 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: MsNomer
Date: 2008-08-19 21:47
My daughter is starting her 3rd year in band (8th grade) and she absolutely loves playing her clarinet.
We've been renting one but since it seems she really is interested in continuing to play, I think it's time to break down and buy one for her.
I would greatly appreciate any advice you would be willing to pass on.
We are looking for a general all-around good instrument that will see her through at least high school and possibly college.
Thank you all so much,
Lisa
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Author: Jacob S
Date: 2008-08-19 23:22
I am going into 11th grade now, and I've had an E11 for the last 3 years. Before that, I played on a plastic clarinet of an unknown brand. It's a great instrument for the price, in my opinion! We got it new for $800 at a local music store, because someone had ordered it and flaked out. I've had no problems other than typical aging of pads, which needed repair.
Lately I've been talking to my private instructor about upgrading, but when trying her R13's (One I think is a Prestige?), the tonal qualities and ease of articulation didn't seem to match up with the price difference, at least for a high school student.
The barrel that comes with it is not my favorite, but as time goes by things like the barrel and mouthpiece can be upgraded accordingly.
I really like my E-11, as you probably can tell. I've heard other people praising the Ridenour clarinets and R-13, but I have never played a Ridenour, and the R-13 is out of my price range.
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2008-08-19 23:43
I play both the Ridenour Lyrique and Buffet's R13. The R13 new is around $2700. The Lyrique is about $1000.
I cannot recommend for any of my students to invest in an R13 when the Lyrique compares quite favorably with a much more modest investment. Money is quite dear for most of my students currently.
Were I you I would order a Lyrique and have her teacher (or arrange for a teacher) to try it out for their professional opinion. Unless your daughter already is dead set on studying music professionally...then go for the Buffet.
If her ability and interest grows you will be could upgrade to a Buffet years from now.
James
PS: You should also investigate buying a used R13...but without the guidance of a professional this can be a risky investment for novices.
Gnothi Seauton
Post Edited (2008-08-19 23:45)
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Author: William
Date: 2008-08-19 23:52
As a Buffet R13 player, when my daughter when into 7th grade and we had to purchase her a clarinet of her own, I opted for the Buffet E11. She played all through high school and into college with it, but did not pursue music as a career--so there was no need to 'upgrade' to a pro level instrument. I always considered to E11 to be an amatures lifetime instument and she continues to play (with me :>) in our Muni Band. For the money, it is one of the best clarinets on the market and will retain its resale value if you need to upgrade to the R13 later on.
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Author: autumnsilence
Date: 2008-08-19 23:55
i am going into 11th grade and i just recently got a B12 Buffet and it seemed a big improvement over my used Selmer CL300... even though the B12 is still a beginner instrument. its a great instrument and if you are looking for something more than a beginner instrument, i would still recomend the Buffet line. They seem to be great instruments and thats what i plan to upgrade to next happy hunting
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2008-08-20 00:03
I wouldn't upgrade from a B12 to an E11, however. In my experience the E11 is not sufficient improvement for the price.
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: GBK
Date: 2008-08-20 00:15
Tobin wrote:
> I wouldn't upgrade from a B12 to an E11, however. In my
> experience the E11 is not sufficient improvement for the price.
Correct.
The E11 is basically just a silver plated, wooden version of the beginner B12 clarinet, put into a nicer case.
Nothing more, nothing less....GBK
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2008-08-20 01:12
This is one of the reasons (on top of the fact that I have played all of the horns discussed) that I would recommend the Lyrique.
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2008-08-20 01:55
It's early days yet in terms of where she is likely to want to go on clarinet but odds are that marching band will be on the time line. For that reason, I would recommend you buy her a good "non-wood" student clarinet. A new plastic Buffet B12 would, IMO, be a good choice -- if Buffet is once again using metal, rather than plastic, rings. A used Vito V40 put in good playing condition is an even better choice, IMO. Unless I miss my guess, you will also hear recommendations for Ridnour and Forte hard rubber instruments before things go much further. Aside from peer reaction in high school and college to an "unknown" brand, the primary concern I have about them is how they will behave in extreme cold weather. Hard rubber can become very brittle. But I don't know the formulation of the rubber used in those instruments and, if you are in Texas, perhaps you will never face such weather. If your daughter doesn't go much beyond casual playing in pep band and marching band in college, she may never need another instrument.
