 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Kay S.
Date: 2000-08-27 20:25
Okay, I just have to ask..I bought a 'wood' clarinet a year or so ago. After new pads, it sounds great, and became a favorite of mine, although I am no great player. I decided to sell it, which I did. The purchaser brought it back and told me that the repair technician at the local store told her it had bad pads, was missing some corks, and it was RUBBER. I noticed in your 'provocative questions' that no one mentioned a rubber clarinet. I know the mouthpiece is rubber, but the body?? I know he was lying about the pads and the corks, but rubber?
It is a Hoosier. Anyone know how to find out about it? I already asked Mark Charett, who was very helpful (thanks Mark), but any other opinions / links to Hoosier serial numbers, etc???
Thanks.
Kay
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2000-08-27 20:28
Hard rubber (Ebonite is one of the trade names) was used to make clarinets and is sometimes referred to as plastic also.
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Author: Dee
Date: 2000-08-27 21:10
Hard rubber seems to have been a popular alternate material in the early 1900s before plastics became available. I don't think it has been used for clarinet bodies for over 50 years as all that I have seen have been older than that.
Hard rubber is the same material that the intermediate and high end mouthpieces are made from.
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Author: Bob Gardner
Date: 2000-08-28 00:22
Look to see if there is any grain to the body. Wood Clarinets have some grain showing, rubber or other material would not.
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Author: Steve Epstein
Date: 2000-08-28 01:58
I have a couple of old hard rubber ones with fake grain. But another way to tell is by weight. If you have experience playing wood clarinets, you can tell a plastic or rubber one right away, because it's so much lighter. Unless, that is, they begin adding fake weight:)
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Author: Dee
Date: 2000-08-28 02:11
Steve Epstein wrote:
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I have a couple of old hard rubber ones with fake grain. But another way to tell is by weight. If you have experience playing wood clarinets, you can tell a plastic or rubber one right away, because it's so much lighter. Unless, that is, they begin adding fake weight:)
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Need to be a little careful judging by weight alone. One of my wooden clarinets is a thin wall type construction and is noticeably lighter than the other wooden ones but it is indeed wood. It feels about the same as the hard rubber ones that I have. The plastic one feels lighter than either the wood or hard rubber. Caveat: This is based just on holding them. I have not weighed them.
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Author: Bob Sparkman
Date: 2000-08-28 10:11
Hey Guys and Gals -- This is great - I think the number of hard rubber/plastic clarinet players is greater than admitted. Kenny Davern played a rubber Conn for years, loved it and got a big, fat, luscious sound out of it. And, that PBS secial on the Mpingo tree (grenadilla) featured an interview and playing by --- ready for this?! ---- Acker Bilk!!!! With all humility, I am only a fair player, but I am pleased with the sound I get out of my A serial # Vito, and you can check it ouf at "espressojazztrio.com" on the net. Great discussions here. Love you all! Bob Sparkman
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Author: beejay
Date: 2000-08-28 11:14
I have an old soviet-era clarinet made in Czechoslovakia and for the life of me, I cannot tell what material it's made of. It sounds dreadful, though.
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Author: David Spiegelthal
Date: 2000-08-28 14:33
I own two hard rubber clarinets. One is my "A" clarinet, whose only markings (on the bell) are "Triomphe, France". It is the best-playing "A" clarinet I have ever tried. I'd guess it was made in the 1930s to 1940s. My other (currently for sale) is a 1954 Boosey & Hawkes "The Edgware", their student line of clarinets which were made of wood from the late 40's until the early/mid 50s, then were hard rubber for a few years, then went back to wood in 1957 (I believe), then went to plastic in the early 60's(?) when they were renamed "Series 1-10".
