min. and i never do more, nor have the mental strenght to.
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tdinap wrote:
Another interesting question to ask is how much actual physical, note-producing time is realistic to expect of oneself in a day? Obviously stamina can be built up over time, but I would assume there is a limit at some point.
that what i ment by practicing time. a allways meassure the time i actually practice and not the time inbetween...
then maybe someone knows some good excercises to increase the "physical note-producing time"?
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Author: mrn
Date: 2009-01-23 09:20
Ahhh! I think I see what you're saying! You play by ear and are now getting used to sightreading in music school. I had a friend in high school, a very talented pianist, who was like this. He later went on to get a Master's degree in music (in conducting, I think).
If you are limited in the amount of time you can practice, this is what I would do: Take your sheet music wherever you go, even if you don't have your clarinet with you. When you have a spare minute, pull it out, read the notes, and as you read the notes, imagine the finger movements associated with the notes. Think about what those movements feel like as you imagine yourself playing the music. In other words, mentally practice your part.
I do this quite a bit, myself, as my practice time is very limited. You might be surprised how well it works. It's not a substitute for real practice with the instrument, but I find that it helps me get mentally prepared for my real practice so that I spend my practice time more efficiently.
Scientists say that the right side of your brain (which is the visual/spatial side of the brain) tends to work in the background to solve problems even when you are not aware of it. I like to think that my little mental practice trick is a way of reminding your right brain to keep practising music even when you're off doing other things. I can't prove that that's what happens, but it seems likely, given that this works as well as it does for me. Even with the instrument in hand, practice is a mental game, after all. Hope this helps you!
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Author: Brenda ★2017
Date: 2009-01-24 14:02
Michael, This is very true! When travelling on the plane or train I've taken my music with me and 'practiced' it as you said. With a pencil and a good eraser in hand you can indicate where certain passages are exactly the same as previously in the piece, so you learn those passages only once instead of imagining that each repitition is new.
You can identify scale or chord patterns. (In one piece my teacher said that most of his students struggled with a specific run, whereas I didn't have a problem with it. But that was because I'd taken the time to realize that the run was actually a D minor scale, just that the run began partway through the scale. This was a pattern that the fingers already knew so no more thought had to be given it.)
A portion could be a chromatic scale up to a point, so you can pencil in a dash at the point when it departs from being chromatic. That leaves the concious brain available for anticipating the upcoming pattern while the fingers follow the learned chromatic pattern. You can sing it to yourself in your head and imagine what changes in tempo you want and pencil that in, subject to change once you actually play it.
Of course research has shown that while you sleep things can "mature" in your brain. So the expression of "sleeping on it" means a lot. Any meaningful practicing of the piece or portions thereof are only enhanced with sleep. Maybe you can count your sleep as practice time?!!
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