 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: ClarinetBoy
Date: 2007-08-23 05:26
I'm looking at doing some jazz work in the near future and I am looking for a mouthpiece/reed combination. I need one that is designed for 440 pitch.
A bit about me. I am a high school first chair. My current setup is a Vandoren M15 mouthpiece with a size 4 Vandoren V12 or 56 Rue Lepic reed. I can hit an A rather comfortably (not the one just a little bit above the staff, but the one an octave above that). When I'm experiencing really good form, I can hit the C above that by altering my embouchure and using the fingering for the first C above the staff, but the tone is awful and it is too unreliable to ever use in a piece.
My tone seems reasonably good, seemingly less spread than last year's first, who played the tenor saxophone as well. That said, I've never really been exposed to what really amazing high school players can do.
If anyone has any suggestions, it would be greatly appreciated.
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Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2007-08-23 12:50
There are different opinions about this subject. Here's my take on it....
It's my impression that in recent years more jazz clarinetists have a classical type of sound -- Eddie Danniels being one example -- rather than a rough kind of sound as in the earlier years of jazz.
With that in mind, it's been my experience that one does not need a different mouthpiece for playing jazz on clarinet as long as you have a sound that has a good amount of projection. In other words, a mouthpiece with a big tip opening does not automatically equal projection. Also, I suspect that some doublers may be using a clarinet mouthpiece with a large tip opening because they are more used to the saxophone than the clarinet. I say that as a saxophone-clarinet-flute doubler.
My mouthpiece of choice is a Walter Grabner K14 (1.07 mm). I use it for all of my playing in both jazz and classical ensembles. It has a beautiful dark ringing sound and it projects so well that I do not have a problem being heard in a big band.
Good luck!
Roger
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Author: ClarinetBoy
Date: 2007-08-23 13:48
What exactly will the advantages and disadvantages be with a Jazz mouthpiece? Does it improve your ability to bend notes but detract from your stability?
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Author: Ed
Date: 2007-08-23 14:11
As has been commented here there are players out there who use what would be considered "classical" set ups for playing jazz. Saxophone players often use very different set ups for jazz and classical. Clarinet is often a different deal. I believe Eddie Daniels uses the same mouthpiece for both classical and jazz, which has a fairly close tip, longer facing, similar to your M15. Frank Glover also uses a mouthpiece that would be at home in any orchestra. (you can check his recordings out on cdbaby.com. He is an amazing player.) If you get good control and are happy with your set up, you might be very comfortable staying on what you currently use. It may have more to do with your choice of reed and concept.
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Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2007-08-23 14:38
Clarinetboy,
The advantages and disadvantages of using a more open mouthpiece come down to what works best for an individual player. Some musician friends of mine use large tip opening mouthpieces and they sound fine. Others sound equally fine on a classical type of clarinet mouthpiece. It's all very individual.
It's my impression that most jazz clarinetists who use an open mouthpiece do so for two main reasons: 1.) thinking that a larger tip size gives them more volume and 2.) it may be more comfortable in switching to clarinet from saxophone.
Speaking for myself, I tried various large tip opening jazz clarinet mouthpieces in the past and I didn't like the quality of sound that I got from them. I very much prefer my sound with a smaller tip mouthpiece....especially a mouthpiece based on a Kaspar style. For whatever reason, the Grabner K14 is a perfect match for my tonal conception. It's an absolute joy to play on.
Roger
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Author: Eric T
Date: 2007-08-23 20:58
I'm interested, Roger, in what strength reed you use with your Grabner K14?
et
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Author: Dano
Date: 2007-08-23 23:17
In my experience, an open jazz mouthpiece like the Vandoren 5JB for example, makes it easier to blow harder without fear of overblowing, bend the notes without having to adjust your breath as much and the ability to make that airy, whispered, reedy, not quite so crisp, Art Pepper (so difficult to describe) tone. Many jazz clarinetists don't like that, so you have to identify exactly what you are looking for that your current set up does not have. Even then a recommended set up might not work for you. It is a very personal thing.
