 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Astorezza
Date: 2008-04-27 02:14
I am currently trying to figure out what to do for my masters:
should I go to a very expensive university (nearly $40,000/yr) with a decent teacher and a great music program?
-or-
a very cheap, not so great music program overall, but with a fantastic teacher/performer who will kick my butt for the next two years?
-or-
take the year off, study with a new teacher, reaudition, and hope for better scholarships, and also for a second chance at my dream school?
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Author: Katrina
Date: 2008-04-27 12:20
Yeah. Your second option is the best, IMO. I ended up doing a version of your #1 for my MM and really really wish I had taken the other option I had at the time. Mostly because of the student loans required, but also because I was miserable at the school.
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Author: crnichols
Date: 2008-04-27 15:00
IMHO Version #1 would be foolish. #2 would probably work out really well for you. #3 would also probably work out for you, but #2 may still be less expensive.
Christopher Nichols, D.M.A.
Assistant Professor of Clarinet
University of Delaware
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2008-04-27 15:06
My answer is all the above. You should make a list of schools and teachers you think you might enjoy working with and make arrangements to visit the schools and have a lesson with the instructor. Once you’ve done that let your gut be your guide. If you want to compete with the pros for a professional playing job you have to be in the same playing field. You can’t get that in a non-competitive atmosphere or with a teacher that does not know how to get you to the place you need to be. That doesn’t mean it has to be a cutthroat atmosphere but at least a competitive one. It’s a tough market out there, you have to be prepared. Of course even the best teachers, in the finest schools, won’t get you there if you don’t put the time and effort in yourself. You have to practice hard, listen and experiment. ESP
www.peabody.jhu.edu/457
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Author: Astorezza
Date: 2008-04-27 15:57
Thanks for the advice! I am only worried about the smaller school because I hear that they have not-so-great ensembles, and I might get frustrated working with the other musicians, though the clarinet studio is very good.
I was excited about the big school at first because I hear that it is an excellent school overall with a good reputation, and I do like the teacher, though I don't know if they would push me as hard as school #2. BUT, as I've said, it is really expensive- I would have to take out private loans in addition to the federal loans I was awarded.
I am thinking that option number 2 will be best also, even if it is not a well-known school. The teacher is pretty well-known as a soloist, has made a lot of recordings, and teaches at a reputable festival.
-sigh- such a big decision
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Author: Ryan25
Date: 2008-04-27 16:29
Option number 2 without question.
Huge amounts of loan debt is one of the biggest reasons many talented musicians quit after college. Taking auditions is very expensive and if that is what you want to do, starting the audition circuit with as little debt as possible is very important.
Don't worry about ensembles because at the bigger school, you might not get to play as much as you would like anyways. Your main focus should be your teacher and your work ethic. Nothing else should really matter.
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Author: brycon
Date: 2008-04-27 17:59
I would suggest number 3. If this were your undergraduate, then without a doubt take option 2. However, for a masters I would say that the school also matters. You see your teacher once a week, and the rest of the time is spent performing and rehearsing in ensembles. I've learned as much from my friends, orchestra directors, and chamber coaches as I have from my teacher.
Also, you shouldn't need the teacher to push you towards your goals. Sure they help, but I hope that you are also self motivated. My advice would be to take a year off and make a list of dream schools and go take some lessons. Going to a great school and avoiding student debt is a beautiful thing- best of luck.
Post Edited (2008-04-27 19:55)
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Author: Astorezza
Date: 2008-04-27 20:06
No, I believe that I am a very self-motivated person, and have gotten to where I am because of that. I spent my first 3 years of undergrad as an education major, but switched to performance. My undergrad teacher was very helpful when I was a younger student; I came to him my last semester of high school doing everything wrong, having never taken lessons...
...but for some reason he became really...lazy. I didn't even play my entire senior recital rep. for him before the actual performance, and maybe had one lesson on my grad school audition rep.
I've worked super hard regardless, and have improved a lot. I went to a couple of chamber music festivals last summer that helped me immensely, and was able to study with some great teachers.
