 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2008-03-23 13:48
In the string of threads about design that I have started (or brought back from the dead) is one on the considerable weakness of the low D. I find it to be especially weak compared to the notes around it, and even more weak on A clarinets. For some reason, all the notes are fairly consistent as to tone except that one which is fine at a soft volume, but stuffy at a loud volume.
I have tried making the hole bigger and/or filing into a sort of "undercut" shape (not using undercutting tools, so it's not exactly that). Usually, this makes an improvement in tone, but at the sacrifice of bringing pitch higher.
Any [good] ways to fix this?
Post Edited (2008-03-23 14:11)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-03-23 14:07
Add the F/C key to resonate the D.
I find E a duff note on Boehm systems on account it issues mainly from a small tonehole, and if the venting on the top joint rings is low, then it really compromises the tone quality. So make sure the lower joint rings have plenty of venting (minimum of 2.5mm) so the C and E aren't stuffy when pushed. It's only a real problem in the low register, and this stuffiness can also be helped by choosing reeds that offer clarity - ie. don't use reeds that are too hard for you.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: BobD
Date: 2008-03-23 14:09
Don't really know but are you saying it's a problem on all of your horns or just one? With all mouthpieces and reed strengths?? In short, is it really the horn itself?
Bob Draznik
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2008-03-23 14:13
I have noticed this problem on many Buffet and Yamaha A clarinets. As per other brands, I have not tried out enough to make a fair statement about them.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2008-03-23 14:20
Very well said, IMHO also, Chris P, I was just about to post the same comments. With my present front tooth problems, the ! lowers ! , my minimal present playing is chalemeau and lower clarion so a wide lay mp and soft reeds are all I can stand. Yes, the top pads on the L J do help the venting. Keep the thoughtful questions coming, S G ! LUCK, Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: Ed Palanker
Date: 2008-03-23 15:01
I would suggest having the tone hole professionally undercut and then putting as much tape in the upper part of the top of the tone hole to bring the pitch in place if it gets to sharp. ESP
www.peabody.jhu.edu/457
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-03-23 15:49
I've just been playing my Series 9 A, and have no tone quality problems with the lower register D. It speaks just as cleanly as the C and E either side of it.
But these clarinets do have large toneholes.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: rtmyth
Date: 2008-03-23 17:11
My TR147s and Arioso are ok on the D. I would, as Chris recommends, check the ring key heights. Lee Gibson mentioned the D of the E&S Master model was the only tone hole which had no uncutting, compared to the R13, which did. Why? I don't know.
richard smith
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-03-24 08:34
Maybe the D tonehole was relocated slightly higher up the joint and made smaller on the R13 than it was on the E&S, so was undercut to compensate.
On my R13 Eb, the D tonehole has massive undercutting. But the D tonehole is a plain tonehole as is F, Bb and A - the A tonehole is usually massively undercut as well, which is why on bass clarinets it's been moved further down (and to the side of) the joint and covered with a large pad connected to RH3. So I can't understand being that these are plain and full size toneholes, why they should be weak stuffy as they're not vented by a small tonehole or covered by a pad - the D should be one of the clearest notes on the clarinet.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2008-03-24 09:20
You're right. It *should* be clear.
The one thing I notice is that the hole is preceded by an enlargement in the bore from the 2 Eb/Bb holes. Could that be a factor?
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-03-24 09:58
Is this weak D specific to this particular clarinet (or others of the same model), or present in all the different makes of Boehm systems you've compared it to?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2008-03-24 10:54
I find it to be a weak note on many clarinets, not just mine. On some it's better than others.
It is only weak when I try to play on the louder side. It breaks up and has less stability; the problem is similar to the pinch Bb, but not nearly as severe.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-03-24 11:14
If you could relocate the D tonehole lower down the joint and make it larger in diameter, maybe this could help this one note.
But it will position it close to the C#/G# key touch arm, and may affect the tuning or stability of the upper register A and the various altissimo notes where LH3 is raised.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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