 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: NEEMAN
Date: 2008-02-19 17:57
Hi everyone, I'm a first time poster, and I'm just wondering if you guys can help me out by giving me a little info/opinion!
I'm a university student from Ireland, and I'm currently thinking of upgrading my Hanson HE-5V for either their SE5-G or the SE5-BTR.
To give a bit of backround, I haven't been playing long (just a few months), but I am the type of person who doesn't give up things I get into. I know I'm not going to stop playing clarinet, because I really like it, and I am currently doing my work experience as part of my degree, for which I am paid. This means that for the first time in a while, I have money beyond what I normally make through a summer/winter job. I am unlikely to have this kind of surplus dosh in the near future (i.e. next few years), so I want to upgrade now while I can, especially as Hanson do a great upgrade service (100% of the value of my current clarinet).
I'm settled on the make, because I've found them to be really helpful, but what I want advice on is choosing between a Grenadilla wood clarinet, and reinforced Grenadilla. The difference between the two models I mentioned above is the material they are made of; they are otherwise identical, and even have the same price. What are the pros/cons of each? I understand that reinforced Grenadilla is supposedly tougher and more resistant to heat/cold etc, but does that come at the cost of tone/sound?
Any help would be much appreciated! Thanks!
Post Edited (2008-02-19 20:57)
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2008-02-20 02:59
Wow, never heard of these horns or the nomenclature of which you speak. I will just assume a translation to what I DO know, the Greenline and NON-Greenline Buffets.
In that scenario, the Greenlines are hygromatically impervious and will withstand more brutal temperature swings because they are made of wood shavings and epoxy (kinda-sorta a sophisticated version of pressboard).
The two different versions of Buffet sound remarkabley similar. Though I would not hesitate to play a Greenline in a concert setting, I still prefer what is still the slightly more resonant (only enough to tip the balance slightly) true wood clarinet.
..........Paul Aviles
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-02-20 07:59
But IS 'reinforced grenadilla' actually stronger than grenadilla in it's normal state?
I doubt the composite form (or 'reconstituted grenadilla' as it should be termed) has the same tensile strength (if anyhwere near) as natural grenadilla.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2008-02-20 10:57)
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Author: NEEMAN
Date: 2008-02-20 11:57
Well, getting to the factory poses a bit of a financial/logistical issue, as living in Ireland means that getting to the factory would require a flight or a ferry, meaning taking time off from work to go and see them mid-week when they're open, and paying for a flight and transport in the UK.
I've done a bit of searching on the forums, and I've discovered that there appears quite the debate going on as regards materials and tone, and I doubt that's going to get settled once and for all in this thread as opposed to all the others!
What I would ask is this: given that the two models are the same price, and that I live in what is essentially a temperate climate (it rarely goes below zero or above 30 degrees celsius here, even in a harsh winter or a hot summer), is the reinforced grenadilla of any significant advantage to me?
What we do have here are damp and central heating, which I imagine might be significant issues. Bearing in mind that I am an absolute pedant when it comes to gadgets/technology of any kind (in the sense that I am extremely particular about keeping them in good order), do you think I'd be as well off ordering the true grenadilla? I mean, is cracking likely to be a serious concern? I won't be in any situation that will require playing outside, and we don't have the kind of seasonal climate swings you get in continental Europe or North America. Should I get the reinforced Grenadilla out of paranoia, or do you think I'd be ok with a true Grenadilla clarinet?
Just so you know, I'm leaning towards getting the pure Grenadilla model.
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-02-20 12:10
As you're not planning to be playing in remote conditions, a wooden clarinet will be fine. All wooden clarinets have the risk of splitting and steps taken early on during the playing-in period of a new wooden clarinet will reduce this risk.
I'd go for a wooden clarinet for the inherent strength. Though I wonder what their titanium ones are like? You have the lightness of aluminium but with the strength of steel, and none of the worries of wood, reconstituted wood or plastic.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: NEEMAN
Date: 2008-02-20 13:32
Yeah, I think I've settled on the wooden model, thanks for all your advice guys! As for the titanium model, it sounds almost sci-fi esque; from my own perspective though, the cost sounds equally futuristic!
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Author: modernicus
Date: 2008-02-20 14:59
Wow, titanium, I didn't know anyone was making anything like that! The idea of not having to deal with the complications of wood or wood substitutes is intriguing- I assume a professional could play such an instrument for a lifetime and never worry about, let alone cracking, but "blow out" or other such things?
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-02-20 16:35
G.R.Uebel made various woodwinds from aluminium - flutes, piccolos and bass clarinets, though I'm sure there were many others in between.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: EuGeneSee
Date: 2008-02-20 20:01
Mark, just the slightest tipping of that clarinet would leave a pile of broken chips on the floor!
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Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2008-02-20 20:32
Just some anecdotes of note.
I originally wanted to disagree with Chris P. on durability since in the normal day to day usage there seems to be no reason to think the Greenline material is any less durable (it actually takes a much more durable cutting tool to machine this stuff).
HOWEVER, I recall a bell being stuck to the end of a clarinet and the end user foolishly used all his substantial muscle to remove said bell. The end of the tenon cracked off......oops.
Then I had dropped a joint on an end once and a bit chipped off, not enough to cause a problem, but more material than one would have expected from african blackwood under the same stress.
ANYWAY, besides my preference for the sound, there is also the issue of african blackwood going the way of the Dodo. We might as well enjoy wood while we can. In a few decades ceramic, presswood and titanium may be the only options we will have.
...........Paul Aviles
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2008-02-20 21:29
Neeman, wait until the weather is better before getting a wooden clarinet - leave it until late April to May. Reason being that you'll have it played in during a more stable time of year and it'll be played in by late Autumn.
Be patient, as 'Sumer is Icumen In'!
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: NEEMAN
Date: 2008-02-20 23:01
Coincidently Chris, I'll have to wait until April anyway; Hanson are currently out of their stock in that range, and are waiting on a machine to be fixed/replaced- I forget exactly what the lady said, but in short, it'll be a while before they can start making more (they're very small; essentially a family business). They told me to call back in about 6 weeks, so that will take me into April. I'm posting this question now because, well, I'm a child at heart, and get very enthusiastic when buying just about anything that's expensive and has buttons I can press. It's probably wise and practical to know what I want and be sure well in advance, but if I'm honest, I'm really just a big excited 8 year old. =)
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