 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: ElBlufer
Date: 2007-04-29 19:38
Next year I will be in two band classes at my high school, and will therefore be asked to play a second instrument. I am therefore using this as an opportunity to learn to play bass clarinet as well as soprano clarinet.
I have already decided to buy a fobes debut mouthpiece and a bonade ligature for bass clarinet, but I am wondering what size reeds I should buy. Also, I was looking at both the Gonzales FOF's and the Vandorens, and I was wondering if the Gonzales reeds are comparable in quality to their Bb counterparts. I thank you for your advice
PS: If this has been posted before, I apologize, I was not sure what search terms to use to get the correct posting.
My Setup:
R13 Clarinet (Ridenour Lyrique as my backup/marching instrument)
Walter Grabner K11 mouthpiece
Rico Reserve 3.5's
Bonade ligature
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: samohan245
Date: 2007-04-29 19:41
start on a 2 or 3
and use standard mouthpieces and lig.
dont all and out on a instrument u havent started playing yet
i also play both bass and soprano
it is a big step
ur lungs will vibrate like crazy and it might feel weird but it is a awesome experience
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: SVClarinet09
Date: 2007-04-29 19:58
I disagree with samohan.
The Fobes debut mouthpiece is an excellent student mouthpiece. The bonade ligature is great too. Bass clarinet is like soprano in many instances. I too picked up bass this year for Youth Orchestra. I use Vandoren 2.5s(since I only play at YO once a week) You could also experiment with Tenor Sax reeds. They fit too. The Gonzalez reeds on Bass that I have found are only RC and I don't really like them. The Bass Clarinet takes more breath support than soprano. Make sure you take in more mouthpiece too. Walter Grabner has an excellent article on his website that you should read.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: LarryBocaner ★2017
Date: 2007-04-29 22:29
Well, I have points of disagreement with both the previous posters. I have no personal experience with the Fobes debut mouthpiece, but I assume it is an "honest" product based on Clark Fobes' fine reputation. That said, noting that you play a #4 reed on Bb clarinet, I would suggest that you play at least a #3 on bass. Vandoren bass clarinet reeds are good, but very inconsistent. I am playing on Gonzalez #3-3/4 reeds right now, which I find to be excellent. I don't recommend tenor sax reeds for bass clarinet because I think that the resistance is usually too "easy" making for a "soupy" sound in the 2nd register.
My most important recommendation is that you find a teacher who really knows how to play the bass clarinet, if only for two or three lessons. You will waste a lot of time and, likely, make some wrong turns trying to re-invent the wheel all by yourself!
I hope you will find your bass clarinet experience rewarding. Almost all of my bass clarinet "convert" students say that learning to play the basscl has made them better at playing the Bb clarinet, too.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: JJAlbrecht
Date: 2007-04-29 22:56
According to the Fobes website, he makes SIX different mouthpieces for Bass, including the Debut, which is the least expensive of the bunch. The Debut is $59, the Nova is $139, and the rest are $260 each.
Given the prices, I think the Debut is a good option for a person tryoing the instrument for the first time.
http://www.clarkwfobes.com/Low%20Clarinets.html
Jeff
Post Edited (2007-04-29 22:59)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: ElBlufer
Date: 2007-04-30 00:09
Thanks for the advice...I guess that I'll start on Vandoren 3 1/2s. and if they're too hard I'll just adjust them using sandpaper and such. I found the fobes debut at muncywinds.com, as wwbw.com doesn't seem to carry them.
Also, thank you for pointing on the article from Mr. Grabner, as I'm sure that it will be very helpful.
Thank you for everything!
By the way...although I will not be able to get a bass clarinet teacher (my parents already hate paying for my weekly Soprano clarinet lessons), any other advice I get from you guys would be great!
My Setup:
R13 Clarinet (Ridenour Lyrique as my backup/marching instrument)
Walter Grabner K11 mouthpiece
Rico Reserve 3.5's
Bonade ligature
Post Edited (2007-04-30 00:10)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: clarnibass
Date: 2007-04-30 04:28
Clark Fobes said his mouthpieces (I play one on bass clarinet) are basically made to work with Vandoren reeds, and that he doesn't like Gonzalez reeds as much with them. I found Gonzalez to work ok, but I also prefer Vandoren. I'd say start with soft reeds and move up if/when you need. If you have a store that will sell single reeds then buy a couple of each size and try.
I also think the most important is to have a good bass clarinet teacher. If you can't then maybe try to find someone who can sit with you one time and help you with the basics, maybe a goos student who play bass clarinet, etc.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-04-30 08:30
"but I am wondering what size reeds I should buy"
Bass clarinet-sized reeds.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2007-04-30 11:54
Large reeds almost always warp. Because the bark on the top prevents expansion there, the warping produces a ridge down the middle on the bottom, which prevents sealing on the mouthpiece table. This produces squeaks, kills the response and makes the clarion register difficult to play.
I get reeds one strength harder than I play, or even two strengths harder, and flatten the bottom on 600 grit sandpaper over a sheet of plate glass. Put your fingers on the bark and press hard, working until the part of the bottom that rests on the mouthpiece table is mirror-smooth all over. Then I work gently on the rest of bottom.
Bass is less tolerant of leaks than soprano and gets out of adjustment more easily. Handle it with kid gloves. Test the double register key mechanism at least once a week, since it gets out of adjustment constantly.
