 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: S. Friedland
Date: 2008-05-27 16:02
Is there a point wherein the price becomes prohibitive? I have found that these reeds vary considerably, so what one gets is the great facility of an always wet-feeling reed. How important is this feature for a player who doesn't double? Also, where does one get the Ontario Cut?
Post Edited (2008-05-27 16:03)
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Author: KristinVanHorn
Date: 2008-05-27 16:10
Yeah I just bought another one from WWBW. I was going to buy a 2.5 and a 3 but for 18 bucks I'll see how the 2.5 works first.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2008-05-27 17:09
My 5th grade son is performing a solo at his schools concert tonight on a legere student strength reed.
That way he won't have to deal with a reed warping, drying out, etc.
He's playing mission impossible with an accompaniment track.
At least he won't have to worry about the reed!
I put him on Youtube playing it in an early practice under "clarinet 11 yr old"
Recorded it with my blackberry so little distorted, but the legere sounds good!
I bought the reed a while back, but do remember the student strength costing less than the regular ones.
He's no Michael Han....
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
Post Edited (2008-05-27 18:55)
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Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2008-05-27 17:19
Sherman,
Ontario can be found at 1stopclarinet.com. I've not yet found it at the other on-line music shops with which I normally do business. For whatever reason, I've found 1stopclarinet to carry some items I cannot find anywhere else.
Your question regard price is certainly a good one. For me, since I double, being able to pick up a horn and not have to worry about a dried-out reed is terribly important. Never the less, as you pointed out, it's less of an issue for non-doublers.
One could run a cost-benefit analysis that breaks down the cost of a Legere reed by estimated performance hours, doing a similar cost breakdown for the cost of a box of 10 cane reeds (also factoring in time spent working on reeds, number of poor performing reeds in a box, etc), and then comparing the Legere vs cane analysis. Depending upon the results of such a comparison it's possible that one can still come out ahead financially with Legere over the long term.
PS, I haven't checked the price for certain cane reeds lately. Given the weak dollar, are prices for cane reeds also increasing?
Roger
Post Edited (2008-05-27 17:23)
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Author: Sean.Perrin
Date: 2008-05-27 18:27
We've been paying 22 to 25 in Canada for a long time...
I hate these reeds, though. They never work right and sound like garbage.
Founder and host of the Clarineat Podcast: http://www.clarineat.com
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Author: GBK
Date: 2008-05-27 18:40
I've tried all the different types of smaller Legere reeds (Eb, Bb clarinet) with a variety of mouthpieces and have concluded that the clarinet reeds, while handy for outdoor work where tone quality can be forgiven, are far short of the response, and quality found in cane reeds.
However the larger the Legere reed (tenor sax, bass clarinet, etc...) the better the usefulness.
Perhaps with the larger instruments there is more leeway in the quality of sound?
My standard set-up for tenor sax is a Link metal mouthpiece with the Legere Studio Cut reeds.
It's nice to never have to worry about finding a good tenor sax reed just before a gig... GBK
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Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2008-05-27 19:04
GBK,
It's been my experience that the Legere Quebec reed has a superb quality of sound. Frankly, I don't care for the other Legere cuts for Bb soprano clarinet. The trick, for me, in becoming happy with the Quebec was finding a mouthpiece facing that's an especially good match for it. Have you tried a Quebec on a Grabner Kaspar-style piece? I'm extremely happy with this set up.
Given your experience, it might sound counter-intuitive that it actually took me longer to find a good Legere and mouthpiece match on tenor saxophone than it did on clarinet. I prefer the Legere regular cut on saxophone and I'm a big fan of Morgan large chamber sax mouthpieces. I went through several facings and was not at all happy with the tonal quality I got with Legere until Ralph Morgan custom made a 6C tenor mouthpiece for me. The regular cut Legere really came to life on that mouthpiece. Absolutely beautiful sound! Then, several months Brian & Erik (the mouthpiece guys Ralph trained) made some adjustments to the facing curve and side rails of the 6C and it now sounds even better with Legere. Think of the qualities of a Kaspar coming through the bell of a saxophone. That's how a regular Legere and a Morgan 6C works for me on tenor.