Hard rubber, IMHO, is an excellent material for making clarinets (as well as mouthpieces, which is what most people are used to seeing in hard rubber). It's a dense, stable material that machines very well, takes a shine nicely, is completely waterproof, and is relatively easy to clean. Its only real drawbacks are: it's rather heavy, it's brittle when dropped, and if you machine or sand it, the dust is rather obnoxious-smelling (heavy sulfur smell) and irritates the throat and lungs some. It's interesting to compare my 1954 hard rubber Edgware with three other Edgwares I've restored (a wood 1947 model and two wood 1957 models): the hard rubber one plays exactly the same as the wood ones (or as close as clarinets can get to exact), yet it is in much better condition after 50 years than the others were, because hard rubber is so durable. Other than the difficulties of marketing non-wood clarinets, hard rubber is probably superior to wood if you look at it pragmatically.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2000-08-28 16:07
The above posts pretty well cover the "waterfront", I suggest if more is desired, "Search the Forum" via "hard rubber" etc. Also in some formulations, lead sulfide [PbS]is/was? used as the sulfurizing [crosslinking]agent with the rubber [natural or synthetic] thereby adding to the weight of a finished clar. Nuff said? Don
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Author: Dee
Date: 2000-08-28 22:03
David Spiegelthal wrote:
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... Hard rubber, IMHO, is an excellent material for making clarinets (as well as mouthpieces, which is what most people are used to seeing in hard rubber). It's a dense, stable material that machines very well, takes a shine nicely, is completely waterproof, and is relatively easy to clean. Its only real drawbacks are: it's rather heavy, it's brittle when dropped, and if you machine or sand it, the dust is rather obnoxious-smelling (heavy sulfur smell) and irritates the throat and lungs some. It's interesting to compare my 1954 hard rubber Edgware with three other Edgwares I've restored (a wood 1947 model and two wood 1957 models): the hard rubber one plays exactly the same as the wood ones (or as close as clarinets can get to exact), yet it is in much better condition after 50 years than the others were, because hard rubber is so durable. Other than the difficulties of marketing non-wood clarinets, hard rubber is probably superior to wood if you look at it pragmatically.
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There is one significant caveat to the use of hard rubber. It must be protected from too much exposure to light and exposure to excessive heat. These seem to cause degradation of the material. So I bet yours was always put back in the case when not in use and wasn't ever left in locked cars.
Old hard rubber clarinets (and mouthpieces) that have been exposed regularly to such excessive conditions turn brown over time and develop a slight order and the mouthpiece also develops a taste to it.
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Author: Lelia
Date: 2000-08-29 01:26
I've seen hard rubber clarinets at flea markets that had conspicuously distorted, due to exposure to heat in open cases displayed outdoors. They'd also turned a nasty greenish color, and they smelled like tires.
I own one rubber B-flat clarinet that I bought at a poorly-lit indoor market. That clarinet fooled me. I thought it was wood until I saw it in bright sun outside. The wood grain is convincingly simulated and the weight feels about the same as many wooden clarinets. It's a "Carl Fischer," a store-brand stencil that could have been made by several different manufacturers. I keep it for the curiosity value, but it's a terrible clarinet!
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Author: Lelia
Date: 2000-08-29 01:29
Forgot to mention.... My rubber clarinet, like many others I've seen, has a metal sleeve lining the bore of the upper joint. This was used to prevent warping. It also adds to the weight of the clarinet, which helps create the illusion of wood.
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Author: Kay S.
Date: 2000-08-29 04:44
Thanks everyone for the encouragement. The clarinet weighs about the same as my wood one, and it has 'grain' to it. Today I took it out into bright sunlight, and there is just the slightest greenish tint to the whole clarinet.
Thanks to everyone who admitted that they had a hard time distinguishing wood from rubber, I don't feel so bad about being fooled.
A lesson learned...but, after new pads, it isn't such a bad instrument.
Thanks again.
Kay
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Author: David Spiegelthal
Date: 2000-08-29 14:36
Dee is absolutely correct -- in fact my B&H rubber clarinet is sort of an olive-brown color, although in this instance it's actually quite attractive that way (I've gotten positive remarks from fellow players about the appearance of the instrument). Usually, the discoloration is seen on mouthpieces that have been left out in the sun (typically with the ligatures on, of course!) so that the mouthpiece will have distinct "tan lines" in the perfect outline of a ligature, where the rubber is still black underneath the ligature and brown-to-green everywhere else where it was exposed to a lot of sunlight.
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