Another option would be to buy her an E11 for indoor use and an inexpensive plastic instrument for marching band. I agree completely with William that, while Buffet may designate the E11 as a student model, it will be more than enough instrument for college wind ensemble in college and community band afterwards. But you probably don't want to subject a wooden clarinet to the elements or the rough treatment of marching band.
Best regards,
jnk
P.S. Buffet pitches the E11 a little on the sharp side so that absolute beginners can play in tune with other instruments in the band from day one. If you buy her an E11 and she finds she is constantly on the sharp side, a slightly longer barrel should fix the problem.
Post Edited (2008-08-20 02:00)
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Author: Ryder
Date: 2008-08-20 03:27
don't just look at an R13 for pro. clarinets. Don't get me wrong, I have one and i love it, but there are others. Try Leblanc clarinets in the price range of an R13. My only thing with not buying a Leblanc or yamaha for that matter is that for my taste, they play a little bright, but that's a personal thing. I don't think you can go wrong with the R13, just remember to have her and pref. an intructor try several before buying...applies to all clarinets you look at. i do think though that it is necessary, if she does plan to, continue music through college and as a career that a prof. clarinet is in need. It will facilitate more room to grow.
____________________
Ryder Naymik
San Antonio, Texas
"We pracice the way we want to perform, that way when we perform it's just like we practiced"
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2008-08-20 03:35
MsNomer (which is a very funny play on words...even if it wasn't intentional)
...hasn't exactly put her budget on the table for us all to include in our recommendations...nonetheless I'm not certain that a pro instrument is what she is willing to spend at this point.
Just a thought, and I could be wrong!
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2008-08-20 04:15
... Or what she needs for a student who has presumably only been playing for two years. At this point, a better instrument is a reward, an encouragement for progress and interest to date and motivation to keep up the good work. A good new student instrument should meet this need and will better serve the demands of marching band. For most kids at her stage of development, IMNSHO, a pro clarinet is not a necessity or even a luxury, it is an indulgence. Also, far better (again IMO) to wait until her daughter can actually benefit from the pro instrument to buy it. Then the student will be better able to aid in its selection and it will be at peak performance when it can be appreciated.
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: pewd
Date: 2008-08-20 04:30
R13.
what does her teacher recommend?
what do the students in the high school she'll be in next year play ?
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2008-08-20 12:16
Lisa, since it looks like you wouldn't need the "pro" level instrument, check out the Lyrique. You can find it at http://www.ridenourclarinetproducts.com and it is designed by the man who created the best of the line of professional Leblanc clarinets, the Opus and the Concerto. You can get a great clarinet for just under $1000.
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
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Author: weberfan
Date: 2008-08-20 13:50
Lisa,
I am by far the least experienced of those who have responded to your question. But there is at least one other instrument worth looking at but not mentioned so far: the Yamaha YCL-250. It is a student instrument (ABS resin, I believe) that retails for about $750. My teacher and others I have talked to recommend it, and I have play-tested it. I liked it far better than the Buffet B12, both for its key work and its sound. If I were in the market for a new all-weather clarinet (which you will probably need) I'd seriously consider the 250 or the Lyrique. The Yamaha has been recommended by others on this bulletin board in past threads.
It also may be easy for you to find one and have your daughter try it. It would appear that Portman's is a large music store in the Savannah area that stocks Yamaha products.
Good luck with whatever you choose.
Post Edited (2008-08-22 23:06)
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Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2008-08-20 14:09
As an additional point, the Lyrique 146 is made of ABC as are many other student instruments. The barrel is hard rubber, though, and Tom claims the barrel helps to shape a darker and rounder tone. The 146 is only $650 if cost is an issue.
Jeff
“Everyone discovers their own way of destroying themselves, and some people choose the clarinet.” Kalman Opperman, 1919-2010
"A drummer is a musician's best friend."
