 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: DressedToKill
Date: 2006-10-23 03:06
This weekend, Morrie Backun was in NYC with a vast selection of barrels, bells, mouthpieces...and the new clarinets.
I was there on Saturday morning, and spent several hours with these horns...they are indeed the most spectacular instruments I have ever played, and I will be purchasing one in the
very near future. The intonation is absolutely flawless, the ease and fluidity
from the bottom of the range to the top is unparalleled, and I have
NEVER felt keywork that comfortable or solid, or that moves as fast as
they do. The wood used is beautiful, and I couldn't imagine a nicer guy
than Morrie!
It was also nice to spend some time chatting with Eddie Daniels and
some of the Met section...I went to my pit gig that day with a whole new
sense of inspiration.
I would absolutely recommend that everyone who can try these
clarinets...even the least expensive model, the Cadenza, plays circles around any horn I've played. (And I had my rosewood Opus AND my Infinite with me to compare...absolutely no contest!)
Congrats, Morrie...you hit this one out of the ballpark!
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Author: chito
Date: 2006-10-23 14:42
Almost every day im reading this board its very helpul . Im looking for similar topic before but cant find .
DressedToKill how about the new symphonie model did you played that?
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Author: DressedToKill
Date: 2006-10-23 14:50
Yes, I played all three: the Cadenza, the Symphonie, and the Legacy; and I played about 5 specimens of each model. They were remarkably consistent from individual instrument to individual instrument, and I fell instantly in love with the Symphonie (which has many of the features of the Legacy, such as the myriad adjusting screws, although not quite as many, and the meticulous tonehole undercutting and chamfering). It's also at a price point that I am comfortable parting with in the next couple of months; although I'm also contemplating buying the Cadenza and just getting a cocobolo bell seperately, which would be considerably easier on the wallet.
Worth absolutely every penny, though, as far as I'm concerned.
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Author: David Peacham
Date: 2006-10-23 16:11
"just getting a cocobolo bell seperately"
so the bell made a difference? to every note? to some notes?
excuse lowercase; left arm is in a sling
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If there are so many people on this board unwilling or unable to have a civil and balanced discussion about important issues, then I shan't bother to post here any more.
To the great relief of many of you, no doubt.
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Author: DressedToKill
Date: 2006-10-23 17:03
The bell definitely made a difference. I was as skeptical as anyone about it, but I tried the bells on my own clarinets, and then I fiddled with various bells on the new B/L horns, and they really do have an effect. (I even put my stock rosewood Opus bell on the B/L horns, and it was definitely noticeable.)
The break was much smoother, and there was a lovely clarity to the right hand notes that was particularly enhanced with the bells that had the voicing groove as opposed to the ones that did not.
(I also, personally, happen to find the aesthetic absolutely STUNNING, but I realize the look isn't everyone's cup of tea.)
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2006-10-23 18:43
Josh, what a good report. I'm still lusting after getting one of those new Backun clarinets, however, it'll have to wait a few months. I, too, was stunned at what a difference the bell made in my Opus II. I never would have believed it, although my former clarinet instructor (Raphael Sanders) told me he always play-tests dozens of bells and barrels with each new clarinet he selects because bells make a difference.
Morrie is a great guy. Leblanc really will get a boost from his expertise. Thanks for sharing your experience.
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Author: nickma
Date: 2006-10-23 21:51
Don't know if the parallel is valid, but a Backun 'pocket' Coco bell on my R13 adds depth, colour and solidity, whilst perhaps losing a touch of effervescence...
Nick
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Author: jmberch
Date: 2006-10-23 23:57
how would you describe the tone quality of each horn, for ex....round, centered, mellow, dark, bright...
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2006-10-24 00:02
jmberch wrote:
> how would you describe the tone quality of each horn, for
> ex....round, centered, mellow, dark, bright...
And that would help us all exactly ... how? I know from personal experience that people don't agree on any of those terms when they hear the same person playing live.
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Author: jmberch
Date: 2006-10-24 00:04
geez....i'm sorry....in your own words....how would you describe the tone quality...better?
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Author: Gregory Smith ★2017
Date: 2006-10-24 00:10
I'm sorry to sound like a broken record and I'm all for revolutions but:
The most important question in this continuing discussion seems to be overlooked in regard to the quality of these new instruments both now and in the future.
**Has anyone tried these new clarinets from an actual production line where they will inevitably be made? Or are these pre-production specimens?**
As every manufacturer is well aware, those will be the instruments that the true degree of both quality and consistency will ultimately be determined.
