 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: NorbertTheParrot
Date: 2007-11-19 12:27
I love the "English sound". I'm thinking of getting a 10-10 to to try to make that sound. But I read bad things about them being very resistant, and hard to play in tune even with the right mouthpiece.
Should I be worried? I don't want to spend hundreds of pounds on a big mistake.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-11-19 13:11
I never had any unusual tuning problems with my 1010, though getting the right reed/mouthpiece combination (which works for you) will make things easier in terms of resistance and projection.
They are more resistant than large bore Selmers as 1010s have small toneholes in relation to the bore size.
But I still sounded the same on the 1010 as I do on my Selmers or Leblanc - there was some difference in the way it played, but not a great deal in how it sounded.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2007-11-19 13:40
I have a 10-10 pair, they're beautifully made.
The Jack Brymer mouthpiece I purchased for them plays best tuning.
Drop me a direct line for more extensive detail, won't you?
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2007-11-19 15:14
Having come originally from an R13 world, the Boosey transition was hard. It ALL centered around pitch. Though my pair may have been poorly made, they were both hideously (and uncorrectably) sharp below the staff on "G," "A" and "B."
There is NO other mouthpiece you CAN use other than those designed for a 1010 bore. I hear that Peter Eaton makes 1010 style bore clarinets and mouthpieces so you may want to try that as well.
Now if you are going for the "Sound," there is the whole style of playing that goes along with it, so it is NOT just a matter of getting a horn and voila, you sound like Gervase DePeyer.
................Paul Aviles
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: stevesklar
Date: 2007-11-19 15:29
I had a 1010 here for a repad last year. Though it was mpc picky I did find other mpcs (other than Eaton) that worked well with it. Unfortunately I can' t recall which those were.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-11-19 15:46
I used a Vandoren A1 crystal with my 1010 as it's got a large bore, and is shorter in length than the usual French-style mouthpieces.
The build quality of B&H instruments is massively variable, even 1010s.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2007-11-19 17:31
I'm confused by the "variety" claim on mouthpieces. The bore of the 1010 mouthpiece is perfectly CYLINDRICAL up to the tone chamber. Other mouthpieces are conical and cause major intonation issues throughout the 1010 horn well above what I described earlier.
............Paul Aviles
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2007-11-19 17:53
The B&H 1010 hasn't been made for many years, and it underwent significant design changes, in particular the addition of the Acton vent to correct the right-hand tuning. However, some players complained that the change spoiled the sound.
Any 1010 you find will be well-used, and you'll need to check the tuning and response carefully.
Peter Eaton and Luis Rossi make 1010 clones, which have the advantage of being new, and, at least with Rossi, there's the possibility of sending the instrument back to him for correction of tuning problems. I'm sure that Eaton and Rossi will supply the names of people who play their 1010-style models, and you can check with them.
Ken Shaw
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: NorbertTheParrot
Date: 2007-11-19 18:22
I'm aware of the Rossi and Eaton instruments, also of how much they cost - about four or five times as much as a 1010. Not only is the cost prohibitive, but there's a certain appeal in the idea of helping keep the 1010 tradition alive by playing the original, not just a copy/update.
I'm aware that I'd (almost certainly) need a special mouthpiece; that's not a problem in itself.
My question is, am I going to enjoy playing the thing, given my rather limited abilities.
It's interesting that B&H produced two professional models (1010 and 926) but all their cheaper instruments were based on the 926. There was no poor man's 1010. Does rather suggest that the 1010 design was considered suitable only for accomplished players.
A supplementary question just for interest - did/does any well-known player use the 926?
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2007-11-19 18:41
The difference in the 1010 suggests that there were some professionals that had a different concept of sound......that's ALL.
Also, I mention the different "style of playing" because if one plays the 1010 in the same manner as an R13 with the French/American approach to producing sound, the sound you get is actually rather bright.
.............Paul Aviles
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-11-19 20:35
"A supplementary question just for interest - did/does any well-known player use the 926?"
Michael Collins plays Peter Eaton Internationals which have the narrower bore of the two types offered (the 1010 version being the Elite).
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Koo Young Chung
Date: 2007-11-19 23:22
What exactly does 10-10 stand for?
I have one and it sounds very nice,well made with excellent wood.
Difficult to find one though.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: NorbertTheParrot
Date: 2007-11-20 07:57
To answer Koo Young Chung's question, I think 1010 refers to the bore size.
The 926 had a bore size of 0.5926 inches.
The 1010 had a bore size of 0.6010 inches.
(OK, I'm not certain this is the real reason. But it makes some sort of sense.)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-11-20 10:22
In new money, the 926 bore is 14.9mm and the 1010 bore is 15.2mm.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Paul Aviles
Date: 2007-11-20 11:33
I stand corrected.
According to the Peter Eaton website, "most other mouthpieces can be adapted [to the larger bore clarinet]." By this short description I believe he means boring out the conical bore of a conical bore mouthpiece. If this is the case, it would NOT be possible to convert BACK.
.......Paul Aviles
Ready to be wrong again
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-11-20 12:19
"If this is the case, it would NOT be possible to convert BACK."
Anything's possible - it may not be economical to do, but it's always possible to fill and reshape the bore back to it's (almost) original shape with resin or an ebonite sleeve.
Though someone got this '70s pair of 1010s at a good price:
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&rd=1&item=280173172666&ssPageName=STRK:MEWA:IT&ih=018
But the mouthpieces weren't included "due to health and hygene".
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
Post Edited (2007-11-20 12:23)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Jamietalbot
Date: 2007-11-20 15:27
I've used mouthpieces on my 1010 that have been bored out to match the instrument, especially old 926 mps.
Also, Peter Eaton and Eddie Pillinger make large bore models that are excellent.
I returned to 1010s after years on R13s and love them.
They are still in frequent use in the UK although not as much much as 30 years ago.
Listen to the Jack Brymer recordings of the Mozart concerto and quintet or Gervaise de Pyer recordings the Weber and Spohr concertos if you still need convincing- they sound wonderful.
You can often pick up a good BH 1010 for around £600 in many top woodwind stores.
Good luck!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: cigleris
Date: 2007-11-22 16:07
I playthe Eaton wide bore having moved over from the 10-10. Mouthpieces can be bored out but you have to be careful as some are better than others. I play a Hite that i've had for ages and the intonation has been spot on right through the instruments. I had a Bay done and the intonation was not right. I response to a previous question, i was told that 1010 wa the catalogue number that just stuck.
Peter Cigleris
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-12-01 12:52
On Tuesday just gone I tried a mid-'30s 1010 that once belonged to Thea King, and it certainly packs a punch (even though it wasn't in full working order)! And that was with the 1010 mouthpiece.
Like large bore Selmers, certain fingerings for trills and other alternative fingerings were well in tune, and ones which won't work too well on narrow bore clarinets such as Buffet R13s.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