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Author: Jkelly32562
Date: 2008-08-20 16:39
Lisa,
As a Georgia native, I would highly recommend Portman's Music in Savannah. I believe they are still on Abercorn st, just past the mall. The staff there is very knowledgeable and helpful. If you visit the store, they will allow your daughter to try many horns, and help her choose the one best for her and your budget, they have a wonderful rental plan if needed. I wouldn't buy an off brand clarinet, but they have a wonderful selection of clarinets by Selmer, Leblanc and Buffet. (I am not familiar with the Lyrique) They even have used pro line clarinets that have been overhauled. I think it would be worth your daughters while to play several horns before she buys, and that is possible at Portmans.
Jonathan Kelly
jkelly32562@troy.edu
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2008-08-20 16:56
To expand in a small way: The Lyrique cannot be bought at any store, only from Tom Ridenour himself.
Good luck Lisa!
James
Gnothi Seauton
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Author: MsNomer
Date: 2008-08-20 19:07
Thanks again, y'all.
I'm very familiar with Portman's. :D That's who we are renting her current clarinet from. Yes, the staff is very knowledgeable and helpful. But I still wanted non-biased, non-profit-motivated opinion. :D
I spoke with the fellas at Portman's and they've assured me that there are payment plans available through their in-store credit so I don't have to worry about plunking down $1000 - 1500 all in one chunk. I'd really prefer not to spend any more than that if I can help it. And, of course, if I can spend less, that'd be even better! LOL
Looks like she may have to come to class with me on Sat so we can check out the clarinets afterward.... :D
I'm SO glad I found this place! I'm going to have to send this link to Erica.... she'd probably enjoy this board.
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Author: ElBlufer
Date: 2008-08-21 04:43
I would like to again recommend the lyrique. Not only will it be great for concert band, but she could also march with it if necessary (although, I would highly recommend marching with her older instrument).
As a new owner of a Lyrique (I had been playing on an R13), I can honestly say that it is an EXCELLENT instrument in every way, and is at the very least worth a try.
My Setup:
R13 Clarinet (Ridenour Lyrique as my backup/marching instrument)
Walter Grabner K11 mouthpiece
Rico Reserve 3.5's
Bonade ligature
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Author: job_man
Date: 2008-08-22 21:54
Please, please, give this all much more thought before jumping in and purchasing what could be a costly mistake!
I have read through all your correspondence, and there are certainly some well-intentioned people out there. However, there are additional aspects to take into account, which have not been mentioned, and also, as a teacher myself, I am horrified that a purchase might be made without the guidance of your teacher.
An important aspect to take into account is the mouthpiece. One correspondent recommended the Yamaha 250 over the Buffet B12, (as I would), without mentioning that the principle advantage is the excellent mouthpiece supplied with the Yamaha, compared with the dismal offering by Buffet.
My advice would be to acquire a decent mouthpiece (with the teacher's guidance), and when the player is well-acquainted with the mouthpiece, take that mouthpiece along to try every instrument on (assuming the bore is compatible). Then you really are testing out the instrument, rather than being subject to the vagaries (and these can be considerable) of different mouthpieces.
If you want an instrument which is economical but more professional, the Buffet E13 can be a good deal (but remember that they still put the same indifferent mouthpieces on all instruments, whatever the price).
Another thing to remember is: plastic clarinets of any one design mostly play identically; wooden clarinets, even with consecutive serial numbers, will all sound different, so although you can probably speak about a certain plastic clarinet range as being good or not so good, you can only say, for wooden clarinets, that some examples are good/bad/indifferent.
I have custom-made clarinets, constructed with meticulous attention to detail, with carefully-chosen wood etc etc, and yet any two instruments can have individual characters when compared.
The last thing I would say is: do not let the student have too much say in the choice. I had one student who happened by a music shop, tried an instrument, declared it to have 'a lovely tone', and arrived at her next lesson with an instrument which was truly totally inferior to the one she already had! How do you tell the parents.....?
I hope this has been of some help, and that you eventually find the right instrument. If you feel suicidal in the process, you can always call the Samaritans.......!
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2008-08-22 23:54
"Correct.
The E11 is basically just a silver plated, wooden version of the beginner B12 clarinet, put into a nicer case.
Nothing more, nothing less....GBK
"
------------------------------------
Then why does it have a better sound?
If everything's the same, it must be the wood........
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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