Gregory Smith
http://www.gregory-smith.com
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Author: Koo Young Chung
Date: 2006-10-24 00:20
First impression is important but usually doesn't last.
Let's see how you feel after you bought and played a couple of months.
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Author: Morrie Backun
Date: 2006-10-24 00:42
Hi Greg,
Very good question that you posed.
The instruments were all shipped to New York directly from Leblanc and were off the assembly line, with no extra "tweaking" done. I had requested this so that I could evaluate how the instruments were coming out when I was not working on them myself. So these were in fact "off the line" production instruments.
I was pleased and very gratified by the response from players. So many were ordered on the spot, and the level of players testing them was extraordinarily high. Leblanc has invested an enormous amount in new equipment, designs and personnel. It is wonderful to see a major manufacturer investing in the Clarinet market.
I have been spending a great deal of time, for several months, in Kenosha working with the professional assembly group and training the plant personnel in the special techniques and tooling applications that we have designed uniquely for these instruments. It is exciting to be a part of this new venture. Hopefully it will help to elevate the level of equipment that we, as clarinet players have to choose from.
With best wishes,
Morrie Backun
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Author: L. Omar Henderson
Date: 2006-10-24 01:40
Morrie - when are you going to bring some of the innovations and improvements to the entry, beginning-student level clarinets - i.e. plastic horns? We are blessed with a surfeit selection of higher end clarinets from the major manufacturers which IMHO have not trickled down to where they are needed too.
L. Omar Henderson
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Author: Gregory Smith ★2017
Date: 2006-10-24 02:04
Thanks Morrie -
I'm sure that I and others are glad to have an answer to this oft repeated question.
Gregory Smith
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2006-10-24 03:55
Yes, thanks Morrie! That is very nice to know. I'm glad your hand is still in things and you're having such great influence over the process. The clarinet makers of the world have needed some new "punch" in the process for a long time.
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Author: DressedToKill
Date: 2006-10-24 20:11
"geez....i'm sorry....in your own words....how would you describe the tone quality...better?"
I won't try to use words like "dark" or "bright" or all those other things that make no sense to anyone, but what I *will* say about these clarinets is from the first open G I played on even the least expensive (I cannot in good conscience say "cheapest") model, I had the exact sound I have had in my head since I was a young teenager. Everything I played sounded the way I have always wanted to/thought I should sound like, and whether you would call it dark or bright or liquid or chocolatey or velvety or round or smooth...it was my ideal clarinet tone.
They're also the most comfortable clarinets, to MY hands, anyway, that I have ever played.
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Author: J. J.
Date: 2006-10-24 21:42
"...I had the exact sound I have had in my head since I was a young teenager. Everything I played sounded the way I have always wanted to/thought I should sound like, and whether you would call it dark or bright or liquid or chocolatey or velvety or round or smooth...it was my ideal clarinet tone."
I don't mean to discount your own personal experience, but there is absolutely no way this phenomenon was the result of the instrument you picked up. Sure, the instrument may have been a little better here or there. If you used a new mouthpiece, that's one more factor that might have aided you. Still, that instrument sounded that way to you for reasons unrelated to the body itself:
1) Desire: You WANTED, ever so desperately, for that instrument to sound amazing. You believed it would, and that made the most difference. It probably did sound a bit better.
2) Feel: My experience with these instruments (yes, I have played them) is that they can feel great, especially vibrating up through your head, but I doubt they actually sound all that different.
3) Perception: Again, you wanted it to sound better, so your mind heard what you wanted it to hear. In all likelihood, you probably sounded very similar, but a little difference here or there was enough to "convince" you.
Please don't misunderstand, I am not trying to bash these instruments. I have been critical of them in the past, but I've said all I need to at this point. I believe they are excellent mechanically, and the level of quality for the lowest priced model actually seems impressive.
That being said, we have all seen enough examples of how someone will eventually sound the same on any piece of equipment (or very close). The advantages in terms of mechanics, evenness, and tuning may put these instruments over the top for some. However, they in no way produce a better sound. Over time (a week, two weeks) a player will adjust and produce the same basic sound they would if they'd not picked up a new instrument. That's just the reality of what we do.
J.J.
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Author: Arnoldstang
Date: 2006-10-24 21:53
I agree with "JJ" and "dressed to kill". Both of you are right on the money. The only difference is perspective.
Freelance woodwind performer
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Author: BassetHorn
Date: 2006-10-24 22:16
Morrie, pull your strings with Leblanc and bring back the octocontrabass clarinets!
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Author: CPW
Date: 2006-10-24 22:38
Is it the "Next Best Thing"
or sighting the Emperor's New Clothes?