Roger
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2008-05-27 19:30
When I studied with Gigliotti he was working hard on a synthetic reed but never got it to where he wanted it.
Legere did what he couldn't in making a really good synth reed. I don't find them to be as good as cane, but in other ways they are great and very useful.
http://www.SkypeClarinetLessons.com
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Author: KristinVanHorn
Date: 2008-05-27 20:33
I love Legere reeds. I really love the sound they produce much better than cane reeds but then I have only been playing clarinet for a few years. So the fact that most people here seem to dislike them could that mean something is wrong with my playing? Or perhaps I'm just not developed enough as a player to notice that they are inferior?
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Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2008-05-27 21:02
Kristin,
Our choice of musical equipment comes down to finding those things that work best for us as individual players.
If you get a beautiful quality of sound with Legere reeds and are happy with them (as you indicate) there is no reason for you to think you're somehow less of a musician than those who use cane reeds.
I used cane reeds for more than 30 years. I considered myself to be a cane reed fanatic and whenever I tried synthetic reeds they went sailing into the trash can after playing a few notes. But, when I tried Legere reeds around 3 years ago my ears perked up and it seemed to me that they are different from the other synthetic reeds I had tried. After getting a sense of Legere's potential I made a conscious decision to focus on Legere reeds and invest the time, effort, and (yes) money to see if I could get a quality of sound that I could live with. Happily, it happened for me on each of my horns. I'm so pleased with Legere that I have no desire to return to cane.
Roger
Post Edited (2008-05-27 22:31)
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Author: C2thew
Date: 2008-05-28 07:14
from what my understanding of the legere reeds is that in addition to working well with larger faced mouthpieces, they work very well with richard hawkins mouthpieces and i've heard several confirmations about legere and hawkins mouthpieces as well. some equipment work better in conjunction with others.
Our inventions are wont to be pretty toys, which distract our attention from serious things. they are but improved means to an unimproved end, an end which was already but too easy to arrive as railroads lead to Boston to New York
-Walden; Henry Thoreau
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Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2008-05-28 11:54
Yes, that's true.
Legere also works well on Gregory Smith mouthpieces. In fact, Gregory posted a message on the forum not long ago with an insight about how the concave table of Zinner blanks (used in common by Gregory Smith, Richard Hawkins, Walter Grabner, and others) may have something to do with how well Legere reeds work on their facings. I think he's on to something! Also, I cannot help but think slightly thicker side and tip rails are helpful as well.
I find it amazing to try a Legere on a particular mouthpiece and it sounds TERRIBLE. Then, I use the same reed on another mouthpiece (like a Grabner) and the sound is stunningly beautiful.
Roger
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Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2008-05-28 12:54
I heard Larry Combs give a recital with a Legere back in 2001... he was so much better than I can ever hope to be; I considered taking up Bassoon!
I love the Legere for beginners, in particular - all the fuss about poorly stored or mishandled cane pushed off until they can make a sound and keep time.
The Legere clarinet reed is the ultimate assurance that a kid can just play.
As an aging hack, I love them for much the same reason - good enough.
When I'm in top form (which will NEVER approach most of our posters), I break open a pack of Rigotti Golds.
I think Roger is on the right track about reeds - find a mouthpiece that gives most of your reeds a chance to play well. Larry Guy's book on reed adjustment should get things dialed in for best performance.
Me? I'll put a Legere 3.5QC on my Smith and go practice...
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Author: S. Friedland
Date: 2008-05-28 14:25
With malice toward none:
I have tried for more than 45 years to find a reed to use instead of cane. I had heard early in my study that George Bundy had been working on a reed of sterling silver for the clarinet just before he passed away and I was intrigued. Then, while in Milwaulee(Principal), I tried the Fibrecane reed,played it for three months without mentioning it, then told the first cellist and I became an almost instant pariah.("oh may god, he plays plastic!"). I abandoned them, went back to Bonades or one of the others and am still looking. Now, Legeres aren't bad. I was attracted to Richard Hawkins website because all of the excerpts are played on Legere and they are (except for a slightly diffuse quality) excellent, or better. Now, I find this of interest and I obtained a Hawkins "R" facing, a lovely mouthpiece, but I couldn't find a Legere that would sound like anything but a popsicle stick. Awful.
