 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: ClaireTune
Date: 2007-05-27 17:25
My son sometimes complains that he can not blow, or he 'has no air'. This happens more oftern in the morning on weekends or sometimes when he is tired. Then I heard the complain about headache. Is this normal? I sometime wonder whether he is fit to play clarinet. But he seems to like it. Any comments?
(He is 13, played for about 2 years. Now using Vandoren B45 mouth piece with Vandoren V12 #3 reed).
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Author: chumbucket804
Date: 2007-05-27 18:29
I get this occasionally too. If I have time before I start practicing I do some breathing exercises. I set the met around 100 then take 4 counts of air in (through my horn) and exhale 4 counts out. I repeat that a few times and then increase the amount of counts exhaled by 4 and repeat more. I do that until I get to 20 counts exhaled and then I go to only 2 counts of inhaling. By the end I feel a little dizzy but I rest maybe 30 seconds before I begin playing again. When I start playing, my lungs feel more open, and my chest is relaxed so it is easier to take air in.
I'm not sure about the headaches though. For me, playing actually helps my headaches. It's a way of relaxing I suppose.
Just one thing to check is proper reed size. Make sure it is not too hard as that can cause the no air problem and perhaps the headaches.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2007-05-27 18:34
I'd be a bit worried about the headaches, especially with 2 years' experience. I think it couldn't hurt to ask the doctor about this.
--
Ben
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Author: grifffinity
Date: 2007-05-27 18:51
Is it normal to get headaches from playing clarinet - no.
The possible cause:
Three causes I can imagine from your post: 1.) The mouthpiece/reed strength combination is not right for your son - causing him to "blow too hard" 2.) he is not expelling enough air when playing or 3.) some underlying medical issue.
My advice - find a clarinet teacher and have a consultation in person. An immediate experiment is to try a softer reed - 2 or 2 1/2, but IMO nothing beats a private lesson with a qualified teacher. You can find one by contacting your local public school band director, college or community ensemble.
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Author: Sea Galan
Date: 2007-05-27 19:36
I have the feeling that he is using the wrong kind of mouthpiece and read. I would get him a more easy flowing mouthpiece and maybe go down to a #2 reed. I have a 13 year old grandson that has been playing clarinet for two years at school and he uses a #2 reed. He says that even a #2.5 reed is too hard for him. He is using a student brand x mouthpiece. About the headaches I would talk to a clarinet music teacher and see if she/he has similar complains from other students of his own age and experience. Good Luck.
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Author: pelo_ensortijado
Date: 2007-05-27 21:21
judging by the strong reedsize and the teacher who wont find anything wrong i think that he need to seriously relax!!!
it sounds allmost like a problem i had some while ago. and that was all about tensed muscles! same symptoms like when one are getting really stressed out!
there is no need for him to overuse his emboshure or jaw! one is not suppose to use the muscles like hell to get a grip of the clarinet. that will only make the muscles to create pain to make one relax!
my suggestion is that he changes the reedsize and learn to NOT bite. finding a relaxed and good playing possition is for me, the #1 question!!
indications of NOT biting is for example :
when his lower lip dont have a cut in it by the lower teeth/when it wont hurt!
or when he is playing, you are able to move the skin on the jaw without using power!(the muscles under the skin are not overworking!)
if biting is not the problem, then he maybe is tensing hes muscles somewhere else on the upper half of the body! maybe the neck.
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2007-05-27 21:26
the headaches can't be a good thing? did they start reciently? does he get them in other situations(running, swimming, etc)?
B45 is really probably too big for him; they require a lot of power and control. 5RV might be better.
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Author: stevensfo
Date: 2007-05-27 22:22
Isn't this deja vu?
I'm sure we had an almost identical post a few weeks ago about a teenager and a B45 mouthpiece/ too strong reed combination.
The headaches may be caused by the considerable jaw pressure/lip pressure and stress while he tries to control the reed.
He should try a lower strength reed.
Steve
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Author: Clarinet4hire
Date: 2007-05-27 22:26
Sorry skygardener, but I have to disagree with you. When any mouthpiece is set up right, they will blow very easily. If it doesn't, you have the wrong equipment on it. ( this is taking into consideration it is not warped.) I find it very hard to think a B45 would be too big for him. If the tip were wide open, I might -MIGHT-say okay, but rather-the opposite is true. It has a close tip.
