 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: marshall
Date: 2008-11-30 07:53
I've had my R13 Bb for a few years now. It's not the best instrument in the world (I was only 16 when I picked it out and didn't really know how to choose a good instrument), but thusfar it has served it's purpose very well. That being said, the more I play and the better I get, the more frustrated I'm getting with my instrument. It's not in tune, it's not even as far as resistance goes, it feels unfocused and unrefined, it's hard to get the sound I want out of it, and I sometimes feel that it's keeping me from progressing at the rate at which I should be. Whenever I'm talking to fellow clarinetists about our instruments, I get extremely weird looks because I like playing my A clarinet so much more than my Bb, mostly because its a significantly better instrument. Now, that alone is fine, I'm able to cope with that. I'm still improving as a player and I know that. But it's already not the best instrument ever, and in the past six to twelve months I've been noticing that I'm having to get it worked on more and more. It seems as if this instrument just cannot hold a repair. Every time I get the keys adjusted because they're too 'clicky' or have spring rates adjusted, it seems like it goes back to being clicky and uncomfortable to play. Also, there's an issue with the F#/C# key. It always feels spongy, and there's nothing I can have done with the spring tension to fix it. We decided that the hole for the pin on one of the keys wasn't machined straight when it was manufactured, and as a result the key feels way too resistant. I know that this can't just be psychological, because my A clarinet doesn't feel like this, and every other instrument I play doesn't have this issue. My question is thus: is it worth sending my instrument off to have it worked on by one of the "best" techs if it won't hold a repair? Will someone like Tim Clark or Mike Hammer be able to work on it in a way that it will hold the repair better than someone else? Is it worth pouring as much money into this instrument as I am? I know in the past year or two I've already put about as much money into repairing the instrument as I initially spent on the instrument (back before they were $3,000), is it worth the headache/price of seeing if one of the more nationally known techs can fix this? Is it worth putting this much money into it? Or should I just start shopping for a new instrument?
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2008-11-30 10:59
Firstly, the instrument should hold mechanical repair. Any R13 made in the past few years is made with good materials and should not fall out of adjustment as quickly as you say.
The spongy F#/C# is a common but not unfixable problem as you describe. If the hole for the pin (LH key) was indeed not made properly there are ways to fix it. If your tech just says, "Oh, well!", then you have the wrong repair tech.
If the sound is "just not quite right no matter what I do", then maybe a different instrument is in order- the mechanical aspect should not be a question.
Send it to a different repair tech.
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2008-11-30 11:36
I have always had good luck on having my instruments repaired by Eric Satterlee of Meridian Winds in the Lansing area. Although Eric usually first says "Let me look at the clarinet and see what is wrong" then sitting at the bench with him is always a way to get all the little things you are concerned about fixed.
I'd call an make an appointment when you can sit be with him while he works. If you are in school, the holiday vacation would seem like an ideal time to do this.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2008-11-30 13:14
If you send it to Hammer, make sure that one of his cronies doesn't do the work instead. He has several of them at his shop.
They did significant damage to a student of mine's Sax neck.
1964 Mark VI nonetheless.
(melted or scraped off the plating near the cork from either a solvent or flame)
Hammer himself wouldn't have done something that stupidly careless.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: clarinetguy ★2017
Date: 2008-11-30 13:23
I agree with the recommendation to go to Meridian Winds. You can tell from the moment you walk through the door that they really know what they're doing.
You mentioned an unfocused and unrefined sound out of your R13, along with intonation issues. I had similar problems with mine. I think another barrel and possibly a new mouthpiece might help. I replaced both on mine, and it did make a difference. Eric Satterlee has a nice selection of mouthpieces and barrels in his store, and it's worth giving them a try.
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Author: awm34
Date: 2008-11-30 13:56
I can also recommend Ko Kaiden who set up shop in Ann Arbor this past summer. His work on my 10G was exemplary: the before/after difference was stunning as was his work on my Preufer A. His phone is 734-222-5153.
Alan Messer
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Author: pewd
Date: 2008-11-30 15:39
I'm going to be contrarian.
Marshall, play test some new instruments - 5,10 of them.
If you find one you like better, sell yours and get a new one.
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2008-11-30 16:06
Have the offending springs replaced. If your local tech is just bending a bad spring, it doesn't fix it. As well, your tone holes could have various abnormalities that can be fixed which would prevent a tight seal.
New horns are great, but you would still need some work done even to a new instrument.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2008-11-30 16:34
I know many players “send their instruments out” for repair. I won’t ever recommend someone do that. You must be able to sit with the tech and show them what you want and you MUST be able to play it when you pick it up to make sure it’s exactly what you want. My suggestion is to go to one of the techs recommended in your area, it would be a lot less costly too. Ask them if they can fix the problems, perhaps even an overhaul. Then try different barrels, try several different manufactures. I use and love the Backuns but there are many other good brands too. The barrel can make a huge difference in resistance, tone and intonation. I wish you lived near me, I use a fantastic repairman. ESP
www.peabody.jhu.edu/457 Listen to a little Mozart, live performance
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Author: marshall
Date: 2008-11-30 20:22
I've been going to Eric Satterlee for a few years now and thusfar have been very happy with is work. It's just that this instrument doesn't seem to be able to hold a repair and I simply can't afford to go up there once every other month to get a few spring tensions and key alignments adjusted. Maybe next time I go up I'll try a few of his (thousands of) Festivals...and whatever he has in the way of R13s.
Post Edited (2008-11-30 20:23)
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Author: rtmyth
Date: 2008-11-30 22:54
I agree with Ed. There is no substitute for your being there. I think of Mclane, one of the best, who spent much time with his technician.
richard smith
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2008-11-30 22:55
He should *change* the springs.
Reheating last week's pizza for the 3rd time will not make it fresh.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2008-12-01 10:27
Re Buffet F#/C# springs...
They have a sluggish feel in the way they work because they are too short for their diameter. This means they have excessively high stiffness, i.e. the resistance they offer to your finger increases too much during the travel of the key. This = "sluggish feel". Shame on Buffet to perpetuate this scruffy design for decades!
This key's spring is often additionally sluggish because the tip operates against timber, in a place where you cannot see. The tip of the spring very likely wears away the timber, and then, when you operate the key, the tip of the spring pushes against a tiny 'cliff' at the end of this worn groove, offering unwanted extra resistance to the key's motion.
One solution that deals with the latter and part of the former is to cut an appropriate spring groove (or hole)in the base of the post itself, and install a slightly longer spring, so that the tip of the spring operates against metal.
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Author: DAVE
Date: 2008-12-01 12:47
Gordon,
Are there other manufacturers that use the same spring set up as Buffet's? Like Yamaha or LeBlanc?
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2008-12-02 10:45
I don't think so. They all sensibly mount the spring in the post.
But having said that, I have seen clarinets made with the spring mounted on the key, but operating against metal associated with the post, apparently original configuration.
Perhaps Buffet used to do that at at time when they had a mechanical engineer somehow associated with the factory, and the system has become corrupted since.
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