 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: wjk
Date: 2008-06-07 21:09
The DVD series "Mozart on Tour" makes reference to clarinet parts in Mozart's opera "La Clemenza di Tito." Is anyone familiar with these parts and is it likely that Stadler played them?
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Author: LarryBocaner ★2017
Date: 2008-06-08 00:26
I've had the pleasure of performing "La Clemenza" a couple of times -- most recently (well, 9 years ago) a concert presentation with Christopher Hogwood conducting. The clarinet parts are, like most Mozart, grateful and rewarding. Notably there are obligatto arias with basset clarinet in Bb(!) and for basset horn in F. "Parto, Mi ben Caro" and "Non piu di Fiori" to be specific. Hogwood asked Paul Cigan and me if we would like to stand in front of the orchestra for these great solo parts -- we both politely demurred.
There is no doubt in my mind that these solos were written with Stadler in mind. They are a joy to play, and demanding technically and musically -- but well worth the "trouble."
Naturally the local music critic screwed up, credited the wrong player for each solo -- didn't know a basset clarinet from a basset horn!
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Author: S. Friedland
Date: 2008-06-08 13:51
For those interested and doing a recital with Soprano, there are arrangements of Parto Parto for piano accompaniment. Goes very well with Shepherd.
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2008-06-08 14:56
Larry, where did you get a Basset clarinet in Bb? I didn’t realize that even existed in Bb. I wish our BSO had a Basset horn. Every time we do something that requires it, not very often I may add, we have to borrow them and are usually very challenging, not very good. Any idea about renting some really good basset horns? We’re doing the Mozart Requiem this year and I’ll probably be asked to play it if we don’t do the clarinet arrangement, which we have done sometimes before.
I agree with Sherman, that’s a very good arrangement of Parto Parto. ESP
www.peabody.jhu.edu/457, listen to my Mozart
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Author: Alphie
Date: 2008-06-08 16:12
>For those interested and doing a recital with Soprano, there are arrangements of Parto Parto for piano accompaniment. Goes very well with Shepherd.<
"Parto ma tu ben mio" is written for a mezzo-soprano and "Shepard on the rock" for a soprano. Singers who can do both very well are rare animals.
Alphie
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2008-06-08 17:15
The solos where indeed written for Stadler. There is a reference in Mozart's Letters that says that Stadler travelled with Mozart to Prague for the 1st performance.
Peter Cigleris
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Author: S. Friedland
Date: 2008-06-08 17:45
Excuse me, Alphie, but I have performed the two mny times, and I have also performed the Schubert with a great tenor. It was super, (even though his German was not). Historically,as long as the performer can perform the aria, it happens, and things do and have been transposed . Even clarinetists transpose.
If the high B for the soprano(immediately prior to the allegro) is not available on the night , what happens?
Sherman Friedland
Post Edited (2008-06-08 17:50)
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Author: LarryBocaner ★2017
Date: 2008-06-08 19:12
Ed, the basset clarinet in Bb is a Buffet that was custom made for Marilyn Lauriente, late first clarinet of the Chicago Lyric Opera. It was willed to the Hubbard Street Dance Theatre company in Chicago -- don't ask me why. That's who we borrowed it from. Very nice instrument!
The National Symphony owns three Leblanc basset horns. Two of them are of early 1960's vintage, with some daunting intonation challenges. The third is much newer, and plays very nicely in tune.
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Author: Alphie
Date: 2008-06-08 23:20
>Historically,as long as the performer can perform the aria, it happens, and things do and have been transposed . Even clarinetists transpose.
If the high B for the soprano(immediately prior to the allegro) is not available on the night , what happens?<
At very local venues this might be true but never in the professional scene.
Alphie
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Author: larryb
Date: 2008-06-09 00:12
After the first performances of Tito in Prague, Mozart returned to Vienna to prepare and premier the Magic Flute. Stadler remained in Prague and wrote to Mozart to report on the success of further performances of Tito.
