 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: pmgoff78
Date: 2006-06-23 23:21
Alright, I found a Mazzeo Selmer Clarinet with the covered thumb key. What is the deal with the Selmer ones. It actually is called a Signet Mazzeo. Did he sell his patent to them, or what?
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Author: ariel3
Date: 2006-06-23 23:49
Hello, There is a wealth of information about the Mazzeo clarinet on this website that I believe will answer your questions. Just enter "Mazzeo" in the search section of this site and you will be amazed at the information that awaits you.
I have an A and a Bb Selmer Series 10 Mazzeo clarinet. I use them constantly and really enjoy the clear throat b-flats which can be fingered in many different ways. Another benefit is the throat A which can also be fingered in multiple ways. These are truly beautiful horns and I do not regret making the change to the Mazzeo system.
Gene Hall
Post Edited (2006-06-24 03:16)
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2006-06-24 00:32
Yes , as ariel said, we have discussed Maz's "improvements" pro and con many times. Re patents, he has/had 5 US patents, in the 50's-60's with a series of inventions, prob. licensed to Selmer, who made several versions, from the "pinch" Bb improvement [Bundy] to the Selmer-Paris with all of the bells and whistles. Several of our museums, like NMM [ Vermillion, USD] have an S-P, a few get auctioned infrequently. I only have a Bundy. Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-06-24 09:36
I was tempted by a Selmer (Paris) full Mazzeo Bb that was up for grabs on eBay around a year or so back, but I have full Boehms which do everything I need them to do.
One extra piece of keywork I did like was the duplicate LH low Eb lever, which was next to (and on the inside of) the LH Ab/Eb lever.
I couldn't see what the linkage from the RH pinky keys (I think it was from the Ab/Eb key) to the RH rings was for, and this could cause trouble for altissimo E and F if it held the rings closed.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: ghuba
Date: 2006-06-25 03:19
The Mazzeo patents were licensed exclusively to Selmer although apparently they were used on at least Rosario Mazzeo's personal model near the end of his life (after the patents expired) that was produced by Buffet, and there are reports on the Internet that Yamaha may have produced some examples in the 1990s, although I have not been able to verify this.
The primary innovation of the Mazzeo system is the "Mazzeo mechanism" which enables alternate fingerings for throat Bb and A. Production Mazzeo system clarinets also contain a plateau thumb key and a more elongaged bell without a metal rim. While it might be difficult for a professional who has overlearned the fingerings and transitions with the standard Boehm system to shift to a Mazzeo system clarinet, as an amateur I find it relatively simple, although the left hand little finger configuration on a full Boehm model sometimes feels a little "odd."
Selmer USA produced at least two models of Bundy Mazzeo clarinets in the 1960s in resonite. Selmer USA produced two slightly different Selmer Signet models in the 1960s, one marked "special" edition.
Selmer France produced both regular Boehm and full Boehm models in different bores and series between the mid 1960 and early 1980s. Models were reportedly produced in the Centered Tone, Series 9, Series 9 star, and Series 10 bores. I have never seen a CT or Series 9 bore Mazzeo from Selmer France, but I do own several Series 9 star and Series 10 Bb Mazzeo clarinets, having regular and full Boehm examples of each. Several generations of key fabrications were used on the Selmer France models. From the half dozen of these I have collected, I would conclude that the key fabrication on the older Series 9* models is a little more robust than that of the Series 10.
While they may not be the only two living professional performers on Mazzeo clarinets, I do know that both Sherman Friedland and Margaret Thornhill use these in performances. Mr. Friedland often discusses the Mazzeo clarinet on his own web site. Both Mr. Friedland and Dr. Thornhill have examples of their playing as sound clips on their web sites. You can easily find these web sites easily using a search engine.
Again, as Don Berger notes, there is much information about Mazzeo clarinets on this web site and other ones.
George
Post Edited (2006-06-25 10:42)
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2007-09-05 16:18
Very well said/explained, Sherman and George, a fine description , pro's con's, of revolutionary inventions, by a ?too-early? expert cl'ist. Hopefully, interest and re-manufacture may be renewed. Should/could these be put into our "permanent archives", MC/GBK ? TKS, Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-09-06 00:47
Don't Mazzeo system Selmers (Paris) have a special clutch on the mechanism which can disengage the rings from the throat Bb vent (lower of the two trills) for non-Mazzeo system players?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: ariel3
Date: 2007-09-06 01:58
Yes Chris, The Paris Selmer Mazzeo clarinet does have the clutch. It was placed on the professional horn so that the player could engage the clutch to make the horn behave like any other clarinet. This was important, especially in critical situations - concerts etc. when the player did not trust his wings in such critical situations during the learning phase.
In my case, after I "learned" the horn I used clear nail polish to seal the clutch so that it would not engage accidentally. I would never go back to the old system - so I take very good care of my horns.
Gene Hall
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Author: ghuba
Date: 2007-09-08 13:49
Author: ariel3 (---.woh.res.rr.com - ISP in Herndon, VA United States)
Date: 2007-09-06 01:58
Yes Chris, The Paris Selmer Mazzeo clarinet does have the clutch. It was placed on the professional horn so that the player could engage the clutch to make the horn behave like any other clarinet. This was important, especially in critical situations - concerts etc. when the player did not trust his wings in such critical situations during the learning phase.
In my case, after I "learned" the horn I used clear nail polish to seal the clutch so that it would not engage accidentally.
Gene Hall
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My hypothesis is that one of the reasons (in addition to conservativism and overlearning of the standard fingerings) that advanced players had "trouble" with the Mazzeo system is that most of the Selmer Paris instruments I have seen have had slippery clutch mechanisms, with the instrument having a tendency to jump from one mode to the other. Gene's solution seems like a good one. Possibly Selmer was very aware of this because there are several alternate designs for the clutch that were used at different times and often the used instruments have bent clutches (or plier marks on the clutches) suggesting that prior owners or service technicians used less delicate solutions to the slipping clutch issue. I have never seen a Selmer Paris Mazzeo that did not have the clutch, although perhaps some of the original ones (based on Selmer CTs; there is one of these in the Shackelton collection at Edinburgh University that was originally owned by Sherman Friedland) pre-date the use of the clutch by Selmer.
The Selmer Signet (USA) and Bundy (USA) designs do not have the clutch but rather operate in "Mazzeo mode" at all times.
George
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Author: S. Friedland
Date: 2007-09-08 20:07
George et al:
The Bundy plastic Mazzeo was available with the clutch. I had one for several years, and still it may be in the house somewhere. (moving upon retirement is to be done only after mortal internment)
My first Mazeos were CTs as perhaps I've mentioned and had no clutches at all. Funny thing is, that when I saw the first clutch, I really had no idea as to why it had been installed. Those horns played great for me and I worked very hard learning them, as did the others. I could easily trill between throat a and middle b after making them a part of me. (There is a very cute trick to that however, which I will divulge if asked)
As far as hypothesis concerning the clutch as it was called, it was installed for younger players in order that it be more attractive for them to acquire.
When first playing a Mazzeo System Clarinet, if one wanted, one could simply disengage the needle spring that opened the third trill key, (which was the Bb). That disengaement made the instrument just a plain old 17/6, or whatever.
As far as slippery clutches are concerned, I would have to disagree respectfully.
SF
Post Edited (2007-09-08 20:37)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-09-08 20:36
I've seen Bundy and Signet Mazzeos listed on COUGHeBayCOUGH with the clutch.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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