I play double lip, to keep the vibrations from scrambling my brain.
Good luck.
Ken Shaw
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-04-30 12:07
Try tenor sax reeds - there's a huge choice and variety of them compared to the limited choice of bass clarinet specific reeds - and they're essentially the same thing anyway.
I like Vandoren Java tenor sax reeds on bass clarinet.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Don Berger
Date: 2007-04-30 13:11
As usual, Ken Shaw's advice is superb. I too have found that "back sanding" a "slightly too-hard" reed provides the best way to "get acquainted". I tend to prefer tenor sax reeds, because of a wider choice in a smaller music store/mail-order, some for sax may be slightly wider than the B C reeds, and will cover the mp's rails, [perhaps refaced?] more securely. Playing concert band music, only occasionally above the lower clarion, with a fairly wide tip opening mp, I use a 2 1/2, or 2, or a clipped 1 1/2 for both ease of playing and a clear chalameau. Try them out, Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Terry Stibal
Date: 2007-04-30 14:22
One factor to consider here, one that I usually forget when dealing with student horns at the secondary level, is that all students have to purchase their own mouthpiece and ligature. (Back in the good old days, that was not so - I acquired my first bass clarinet mouthpieces some years after starting on the instrument.)
So, going for a "quality" mouthpiece when one has to be purchased in any even may make more sense here.
One thing that troubles me is the over-all hardness of the reeds being considered. In my opinion (that of a forty plus year player on the horn), you would do better to start with softer reeds and a slightly more open mouthpiece. With the proper amount of mouthpiece in the mouth, you will get a better sound overall.
One thing that I would be angling for is a decent neck for the horn. Nothing bothers me more than watching young players trying to contort their necks to accommodate the maker's "tenor sax" style necks. Charles Bay and others offer necks with a much more accommodating angle for the horn, and that's something that I would urge a serious student to seek as soon as possible.
Finally, my cautions about maintenance. With the possible exception of the baritone saxophone, the bass clarinet purchased by a school system is going to be the most abused and least kept in adjustment horn that you will ever use. Try to get one assigned to you alone, then get it maintained properly and protect it against any further abuse.
I have seen no end of questionable bass clarinet players (many my students at the time) "take off" once they get the right equipment and a working horn.
Oh, and don't be tempted by the inexpensive Ridenour bass clarinet...
leader of Houston's Sounds Of The South Dance Orchestra
info@sotsdo.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: LarryBocaner ★2017
Date: 2007-04-30 15:08
Good advice, Terry!
Some comments:
Fobes Debut has opening of 170 according to his website. I categorize that as medium open - just about perfect for optimum sound, ease of playing and wide dynamic range.
#3-1/2 Vandorens should be alright for an experienced player on this mouthpiece -- I suggest starting with #3's for a newbie!
Bay necks can be good; unfortunately he usually requires the purchase of one of his (expensive) mouthpieces along with the neck -- I don't care for his mouthpieces at all!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: LarryBocaner ★2017
Date: 2007-04-30 20:33
Chris P writes: "Try tenor sax reeds - there's a huge choice and variety of them compared to the limited choice of bass clarinet specific reeds - and they're essentially the same thing anyway." With all due respect, perhaps that's why I hear such indifferent sounds coming from so many Brit bass clarinet players on recordings!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: ElBlufer
Date: 2007-04-30 22:13
Thanks for the continued advice. Unfortunately, as our school only has 3 bass clarinets (well, 4 if you include the new Professional Low C Selmer we're getting), I doubt that I will be able to get an intrument assigned specifically to me (although, i will try for the new Selmer, as that has the least chance of being abused). In this case, I will also not be able to purchase a neck, but I am pretty sure that our's are not tenor-sax-like.
The consensus seems to be that I should play either a 3 or a 3 1/2 given my Bb setup + what I am purchasing, so I think I will buy 3 1/2's (as I said), and just play on needing to adjust them down in strength a bit. Regarding Tenor Sax Reeds...I will try it (as I own some ZZ 3's from when I tried tenor last year), but I'm a little skeptical.
Again, I thank you for your continuing input.
My Setup:
R13 Clarinet (Ridenour Lyrique as my backup/marching instrument)
Walter Grabner K11 mouthpiece
Rico Reserve 3.5's
Bonade ligature
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: shadowing
Date: 2007-05-01 04:28
ElBlufer, out of curiousity from your ISP, do you live in South CA also?
Besides going off topic, I was in a similar situation to yours around a year back. I highly recommend starting off with a well-made mouthpiece, such as the Debut. I immediately used size 3 Vandoren reeds. I find them very consistent in the clarion range.
After you get used to the setup or so, I'd recommend getting a Grabner mouthpiece if you are still serious... I did and am enjoying the Grabner immensely.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: ElBlufer
Date: 2007-05-01 05:48
Yes, i do live in So Cal, and the Grabner may be something for the future...but that is something that only time will tell.
My Setup:
R13 Clarinet (Ridenour Lyrique as my backup/marching instrument)
Walter Grabner K11 mouthpiece
Rico Reserve 3.5's
Bonade ligature
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Chris P
Date: 2007-05-01 16:15
"With all due respect, perhaps that's why I hear such indifferent sounds coming from so many Brit bass clarinet players on recordings!"
Maybe it's the same bass clarinet player playing on all the recordings.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