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Author: redwine
Date: 2007-08-24 12:44
Hello,
I completely agree with using one set-up for every occasion. I play an equal amount of jazz and classical clarinet in my career. Using one set-up allows you to be very "at home" with your set-up, so you trust what will happen when you do something with your air, etc. I try to get the very best sound I possibly can at all times, but in jazz, I do alter the sound with my air and tongue position to obtain a variety of colors (more so than I alter my sound in classical music). I believe that at least part of the the reason for the clarinet falling out of favor in mainstream jazz in the near past is that many players played with an inferior sound. A lot of people say that you need a more open tip in jazz to compete with the volume at which other instrumentalists play. I've solved this problem with making my working jazz group a trio of acoustical bass, guitar and clarinet. It is my opinion that most people equate jazz with playing loud, which is crazy. Just ask the people you play with to play more softly and blend with what you are playing. I treat jazz as chamber music. As Duke Ellington said "there are only two kinds of music; good and bad".
Ben Redwine, DMA
owner, RJ Music Group
Assistant Professor, The Catholic University of America
Selmer Paris artist
www.rjmusicgroup.com
www.redwinejazz.com
www.reedwizard.com
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2007-08-24 13:23
Hi,
Ben is right on track here. I play exactly the same set-up on clarinet for all styles of jazz as well as classical. There seems to be some urban-legend that jazz clarinet players need a different type of tone and set-up. IMHO this does not seem to be true. In fact, fellow jazz players in the groups I work with seem to go out of their way to acknowledge that I have an excellent clarinet sound (now style is another issue and that's the real skill - klezmer, dixie, or...).
Sax is different, however. On tenor, I use a very standard MPs (Meyer and Selmer) for symphonic band and classical work but do not hesitate to switch to a Dukoff D7 or Rico Royal Metalite M5 for shows as well as jazz work. Interestingly, the Meyer 7M on alto seems to work very well for all playing as does a standard C* on soprano for all styles.
IMHO, there is no silver bullet.
HRL
Post Edited (2007-08-24 15:21)
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Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2007-08-24 14:38
Eric,
I use a Legere Quebec #3 and a Vandoren Klassik string ligature on my Grabner K14. From time-to-time I've tried Vandoren V12, 56 Rue, Black Masters and Gonzales FOF. For whatever reason, I actually prefer the quality of sound and overall performance I get with Legere Quebec reeds on my K14. They work beautifully on Walter Grabner's facings.
Roger
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Author: David Eichler
Date: 2025-03-05 07:35
I realize that this is a very old thread, but it deals with a perennial problem of how much projection and what sort of sound you need for playing jazz. I am not sure the responses were entirely helpful. The OP seems to have needed something that can be used in big band for playing lead clarinet. I have never done this kind of playing, but I have certainly listened to big bands that use clarinet in this way, and it seems to me that what is typically used for concert music might not be suitable. There is also the matter of whether or not the clarinet will be miked. If not, then I think you really do need something capable of cutting through the band without any assistance, which is probably not the sort of setup the OP describes. I think it might depend on what sort of arrangements you are playing, however, and how the band director controls the dynamics of the ensemble.
As for other types of jazz playing, if you can control the ensemble to suit your style and equipment, fine. However, if you want to just be able to show up at a jam session and be able to play, you might be frustrated if you don't have a loud set up, because mics are not always readily available and trying to use your own mic is not always possible or convenient.
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Author: super20dan
Date: 2025-03-06 02:40
Vandoren 5jb is still the gold standard for jazz clarinet playing if you have the chops for it. you can turn most any clarinet mpcs into a jazz mpc simply by using a rico plasticover reed. its what i have used for decades and it really adds zipp and volume and cut . i had to be heard over a veryy loud big band and the plasticovers deliver!
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Author: Burt
Date: 2025-03-08 02:22
Like many of the other responders, I use the same mp for classical and jazz. In my case, it's a Vandoren M30. But I use a slightly softer reed for jazz, especially if I'm doubling on sax.
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Author: Fuzzy
Date: 2025-03-08 03:43
I used a Vandoren Lyre M13 for years. I used my Pyne for years. I switched to a Pete Fountain (LeBlanc) Crystal years ago and love it. But...in all honesty...I still sincerely don't believe the gear matters much.
Fuzzy
;^)>>>
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Author: ACCA
Date: 2025-03-08 12:37
If i was in the OP's shoes, I would be trying a Meyer or Selmer C85 for the ability to project and bend notes. "The gear matters" to the extent that some setups will do this much better than others!
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Author: super20dan
Date: 2025-03-08 18:33
never played a meyer clarinet mpc but the otto links are pretty good but a still common great jazz mpc is either of the brillharts in white or black. great jazz mpcs. if you need to go nuclear-get a lakey!
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