 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Alexis
Date: 2007-03-16 12:21
Hi
I have read in quite a number of places that using pressure from your top lip is useful for your (single lip) embouchure. I am curious as to why this is.
Thanks
Alex
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Author: William
Date: 2007-03-16 13:55
It seems to help the traditional single lip embouchure play more like the double lip. Using more upper lip spreads support for tone production more evenly around the whole oral area creating a more resonant and flexible tone quality, improved control of intonation and--by reducing the tendency to over-bite--causes less lower lip pain and fatigue. Also, less tooth imprint damage to the beaks of your treasured mouthpieces and--for me, anyhow--less upper tooth pain and displacement from hours (years) of playing.
Using more upper lip support when playing clarinet also seems to make the switch to saxophone style embouhure easier. On sax, there are many more tuning issues to deal with, not to mention the tone bending licks you need to master for jazz.
Bottom line, learning to use more upper lip simply gives you more control of you tone and intonation.
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Author: Bassie
Date: 2007-03-16 20:10
It stops your teeth hurting and stops the dents in your mouthpiece. This is how I play: almost at the point of lift-off into double lip. The teeth, I think, help control the position of the mouthpiece. Double-lip is useful on occasion for tone/tuning control. Almost-double-lip is a good compromise.
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Author: D
Date: 2007-03-16 20:43
my front teeth are crumbling, so my lip has to provide the strength that they cannot. I am so glad that I discovered mouthpiece cushions, when I used to play the sax at school I never knew about them and it used to make my teeth hurt with the vibration.
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Author: Morrigan
Date: 2007-03-16 21:41
My old teacher taught me to use the top lip as a way of 'covering' harsh high notes, and it worked. Lately I've been experimenting with double lip and it's improved my single-lip no end! What I try to do now is play with double-lip, just put the teeth on the mouthpiece instead, very close to the lip with it still curled over a bit. If I can work my way up to using double-lip permanently, I think I will, it seems to produce the best sound for me and for the most part gives me plenty of control.
So try double-lip as part of your practice. You might be pleasantly surprised!
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Author: Alexis
Date: 2007-03-17 08:19
These all seem like good reasons. I don't really know how much I use - I am generally more conscious of the corners of my embouchure. However, I have never had any problems with sore teeth or dents in my mouthpiece.
However, I believe when we say to use the top lip it is a short cut for achieving something else.
Using more top lip cannot DIRECTLY influence the reeds vibration as there is no point of contact.
Using more top lip cannot support the clarinet any better (as it has no grip on the clarinet mouthpiece) and all the force is acting downwards.
I suspect using it opens the oral cavity a little more and perhaps discourages biting (by taking away the attention from the bottom lip). I also feel it might encourage using the corners of the mouth to control the reed's vibration.
I know that its a technique that works for some people. However I would really like to know why, partly for my own benefit, and partly for use as a teaching technique. Does anyone have any other ideas as to what "using more top lip" achieves in physical terms?
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Author: musiq
Date: 2007-03-18 00:36
The top lip is very important. It helps alot with control and ease of intervals.
1. The top lip is very important becasue it helps eliminate the air leak that alot of players have. The seal that is created around your mouthpiece does not just involve your corners.
2. By engaging your top lip you are also helping to keep your chin flat/down. When you stretch your top lip downward your chin automatically goes flat/down. It is nearly imposible to keep your chin from doing this when using your top lip properly.
Also, by using the top lip it helps recreate some of the benifits of a double lip embouchure but while still using a more practical single lip embouchure.
I hope this was of some help. These ideas are not originally mine. They are things that I have learned from some great teachers.
On another note: I don't think it is a good idea to think of "all the force is acting downward" when you are playing. I believe there should be some leverage to the top teeth.
**personally I cant imagine playing something like the opening section of Copland with out using my top lip**
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Author: Alexis
Date: 2007-03-18 00:56
Sorry I was unclear when I said "the force is acting downwards". Clarinet is being affected by gravity. Gravity is opposed largely by the right thumb and the bottom lip.
The two teeth do give the clarinet leverage. However, the top lip cannot exert a force opposing gravity.
I am not sure about the top lip support stopping an air leak. You can seal the clarinet in many many different ways, and certainly don't need the top lip to curl in a manner akin to double lip.
However I do like the idea that it enforces the chin stretch.
It is these type of follow-on effects I am more interested in.
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Author: musiq
Date: 2007-03-18 02:08
I would like to start with that I am not trying to come up with a snooty response.
Alexis, You said that there are many many different ways in which you can make a seal. My question to you is: what are these ways? But I guess not only what are these many many ways but also which of these ways is a good technique that results in good sound/ good intonation/ good projection/and efficient for ease of playing.
For clarification: I wasn't saying that the top lip has to curl inward .Im not sure if this is what you thought I meant when you said ,"certainly don't need the top lip to curl in a manner akin to double lip." Even though I know some wonderful players who do this(curl top lip in) and sound great, for me I don't anymore because I feel that tucking my top lip in prevents me from really getting my corners in.
Also to see some of the benefits of the top lip try playing and making a conscious effort to not engage the muscles in the top lip. Then play your normal way. Was there a difference? Im thinking that if you are enjoying what you hear when you normally play that you are using your top lip and may not know how much. Its possible that you may not know the benefits of the top lip until after you take its musculature away.
On a teaching note: If you hear problems in your students playing but aren't quite sure how to fix it it is good to try and recreate the sound they are producing. Sometimes by doing this you can figure out what there are doing wrong physically that your eyes cant see as easily. Alexis, Im mentioning this because in your earlier post you mentioned you were wondering what the benefits of top lip were as a teaching technique.
Happy clarinetting:-)
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