Then I put one of my cane reeds on it and it absolutely came to a beautiful vibrance and what I consider great beauty and I have not looked back. So, there you go, we're all different and so are mouthpieces. I find the thick rails and tip of my(2) Gennusa mouthpieces play Legere OK, but still not well, so for 19 bucks a pop, I will buy two boxes of Zonda Classicos and off I will go. My second best mouthpiece is a Gregory Smith, which I couldn't play, sent it to Hawkins and I now have it back and etched into it are the words, "Refaced by Richard Hawkins". It plays terrific. (and I will not sell it.)
Sherman Friedland
Post Edited (2008-05-28 14:29)
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Author: Lelia Loban ★2017
Date: 2008-05-28 14:37
Since I play old instruments with old mouthpieces, I made tracings of the lays of the ones I use most frequently, took the tracings to a retailer and soon found that Legere reeds, like some cane reeds, don't fit some of those old mpcs. (That's not a criticism--there's no reason why they should fit equipment that's no longer being made.) I did buy a couple of Legeres, for sop. clarinet and alto sax. After giving myself enough practice time to get used to the feel of a Legere, I still prefer cane.
Still, I'd much rather use a plastic reed than have to switch instruments too fast to moisten the reed or to remove a moisture-holding mouthpiece cap. The Legere performs way, way better than a *dry* cane reed.
Lelia
http://www.scoreexchange.com/profiles/Lelia_Loban
To hear the audio, click on the "Scorch Plug-In" box above the score.
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Author: Old Geezer
Date: 2008-05-28 17:03
The new Forestone plastic reeds from Japan sell for $30.00!
Anyone trying them?
Clarinet Redux
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Author: KristinVanHorn
Date: 2008-05-28 17:33
Old Geezer wrote:
> The new Forestone plastic reeds from Japan sell for $30.00!
> Anyone trying them?
>
Where can I get one?
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Author: seafaris
Date: 2008-05-28 23:28
I listened to the music clips on the Forestone site which is listed above
and I wasn't impressed. I have played the Legere reeds for the last few
years and they work very well for me. I play a Fobes 4L which is a pretty
open mouthpiece and has thicker rails, and number 3 Legere, mostly the
Ontario. Walters mouthpieces are great and the Legere reeds sounded really
nice, but the Fobes just does it for me. I have played a few different
mouthpieces from Zinner Blanks and the sound is great, but I always end up
with the Fobes. I like the way it plays and articulates my sound. I
personally think it is a function of the combination of the reed, mouthpiece
and our embouchures. We are all different and what works for one won't necessarily work for another.
...Jim
http://1stopclarinet.stores.yahoo.net/index.html
Great folks to deal with, good prices. The Legere reeds are $14.99
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Author: KristinVanHorn
Date: 2008-05-28 23:41
seafaris wrote:
> I listened to the music clips on the Forestone site which is
> listed above
> and I wasn't impressed. I have played the Legere reeds for the
> last few
> years and they work very well for me. I play a Fobes 4L which
> is a pretty
> open mouthpiece and has thicker rails, and number 3 Legere,
> mostly the
> Ontario. Walters mouthpieces are great and the Legere reeds
> sounded really
> nice, but the Fobes just does it for me. I have played a few
> different
> mouthpieces from Zinner Blanks and the sound is great, but I
> always end up
> with the Fobes. I like the way it plays and articulates my
> sound. I
> personally think it is a function of the combination of the
> reed, mouthpiece
> and our embouchures. We are all different and what works for
> one won't necessarily work for another.
