 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: akshay
Date: 2007-07-21 06:10
Hi. I'm a high school junior (going to be a senior in September), and have started looking into colleges. I'd like to major in the clarinet, but at the same time I don't want a purely music education like that that most conservatories tend to offer. So, what are some good schools that have good double major programs in music and sciences, or dual-enrollment type programs between conservatories and universities?
-Akshay
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2007-07-21 07:06
You really don't find many "double major programs", per se. Rather, if you want to double-major, you do it on your own. You apply to both departments, you complete both sets of coursework. Some universities have interdisciplinary options, usually in crossover areas (music therapy, acoustic engineering), and some allow you to create your own program, though such a program is rarely accredited, and thus the degree carries much less weight.
I double majored in computer science and music composition at CSULB. Aside from G.E., I got *one* course to double-count for both majors, and it's because of a vaguely-worded elective category in the CS department. I started as a CS major, music minor, and was taking so many music classes for the fun of it that in my fourth year I decided to declare a second major. It took me a grand total of 7 years, with some really heavy semesters, and a really light last semester.
I took a total of 224 semester-units, which is probably close to the university record as an undergrad, and that doesn't include 3 courses that I tested out of (AP). I never would have made it if I had declared both at the beginning, and at the time, I didn't even consider it an option for that reason. After the first few years of clearing out the brunt of the heavy math/science courses and a good deal of GE, I had more time to dedicate to the VERY schedule-heavy life of a music major, which I still think is one of the most intensive majors on campus.
On the other end of the spectrum, a friend of mine graduated in 4 years with a double major in clarinet performance and english composition. Sure, she took 20 units or more most semesters (above 18 you need an advisor's signature, to confirm that, yes, you are indeed crazy, and you're aware of this), but she proved it doable. Double music and a heavily technical major? Plan for a bare minimum of 5, likely 6. Mine went to 7 because composition adds about a year to the bare-bones music major.
In essence, most schools don't offer such a program outright because you have to be crazy to do it. I'd recommend starting with a major in one and a minor in the other. In the first couple years you can decide if to swap, drop, upgrade, or stay put.
If your concern is just to not go to a conservatory that's music-only, most universities require a pretty heavy set of G.E. courses, and I highly recommend taking a minor.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2007-07-21 12:29
Hi,
As a long time university professor at several state schools, I would get this question often from perspective students. I would advise them of the following: An easier way to handle the issue that you present might be to pick the most restrictive major (music education probably since there are many very music-specific courses required) but when you have free electives (rather than in a department-specified field) take the science courses you are interested in.
In most cases, as long as you start in science courses that are open to majors in that area versus a survey course open primarily to non-major, you should be fine. This strategy will not probably make it possible to complete two major in the time of one but by cleverly using advanced placement, attending summer terms, and adding a semester or two if required you can achieve your objective without having to be admitted for a double major.
In most cases, the college dean's office might have to bless the double major if you go that route; talking to an associate dean can usually obtain approval. But you need to be knocking down top grades in the science courses. The basic science courses like physics, chemistry, and biology are the core touchstones; do well there and you can usually get instructor/department approval for higher level courses.
Many time, pre-med majors will pursue a non-science curriculum but do superior work in the sciences as electives, take the MCAT, and get admitted to med/dent/vet school. I've see this happen quite often.
This is all about planning, working like crazy, and doing well in school. A clever student like you appear to be can pull this off. A perspective employer later can clearly see from a transcript that you may have one major but instead have completed "the equivalent of ...."
Alex has it pretty clearly stated above from a student perspective; the "swap, drop, upgrade, or stay put" idea is right on track. Combine that with my faculty-member perspective, and you have pretty much covered all bases.
HRL
PS All this would be easier at a smaller school but at a large university, you can pretty well manage your education if you desire. Finding a sympathetic academic adviser in your major though can cut a lot of red-tape for you (like a quick phone call to another faculty member, an email to the dean's office,...). But you have to deliver the goods in the form of top grades. Otherwise, just stay with one major!
Post Edited (2007-07-21 15:42)
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Author: grumpyman
Date: 2007-07-21 16:09
Some programs that come to mind.
Julliard - Columbia
NEC - Harvard
Curtis - UPenn
CIM - Case
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Author: msloss
Date: 2007-07-22 00:07
Peabody - Johns Hopkins
Northwestern
Eastman - U Rochester
Mannes - The New School
There are plenty of great schools with departments or schools of music where you can avail yourself of the broader services of the university. I didn't double major at Northwestern, but I took every course I possibly could outside the school of music including a heavy concentration in mathematics. I live a dual existence as a musician and a financial professional, and I don't think I've been hurt one bit in either by the approach I took.
Double major is certainly one approach. Another might be to keep your Bachelor program to 4 years, do a single major with a lot of electives, and take that next year or two to get your Masters. I know plenty of smart folks who started on a BM track and went on to everything from law to medicine. If you are smart you will find your way.
Good luck with it!
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Author: R13
Date: 2007-07-22 00:29
Some other schools:
University of Michigan
USC
Oberlin
Tufts-NEC
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Author: Imperial Zeppelin
Date: 2007-07-22 14:26
First, I'd like to caution you that you're a little behind the curve here. Most aspiring music students have already vistited multiple schools and had lessons with teachers by the fall of their senior year. All is not hopeless, but you do need to get on the stick if you haven't done so already.
Peabody, whether you are considering that school or not, has some wonderful information concerning double majors and degrees on their admissions website. It should be required reading for any aspiring music student:
Peabody Admissions
There's also a great deal of information at the Music Majors website on College Confidential. You should look and ask there also.
Music Majors at CC
At first blush, the major Achilles heel in double major or double degree programs when one major/degree is science and the other major/degree is an ensemble instrument, is timing. If you're required to work with ensembles, they usually meet in the afternoons, which is also prime time for science labs.
Good luck!!!
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2007-07-22 18:51
Also, if you're planning on two majors, note that you'll probably be there longer. At a state school with fees of $3,000/yr, that's not a huge problem. At a big-name institution for $30,000/yr, it's a whole other story.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: ginny
Date: 2007-07-22 19:25
It seems that when we looked at this it varied greatly from school to school depending in part on how they did GE requirements.
A handful of schools, the University of Santa Clara being one, requirements outside your department are just classes in another department, rather than special non-major classes. It is not uncommon to have double and triple majors there as a result. Basically the general ed classes are part of your extra majors, but you don't get these waterdown GE classes, all real classes.
I vaguely recall that Northwestern is one.
I recall that UCLA is very difficult, as they have unit limits. You have to move on.
Both of my sons are taking double majors, the clarinetist is double majoring in clarinet performance and physics (switched from math and music this year) and had figured out how to graduate in 4 years. It requires a heavily load every semester and hinges on getting in all the classes. He is not taken summer classes (working on the computer programs for the Keck telescope instead.) My other son is double majoring in poli sci and econ and will take an extra semester, he works as much as 30 hours a week as a movie projectionist for the most part, while doing this. He takes summer classes as well.
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