A B45 will play fine with the proper reed and ligature. A 3 Vandoren is too heavy. A 2-2.5 is the right range. Rico reeds might play alright with a 3. I would also recommend an inverted Bonade ligature. Just make sure the bars on the ligature are parallel-evenly spaced. It is fairly affordable at around $25.00.
Sometimes, when someone says they don't have enough air, it is because the reed is too soft-shutting off. That will cause the same problems like the headaches, etc. But because it is a B45, a 3 would be quite heavy, and I'd recommend a softer reed first.
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2007-05-28 04:14
Clarinet4hire - "Sorry skygardener, but I have to disagree with you."
Go right ahead and do so. In my experience with clarinets and mouthpieces, I would never give a B45 to someone that is 13 years old. A softer reed will induce biting, pull the pitch way up, and create more problems for someone in this situation.
For an adult, it'd be fine, but for someone that has only 2 years playing and is 13 it will not fit. He can keep it and when he's 16 or 17 he can go back to it.
My advice is to stay with 3 reeds and move to a mouthpiece that has a shorter facing curve and small tip opening.
I would also keep track of when and under exactly what conditions do these headaches happen. Is there a relation to time of day? Temperature of room? After/before eating? What kind of bed does he sleep on? Does he sit or stand when he practices? If he sits, is the chair too high or low? If he stands, is there a difference in ther length of his right and left legs?
Etc, etc, etc...
Post Edited (2007-05-28 12:22)
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Author: BobD
Date: 2007-05-28 14:25
"But he seems to like it. Any comments? "
Oh, you mean playing clarinet. B45 plus #3.....bad. Search here for "student" mouthpieces and get him one along with some 2 1/2 reeds. Keep the B45 and 3s for the future.
Bob Draznik
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Author: Clarinet4hire
Date: 2007-05-29 15:16
Skygardener-I wish to recommend some reading to you from someone who new what he was talking about. His name was Daniel Bonade. He was only the most influential person of his day, and his techniques are still being taught by the most prestigious schools in America-maybe elswhere as well. In his "Clarinet Compendium," and a biography on him called; "Daniel Bonade: A founder of the American Style of Clarinet Playing"- by Carol Anne Kycia, you will learn that a close tip -shorter curve- takes a SOFT reed-litlle lone that, experience will show this to you. That, however is irrelavant, because when a mouthpice is set up with the proper reed, they will always blow easy. Never should a person ever bite. That is a bad habit that will tranfer to any eqipment a student will use unless it is kicked in the backside and corrected. Pitch problems are not caused by the proper reed strength for the mouthpiece. This can be caused by using a reed that is too soft for the mouthpiece (and that is because it will shut off and the student will try to bite because it feels like it is hard to blow), or a poor embachure, the wrong ligature, improperly adjusted key/pad height, pad leaks, the wrong barrel, or the student may simply just blow flat(which there are ways to compensate).
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Author: skygardener
Date: 2007-05-29 22:53
Dear '4hire,
With all due respect I inform you that I make and adjust mouthpieces. I do not claim to know more than you, nor less (as you suggest.)
I gave my opinion about the question asked.
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Author: juan07
Date: 2007-05-30 02:12
he might also be too harsh on his playing himself. I used to have this over stress and frustration on hard pieces. Playing and pratising she be taken easy .
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Author: Clarinet4hire
Date: 2007-06-07 17:55
I would like to apologize to skygardener, as I was wrong to give you such a strong reply. I was also wrong to say a close tip takes a soft reed, as it does not, after re-reading the Bonade myself. However, Bonade did say that he took his students that had a tendacy to bite, and purposefully put them on softer reeds untill they quit biting on those, so they would break the habit and not bite on the harder reeds. Pitch problems are also caused by biting. Most pitch problems get corrected once the biting problem has been fixed.
I wouldn't hesitate putting any student on a "professional" mouthpiece if they could afford one. The sooner the better. When equipment is matched up properly, producing a great sound and dexterity, and endurance are easily mastered with a short time.
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