I was waitlisted at USC (my "dream school") this year, and if I had gotten in, would be much more willing to invest a lot of money in that. I suppose that's why I've considered taking a year off: maybe I can improve enough to actually get in next year. I do really like the teacher at option #1, but I haven't heard of clarinetists getting jobs out of there. #2 would be cheap, and I think the teacher is just what I've been eager for: well-organized, intense, young, energetic, MUSICAL, motivated himself (still practices hrs a day).
I know I have to ultimately decide on my own, but as a generally indecisve person, it's nice having everyone's input
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Author: patrickryan04
Date: 2008-04-27 21:28
So what schools and teachers are you refering to when you say option #1 and option #2.
Just curious.
1st Armored Division Band
Clarinetist
Dixie Band
Woodwind Quintet
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2008-04-28 01:06
Astorezza -
As we say in Yiddish, let's sit tokhes oyfn tisch -- butts on the table -- completely honest and without pulling punches.
How good are you?
- Were you first chair in your conservatory orchestra?
- Could you perform the Nielsen Concerto tomorrow?
- How about the Françaix?
- Can you play the Baermann 3 exercises in B as smoothly as the ones in C?
Everyone who's going to make it as a player COMES INTO a graduate program with the instrument completely mastered. Read my posting at http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=271351&t=271296 and ask yourself whether you're at the Steve Girko level.
If you're not that person, your chances of getting an orchestral job are nil, and getting a college teaching job is almost as difficult.
So, what do you want out of a masters program? What kind of work do you want to do? Will having a master's degree help you get it? If so, by all means go for it.
If you go into a masters program just because it's the next thing to do, or because you can't think of anything better, think again. Get a dozen of the people you respect most, including profs, sit them around a table with some good food and spirits and get their advice about where to take your life from here and what it takes to get there.
You're at a crucial point in your life, and you'll never have more or better choices than right now. Give it your best thought and effort.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Daniel Frazelle
Date: 2008-04-28 01:58
Ken, you give great advice and a very realistic view of the clarinet world and the typical prospects within it. I do, however, have to disagree with your assessment that one needs to have mastered the instrument after the undergraduate level to find success. My last semester at James Madison University I was a co-principal in the orchestra, but in reality I was behind the person I shared it with and even another girl who had been placed equally but put principal in our chamber orchestra. Playing the Nielsen would have been a joke. The Francaix even more so. I had a decent tone but shoddy articulation and inconsistent technique. I was also a Music Education major with a full semester of student teaching ahead of me while I was supposed to be auditioning for graduate programs at the same time.
I was accepted at CCM and had two excellent teachers there. I was a complete mess and very much middle-of-the-pack going in. By the end of my second year there, I was among a handful of the best players at school, had been accepted at prestigious festivals, and was making finals in military band auditions and some smaller orchestras. By the end of my third year, I had won my current job in the Navy Band and felt very confident (perhaps arrogantly) that with more time a full-time orchestral job could have been had.
My point is simply that much can be done in a short span of time in grad school. Many people will attest that it is the time period with the most potential for growth. I think it makes it that much more problematic to really assess a player's potential after college. Sometimes people know what they have in them, sometimes they are quite delusional. But without question, even fundementals on the instrument can be turned around in a short period of time with the right situation and teacher. I am a perfect example of this and probably not an anomaly.
Daniel Frazelle
United States Navy Band
Post Edited (2008-04-28 02:00)
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2008-04-29 15:14
You should also consider learning the other clarinets and the orchestral excerpts for them. Going someplace that you can learn bass and Eb gives you twice the chance of getting an orchestral job and certainly doesn't hurt in the freelance world. Every clarinet player should learn to play bass and Eb. Learning the excerpts takes a great commitment in time but it's well worth it. I did it when I went to college by being self-motivated and practicing my butt off. I even taught Ricardo Morales to play bass. Of course, like everything else, he just naturally took to it. He could probably get a good job on bass if he wanted too, oh I forgot, he already has a good job. Grad school is a good time to do it if you haven't already mastered those instruments. ESP
www.peabody.jhu.edu/457
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