>
>
> ...Jim
>
> http://1stopclarinet.stores.yahoo.net/index.html
> Great folks to deal with, good prices. The Legere reeds are
> $14.99
I don't really know why but the Yamaha 4C mouthpiece has always worked for me. Maybe because I don't really no any better but compared to other notable mouthpieces I have tried I always went back to the 4C.
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Author: seafaris
Date: 2008-05-29 21:27
Hi Kristin,
I don't know why things work or not either, and sometimes I think that is best! :-) I say whatever works for you stick with it. One less thing to worry about.
...Jim
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Author: Forestone
Date: 2008-06-15 03:41
Forestone reeds can be purchased on the webside www.forestone-japan.com free shipment. Definitly worth trying.
Post Edited (2008-06-15 03:42)
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Author: Ed
Date: 2008-06-15 15:04
I have tried Legeres in various cuts and strengths a number of times. Each time I have tried to give them a fair shot, but I end up finding there is nothing I like about them. I could not find myself using them in any situation. Obviously, there are many who like them, but they just have not worked for me.
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Author: allencole
Date: 2008-06-16 04:00
I hate to see it happen, but I still like to keep some Legeres handy. Once you get past expecting them to sound like the best cane, they really are the doubler's friend. I play mine on a Greenline with Portnoy BP02. (the best commitment I can make to synthetics)
Allen Cole
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2008-06-16 06:51
> However the larger the Legere reed (tenor sax,
> bass clarinet, etc...) the better the usefulness.
Maybe, but I didn't find that. For me Legere reeds just don't work as good as my regular (cane) reeds on either soprano or bass clarinet. With bass, overall sound is not as good and response in the clarion is (slightly) more difficult. With soprano sound was a bit different and not as good and had response problem with upper clarion. Worth mentioning that these response issues don't exist with my usual reeds. Also the different type of sound was exactly the same with soprano or bass. I can't really say if the difference was because they are synthetic or because of their shape and cut since I had even worse results from some cane reeds (but not from the usual type I use).
I've played Legeres only, and several different strengths, for a few months, inlcuding in concerts, not just practice and rehearsals. The last thing I want is start looking for new mouthpieces that might (or might not) play with Legeres. The reason I tried them was because I change often between soprano and bass clarinets. At some point I just gave up and returned to cane reeds.
In one rehearsal someone noticed I used a plastic reed. One sax player imediately said plastic reeds don't sound as good and that he can definitely hear when someone is using them and he was very sure. A couple of weeks later after a rehearsal I asked if he noticed I changed back to a cane reed and he said yes. I was still using the Legere for that rehearsal....
> One could run a cost-benefit analysis that breaks down
> the cost of a Legere reed by estimated performance hours,
> doing a similar cost breakdown for the cost of a box of 10
> cane reeds (also factoring in time spent working on reeds,
> number of poor performing reeds in a box, etc)
Yes someone could do that, but reeds are unpredictable enough that it's mostly impossible to do it anywhere close to accurate. I did this very roughly for me. After trying same strength Legeres, I came to the conclusion that they are not exactly the same either. So someone has to buy several (plus you always need back up reeds anyway). A price of one is close to a box of 10 cane reeds. I don't spend any time on adjusting reeds, etc. so all that is irelevant. Each cane reed usually last me a very long time. Does a Legere reed last pretty much forever? If not, how long? For example on bass clarinet a good cane reed can last me weeks or even months months (sometimes with only rarely taking it off the mouthpiece).
So I don't think playing Legere would be cheaper, at least not significantly. Unfortunately I have to live with drying reeds but I prefer that compromise than the ones I had with Legere reeds.
> Gregory posted a message on the forum not long ago with
> an insight about how the concave table of Zinner blanks
> (used in common by Gregory Smith, Richard Hawkins, Walter
> Grabner, and others) may have something to do with how
> well Legere reeds work on their facings. I think he's on
> to something!
Possible, but my bass clarinet mouthpiece which had the results I described above is made from Zinner. Of course I have no idea what was changed compared with other Zinner mouthpieces.
Post Edited (2008-06-16 10:56)
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