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 Pretty pictures
Author: Tony Pay 2017
Date:   2008-09-07 15:10

I found this link on Clair:

http://anticwindbooks.chez-alice.fr/clarinet/clarinet.html

....and thought it worth reposting here.

I'm not sure how accurate the labels are -- under alto1 the clarinet marked 'dolling' is one that I own, and it's just a normal A clarinet of around 1850 that was extended down to low C by Ted Planas. Beautiful instrument, of course...

Also, Alan Hacker's modified modern clarinet appears too, but labelled 'pianas' -- which is a typo for 'Planas' I imagine.

Tony

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: stevensfo 
Date:   2008-09-07 15:15

That is an amazing website. Thanks.

I see there's an oboe section as well!

Steve

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: Mark Charette 2017
Date:   2008-09-07 15:23

You might also enjoy

http://www.avrahm-galper.woodwind.org/Pictures/

Unfortunately all I had was an inexpensive digital camera and Abe Galper wasn't feeling all that good at the time so we didn't have time for multiple pictures or pictures of everything he had collected.

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: Ken Shaw 2017
Date:   2008-09-07 16:51

Tony -

A thousand thanks for finding these photos, which were on a defunct French site that was only partly captured by the Internet Archive.

Most photos on the top level link to a dozen or more similar items.

The French site had a poor reputation among scholars, since it misidentified several instrument makers and included some instruments that are not clarinets (an alto Heckelphone, for example, which exists only as a single example in the Heckel workshop). There's was a good discussion of the site on the Yahoo Early Clarinet board a few years ago. See http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/EarlyClarinet/message/741, for example.

Ken Shaw

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: rsholmes 
Date:   2008-09-07 17:36

The "alto heckelphone" pictures now are at http://anticwindbooks.chez-alice.fr/clarinet/claheck/claheck.html. The instrument shown has a single reed mouthpiece so in fact is not a heckelphone. It looks like a heckelphone-clarinet, which despite the name is essentially a wooden soprano saxophone with clarinet-like fingering -- see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heckelphone-Clarinet. Apparently a dozen or so were made.

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: Don Berger 
Date:   2008-09-07 19:09

Yes indeed, Tony, many TKS, will need a few hours to look-at/admire these Golden Oldies. Also TKS to our several woodwind historians for the sites posted here. A Keeper, GBK ? Are these available to the Yahoos, Early Clarinet, Early Flute etc groups? What "Sights" ! Don

Thanx, Mark, Don

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: clarnibass 
Date:   2008-09-08 05:26

Is this one your signature clarinet, and did the other letter clarinets not survive?
http://anticwindbooks.chez-alice.fr/clarinet/bhsqu/bhsqu.html

:)

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: Lelia Loban 2017
Date:   2008-09-08 11:46

Thanx for the links! On the French site, among the fascinating variants I've never seen before, if anyone knows more about bass clarinet no. 12, labelled "papalini," or has played on it, I'd love to see a thread about it. It looks as if it swallowed the python that swallowed the cat that swallowed the rat that swallowed the mouse that swallowed the frog that swallowed the beetle that swallowed the ant. I'm also especially curious about basset horn no. 13, labelled "eisenmenger." Looks as if somebody anticipated the Cubists....

Lelia
http://www.scoreexchange.com/profiles/Lelia_Loban
To hear the audio, click on the "Scorch Plug-In" box above the score.

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: rsholmes 
Date:   2008-09-08 13:47

There's an article on that basset horn:

The Basset Horn of J. G. Eisenmenger
Nicholas Shackleton and Keith Puddy
The Galpin Society Journal, Vol. 38, (Apr., 1985), pp. 139-142

Academics with access to JSTOR can read that on line.

As for the Papalini bass, go to:

http://www.mfa.org/index.asp

and search for 'papalini'. For some reason their photo doesn't come up this morning, though.

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: Ken Shaw 2017
Date:   2008-09-09 16:38

Lelia -

Al Rice wrote some excellent postings about the Papalini serpentine bass clarinets on the Early Clarinet board. http://launch.groups.yahoo.com/group/EarlyClarinet/msearch?query=papalini&submit=Search&charset=ISO-8859-1.

I've looked closely at the one in the Metropolitan Museum instrument collection, and it looks nearly impossible to play, with huge, widely separated finger holes, including several that have to be covered by the knuckles.