Mozart relayed Stadler's report in a letter to Constanza:
"Cries of 'Bravo' were shouted at Stodla [Stadler] from the perterre and even from the orchestra -- 'What a miracle for Bohemia,' he [Stadler] writes, 'but indeed I did my very best.'" (Mozart to his wife, 7-8 October 1791, as quoted in John Rice's "La Clemenza di Tito")
You need a Bb basset clarinet to play the 2nd clarinet part authentically in Cosi fan Tutte too - there are two low Ds in aria No. 24.
By the way, the Orchestra of the Age of Enlightenment is scheduled to perform Tito at Lincoln Center in New York in August. I wonder if Tony Pay will be making the trip?
Post Edited (2008-06-09 00:16)
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Author: D Dow
Date: 2008-06-09 01:10
Hopefully there are no castrati parts required..we may have a hard time getting one!!!
David Dow
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Author: S. Friedland
Date: 2008-06-09 02:29
What are you talking about,Alphie? What do you mean by by "local venues" , and "the professional scene"? Can a "local venue" be the "professional scene"? You are going to have to define your terms, sir.
Teach me; I need to know.
Shermn Friedland
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Author: Alphie
Date: 2008-06-09 18:41
Yes Sherman, a local venue can indeed be a professional scene if you prefer to misunderstand me on purpose.
First you said:
>For those interested and doing a recital with Soprano, there are arrangements of Parto Parto for piano accompaniment. Goes very well with Shepherd.<
Then I said:
>"Parto ma tu ben mio" is written for a mezzo-soprano and "Shepard on the rock" for a soprano. Singers who can do both very well are rare animals.<
The reason for saying this is that professional singers usually avoid interfering on each others territory if they are not exceptionally talanted and feel absolutely confident and are publically accepted singing a broad repertoire.
Then you said:
>I have performed the two mny times, and I have also performed the Schubert with a great tenor. It was super, (even though his German was not). Historically,as long as the performer can perform the aria, it happens, and things do and have been transposed . Even clarinetists transpose.
If the high B for the soprano(immediately prior to the allegro) is not available on the night , what happens?<
I can't believe you are discribing a professional venue here if his German was poor, it was a tenor (for reasons mentioned above) and hypothetically if the high B don't come out as expected it's no good for everybody is waiting for it.
I just don't get a feeling that this concert was very seriously meant. And what other classical/romantic chamber music pieces would be transposed at a serious professional venue like Alice Tully Hall or Carnegie Hall, Brahms violin sonatas, Beethoven string quartets?
That's why I said:
>At very local venues this might be true but never in the professional scene.<
I'm not trying to attack you Sherman, I'm only expressing an opinion, sir. But for that matter, we might have different experiences, and that's ok too.
Alphie
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Author: Alphie
Date: 2008-06-09 20:54
Ok, I stand corrected. You are 30 years ahead of me so I probably don't know what I'm talking about.
Alphie
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Author: Alphie
Date: 2008-06-09 21:07
Sorry wjk that your question derailed. larryb did his homework very well and gave a good answer.
At the premiere performance Stadler played both nr. 9 Sextus aria "Parto ma tu ben mio" and nr. 21 Vitellia's (soprano) aria "Non piú di fiori" with basset horn obligato. "Non piú..." is today scored for 2nd clarinet.
"La Clemenza..." is included in this newly released box of DVDs that we recorded in the 80th at a magical 18th century theatre: http://www.naxos.com/catalogue/item.asp?item_code=102095
I regret to say that I did not use a basset clarinet in B-flat at the time. This is the very first recording on period instruments of the piece and time did not allow to have it finished in time.
Alphie
Post Edited (2008-06-09 22:12)
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Author: estclar82
Date: 2008-06-09 21:22
I suggest to take you the score of Clemenzo and write the clarient part down. It ise most clear you can find.
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2008-06-09 23:33
Alphie
I didn't realise you did period instruments. Who made the clarinet's for your Clemenza recording?
Peter Cigleris
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Author: Alphie
Date: 2008-06-09 23:47
Peter, the A-clarinet was made by Eric Hoeprich. He also made my basset horn. The Bb has an original H. Grenser bottom section with a top section made by Eric. The C-clarinet is an original H. Grenser.
Alphie
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