 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: na1965
Date: 2007-11-10 02:44
I have recently been trialing a number of vintage clarinets (Selmer 9*s, 10Gs and Buffet R13s from the 1970s) and was wondering if it is easy to spot a repaired crack or is a well repaired crack hard to detect?
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2007-11-10 08:29
A well done crack repair (and also the filling of a screw hole when one moves a thumbrest) can be near invisible- even to the person that did the work! It depends on the severity of the crack and the quality of the repair person.
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Author: b.roke
Date: 2007-11-10 22:16
If the crack repair is "invisible", and has remained so during normal use for some time, does that mean that the clarinet is as good as it would have been if it hadn't cracked? That would be assuming that the performance - tone and tuning hadn't changed.
I ask this as some people respond to a crack as a disaster and I have read recommendations on this board from people not to purchase a clarinet which has cracked.
.
steadfastness stands higher than any success
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Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2007-11-11 00:11
I think the point is that you can find instruments of quality that have not suffered a crack, for little more money.
While a well executed crack repair may have no noticeable effect on the playing character of the instrument, it certainly diminishes value.
(As with a vehicle that has been rebuilt after an accident.)
Cracks are prevalent among the double reed family, and don't seem to adversely relate to resale value... not so with clarinets.
FYI - The BEST R13 I have ever heard had two serious cracks, including one that had been repaired twice. The instrument was a brutal wreck - and not for sale at any price. This thing sang.
So, if you can get a quality R13 with fresh pads under $1000 USD - crack repair or not, it may be a good player. I don't know why you're considering the Selmer 9*- it's neither fish nor fowl. The Series 9 was a MONSTER.
Selmer 10G in the X, Y, and Z serial number ranges were personally approved by Anthony Gigliotti (the "G" in the model number) - those are terrific.
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Author: C2thew
Date: 2007-11-11 03:39
the 10g's were correctly set up buffet r 13's though the plating used on the keys makes the sound a little brighter. great instruments though
Our inventions are wont to be pretty toys, which distract our attention from serious things. they are but improved means to an unimproved end, an end which was already but too easy to arrive as railroads lead to Boston to New York
-Walden; Henry Thoreau
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2007-11-12 08:31
I think answers to the question would all lie somewhere along a spectrum with wide extremes.
At one end, we have a person who might say that the crack has relieved the tension in the timber, freeing it to vibrate and sound way better than most instruments that have never experienced a crack. So if it is well repaired, then the value of the instrument is either unchanged or enhanced.
At the other end, a person may argue that any instrument that cracks now has a distorted bore which is unlikely to ever play correctly again. It suffers from the equivalent of 'playout' and its value is drastically reduced.
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2007-11-12 10:00
b.roke,
Sorry to not answer your question, sooner.
Well, it would be hard to tell that. If the crack does or does not affect the sound is a hard question since, in used instrument situations, we don't know what is was like before the crack. And also the pitch of many clarinets change with age anyhow. What I said before was just that the repair can be hard to see unless you know where to look.
If it were me I would try to stay away from cracked clarinets unless they are in great shape and you can test it out throughly. OR- if it is really cheap and looks like it may be good and worth the risk.
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Author: Augustus
Date: 2007-11-12 13:43
I have a Selmer Signet Soloist that is 42 years old and with no special care has never developed a crack. Was better Grenadilla used then?
My suggestion is to get a hard rubber clarinet as I did and never worry about cracking or swelling again, And many fine players say that it sounds as good as a wooden one, a question that has been discussed a number of times in this forum.
Augustus
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Author: na1965
Date: 2007-11-12 18:41
Thank you for all the responses. I've been trying these instruments more out of curiosity than anything else, as I have a set of R13s from the late 70's that I've been playing on since getting them 25 years ago. I am presently getting them overhauled and was toying with the idea of getting a "backup" instrument (other than my Artley Prelude that my Dad bought me in elementary school). Having been lucky enough never to have owned an instrument that has cracked, I was just wondering how easy it is to detect a repaired crack.
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Author: perryg114
Date: 2007-11-13 12:36
A black light will reveal cyanoacrylate glues if the crack was of any size. The glue will fluoresce under the UV light. It will show up as a yellow streak. Its not 100% but if you see one you at least know. This may also work with epoxies but I have not tried it. I think that most wood clarinets of any age have some cracks in them especially in the bore. I would say that 90% of the ones sold on Ebay have cracks of some sort. Many cracks are almost too small to see and many are not even visible until the wood is cleaned to remove old cork grease etc. Of the clarinets I have seen, the cracks first develop in the socket between the keyed sections and in the thin bell tenon. Now as to what sort of crack is a problem, I can’t really tell you. I think if the really small cracks are filled with cyanoacrylate glue before they become major structural through cracks then the process of cracking is stopped or at least delayed for a long time. Big open cracks that have been pinned would tend to concern me the most. If a crack has been repair so well that you can’t find it without a lot of trouble then it is probably a good repair and likely to outlast the life of the clarinet. I am not an expert so this is only my opinion as an engineer and not a woodwind repair tech.
Perry
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Author: Tobin
Date: 2007-11-13 14:41
Augustus,
The wood the clarinet makers used in decades past was aged longer than what they use today.
My '67 Buffet would have been aged for almost 20 years naturally. More recent Buffet's would be aged for 5 years in a kiln.
If we didn't all keep buying the instruments so fast, they might age the wood longer!
James
Gnothi Seauton
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