 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: eac
Date: 2008-03-19 15:47
When I had my thumbrest replace with a Loree oboe thumbrest and moved higher, the tech did not fill the old holes. My teacher is concerned that this creates a weak spot and potential for cracks. Should I have this done? Thanks!
Liz Leckey
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Author: C2thew
Date: 2008-03-19 16:38
it shouldn't create a weakspot as those holes used to carry the entire weight of the instrument. now they are retirement holes
Our inventions are wont to be pretty toys, which distract our attention from serious things. they are but improved means to an unimproved end, an end which was already but too easy to arrive as railroads lead to Boston to New York
-Walden; Henry Thoreau
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Author: BobD
Date: 2008-03-19 17:01
Leave 'em, you might want to use them again if the Loree doesn't suit you.
Bob Draznik
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-03-19 17:38
But if you do want them filled, superglue and wood dust is ideal.
Once all nicely papered up and polished, it'll be hard to tell where the screw holes once were.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: eac
Date: 2008-03-20 15:45
What a relief! My instructor and I can stop worrying. Thanks!
Liz Leckey
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2008-03-20 16:04
The technique I use for filling holes, which I prefer over the 'superglue' method: mix two-part clear epoxy together (can be either the fast-drying or slow-drying type), then add fine grenadilla dust, and apply to hole. Make sure hole is horizontal and level! Fill hole so that the glue/wood mix is slightly proud of (higher than) the top of the hole, and allow to cure completely. Then file the excess material flush with the body of the instrument, then sand with increasingly fine grades of sandpaper, then polish, then apply wax if desired. If done right, the filled hole will blend in nicely with the surrounding wood and be nearly undetectable.
The advantage of epoxy over superglue is that the former will dry with fewer voids and porosities, whereas the superglue/grenadilla mix tends to have a coarser finish and somewhat resemble Swiss cheese when dry.
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Author: Chelle
Date: 2008-03-21 02:04
My bass clarinet used to have a peg, but most of the mounting bracket thingie was gone when I got it and all that's left is 4 holes at the very bottom of the instrument (I use a neck strap and not a peg). When I last had it overhauled, I asked about filing the holes and he said it would cost $50 so I passed (since it's purely aesthetic). I think I might try the glue/grenadilla dust thing, though (have a badly cracked barrel on another clarinet that's going to have to be replaced, so I bet I can use that as a source for the grenadilla dust).
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Author: C2thew
Date: 2008-03-21 02:36
pulverize it in a blender. hehehehehe.
willitblend
that might be interesting to see. i think i have a cracked barrel that needs to retire
Our inventions are wont to be pretty toys, which distract our attention from serious things. they are but improved means to an unimproved end, an end which was already but too easy to arrive as railroads lead to Boston to New York
-Walden; Henry Thoreau
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2008-03-21 06:37
A barrel will not blend. Use a file (not sandpaper) over a dish to catch the powder.
As to the OP question- if I want to save them, I cover unused holes with tape to keep it clean.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-03-21 07:01
On an old Conn bass I filled all the holes left in the back of the lower joint by the floor spike base plate with superglue and wood dust, and after 'distressing' it, it was only visible under strong light.
Also the lyre box screwed into the top joint was removed, but there had been holes filled previously (n a slightly different place) with epoxy which left grey dots, I used stain on these to disguise them, though the holes I filled with superglue and wod dust were hard to see, as well as giving them the distressed finish with a wire brush to match the rest of the wood as polishing it to a shine didn't match the finish this bass had acquired over time.
On my own cor anglais, if I have let a conservatoire system player use it for a week or so, I've removed the thumbplate and pillars and the 3rd 8ve key, and plugged the pillar holes with cut down pillars with a slot cut in the head so they screw almost flush with the body (and can be removed easily). The 3rd 8ve vent is covered with a piece of black insulating tape to protect the bedplace from being chipped, though I do plug the hole with cork to be sure it's sealed.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2008-03-21 12:07
David wrote:
"The advantage of epoxy over superglue is that the former will dry with fewer voids and porosities, whereas the superglue/grenadilla mix tends to have a coarser finish and somewhat resemble Swiss cheese when dry."
I agree.
I tend to use superglue in small chips, without any filler.
For larger chips, I have used a similar approach to David, but instead of grenadilla dust, I use a black powder paint pigment mixed into epoxy - just enough to colour it black.. (It is probably "lamp black" or manganese dioxide.)
I prefer using superglue (low viscosity)for splits though, because I believe it has a better chance of getting to the bottom of the split by capillary action, and holding it stable. I cannot mix the pigment with superglue, because it woudl set instantly, so in the case of wider splits, I use superglue, then grenadilla dust packed into the split, before more superglue.
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Author: Blake Arrington
Date: 2008-03-22 00:51
I have a junker clarinet that I bought that I sacrifice whenever I need grenadilla dust. Swiss file and something to catch the dust...works wonders.
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2008-03-22 02:12
Ferree's has it. You can buy it with or without 'Hot stuff' superglue. You get a lot for only a few dollars. I found it to be a bit coarse and ground it with a mortar and pistle.
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Author: BobD
Date: 2008-03-22 12:42
I sometimes wonder if grenadilla dust/powder/etc is necessary or if it was just a way of making the epoxy black. I do find that epoxy makes a good "glue" with or without gr. dust but some of the commercial gr.dust is just that...dust...and very susceptible to static effects making it hard to "handle". Filing one's own sounds like a good alternative unless you want to use some very inexpensive carbon black as is used to color cement.
Bob Draznik
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-03-22 13:11
Another way to fill holes is with solid grenadilla plugs which involves drilling or milling out the existing screw holes and fitting solid grenadilla plugs turned to fit the holes, glued in place (with the adhesive of your choice), the excess removed, the remainder filed down, papered up and polished to match the rest of the surface. But they will leave two spots of end grain on the surface.
I've seen this done with ebonite plugs, but it turns green/brown over time. Ideally if filling with solid wood plugs, the grain of the plugs should line up with the grain of the body.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2008-03-22 13:40
Draz,
You're exactly right, the sole purpose of the grenadilla dust is to make the filler black and less shiny. It contributes nothing (and possibly degrades) the mechanical strength of the epoxy, but since we're making a cosmetic rather than a structural repair, that's not an issue. Using clear epoxy alone results in a shiny, amber-colored 'plug' that is not at all attractive!
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