The Boston Museum instrument is at http://www.mfa.org/collections/search_art.asp?coll_keywords=papalini and there are several examples at http://anticwindbooks.chez-alice.fr/clarinet/clarbas12/clarbas12.html, although the photos are all flopped.

Ken Shaw

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: Lelia Loban 2017
Date:   2008-09-10 11:58

Thanx for the additional links. Fascinating! I think Papalini must have made that serpentine bass for one of the aliens in the "Men in Black" movies. Covering the keys with the knuckles? Uh, what kinds of knuckles did he have in mind? Yeah, he must've made that clarinet for a cephalopod.

I'm curious to see what will show up in the Smithsonian's Museum of American History now that it's opening again, after an extensive remodelling job. The musical instruments exhibit (containing a lot of non-American instruments, too) suffered for years, sometimes closed and sometimes shuffled between tossed-together temporary quarters, before the museum closed for this big re-do that should make much more efficient use of the space. It bugged me to see the instruments jammed into out-of-the-way corners or taken off display while vast open areas, suitable for pretty much nothing, just sat there.

Lelia
http://www.scoreexchange.com/profiles/Lelia_Loban
To hear the audio, click on the "Scorch Plug-In" box above the score.

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: Lelia Loban 2017
Date:   2008-09-11 12:15

Someone e-mailed me last night to point out that I've seen a wooden intestine by Papalini:

http://test.woodwind.org/Databases/Klarinet/2000/12/000285.txt

I'd completely forgotten this visit to a Boston museum in 2000!

Lelia
http://www.scoreexchange.com/profiles/Lelia_Loban
To hear the audio, click on the "Scorch Plug-In" box above the score.

Post Edited (2008-09-11 12:16)

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: Chris P 
Date:   2008-09-12 18:37

I've seen photos of flutes and more recently oboes with the flap-style keywork, but this is the first instance of clarinets I've seen fitted with it.

http://anticwindbooks.chez-alice.fr/clarinet/clar15/clar15.html

I assume the flaps all close above the one that's being held closed.

I'm looking for photos of flutes built with this mechanism as some had end-blown headjoints (like a shakuhachi).

Found the headjoint type, but not the flappy keywork: http://memory.loc.gov/cgi-bin/map_item.pl?data=/home/www/data/service/music/dcmflute/0100/0179f1.jp2&itemLink=r?ammem/dcm:@field(NUMBER+@band(0179+dcmflute))&title=DCM+0179:+++Maino+%26+Orsi+/+Flute+in+C&style=dcmflute&legend=

Chris.

Post Edited (2008-09-12 18:48)

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: rsholmes 
Date:   2008-09-12 19:23

I believe they're called "Giorgi-Schaffner" flutes. I've not found much information about them.

There's one in this picture:

http://rsholmes.smugmug.com/photos/85534313_dwuBa-O.jpg

If you're using a browser such as Firefox that scales the photo to fit the window, click on the picture to get the full size version in order to see any detail. Some end blown simple flutes there too, and other oddballs. Photo taken at the Bate Collection in Oxford, 2006.

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: rsholmes 
Date:   2008-09-12 19:38

Looking in Google Books for Schaffner instruments information I found a very brief bit about Schaffner clarinets here:

http://books.google.com/books?id=Hnh0G2wrJvsC&pg=PA295&dq=schaffner+flute&as_brr=3&ei=-cLKSJm4CqW0zAS0kaHpDA&sig=ACfU3U02ZnL9LF_LvSK1BWagCL8AAH9BjA#PPA295,M1

or

http://tinyurl.com/4u3lrc

after which is a description and photo of one of the weirdest instruments I've seen -- or is it two of the weirdest? A combination violin and clarinet.

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: Chris P 
Date:   2008-09-12 19:47

Making the links clickable:

http://rsholmes.smugmug.com/photos/85534313_dwuBa-O.jpg

http://tinyurl.com/4u3lrc Go to page 296 for violin/clarinet combo

Cheers! Some strange goings on there!

Chris.

Post Edited (2008-09-13 23:29)

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: Brenda Siewert 
Date:   2008-09-13 21:00

magnificent.

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 Re: Pretty pictures
Author: D Dow 
Date:   2008-09-16 21:55

Excellent pics.

David Dow

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