Wishing it will make it so.
It reached the "Tipping Point"
I think
Is "IT" Adiddas
Or now is "IT" Nike
Or Puma or British Knights?
No!....it's the promised land of
Darker Sound.
How I wish you would again see the LIGHT.
Against the windmills of my mind
The jousting pole splinters
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Author: DressedToKill
Date: 2006-10-24 23:07
I used my own Dan Johnston mouthpiece, and played them for quite some time, switching back and forth between the Backuns and my Opus...while it's very possible that there were psychological factors involved, there was, unquestionably, a difference between the two instruments. My Opus is absolutely mechanically perfect, having recently been completely overhauled, so it's not that the Backuns were better set up then my horn; I truly noticed a difference. Whether you, Eddie Daniels, Morrie, or Mrs. X in the third row would notice a difference in my sound between the two, I do not know; I only know that it FELT different, and in this case, "different" means better.
Obviously, I would have to spend several weeks with one to truly evaluate it, I am not naive or stupid enough to think that is not the case. I'm simply reporting my impression of the instruments as I played them for those who have yet to do so and may enjoy hearing one person's experience with the horns.
As with everything in clarinetistry (or the world, for that matter), YMMV. I just think they're worth trying, and would greatly encourage those who are interested to do so.
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Author: claclaws
Date: 2006-10-25 07:12
Are the Backun Leblanc clarinets only to be sold in the US? Any plan to sell overseas? or is it only by order?
Lucy Lee Jang
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Author: T.Wees
Date: 2006-10-25 08:12
Liquorice --
YMMV = Your Mileage May Vary. In other words, everyone's experience will be different.
I believe it originated with the disclaimer U.S. automakers put in their ad copy regarding the gas mileage their cars would get.
T. Wees
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Author: Mags1957
Date: 2006-10-25 11:49
First, thanks DressedToKill. You were obviously only giving your personal opinion, and I'm glad you shared it. I will be buying a new clarinet in a few months, and the Backun/Leblancs are definately on my "to try" list, along with the new Yamaha CSGH and a Selmer Recital (horns I've never tried).
As for one's experience with any new piece of equipment, I think there is value in feeling that you have the best set-up possible for you. Many times something that feels a lot better to you actually does play better, even if those around you can't hear it. I'm sure most of us have had the experience of playing two different reeds or mouthpieces that "sound the same" to others, but if they feel different to you in terms of resistance, than you greatly prefer one over the other.
For the record, I agree completely with those that feel that Harold Wright, Ricardo Morales, Roberts Macerllus, etc. would sound as great as they do on almost any set-up on almost any horn (within reason). However, I'm sure that they spent a good deal of time and energy finding a set-up that they felt comfortable with. I'm equally sure that no new mouthpiece/bell/barrel/instrument will make me a better player. However, it is important to me to feel as though I'm playing on the correct set-up for me. For those of us who may have the means and desire to seek out the "newset, latest, greatest" clarinet, mouthpiece, etc. - leave us alone already! If seeking new equipment gets in the way of your practice, or otherwise hurts your playing, it's time to consider your motivation. If, however, you feel like double-checking your set-up against the best that's available once every few years (or 10 years in my case), I don't see any harm. And it encourages the instrument/mouthpiece/ligature makers to keep raising the bar - a good thing, I think.
I just have been noticing that there is a tendency towards "old school snobbery" on this board at times. You know "If it can't be done on an R-13 with a Vandoren mouthpiece and a Bonade ligature, than you're just an equipment junkie - don't waste your time". Sheesh - even Bonade invented his own ligature - I'm sure there were many at the time who thought that was a waste of effort as well. And what a boring world it would be if we all agreed on the best clarinet or mouthpiece, or if we all sounded the same. I'm sure all those players from the past and present that we admire try new equipment from time to time, otherwise no one would be playing an R-13 or a Kaspar mouthpiece now - we'd all still be playing the same horns/reeds/mouthpieces they had in Stadler's day. <end of rant>
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Author: CPW
Date: 2006-10-26 01:00
Dressed: Nice website.
But that barrel on your horn....It doesn't look Backunish to me.
It looks more Grabneroid or Segalic to my eyes.
Against the windmills of my mind
The jousting pole splinters
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Author: Alseg
Date: 2006-10-26 15:20
CPW, I think "Grabneric" and " Segalesque" are more melifluent(sp?).
Then again, what about Fobesian and Muncyoid.
Former creator of CUSTOM CLARINET TUNING BARRELS by DR. ALLAN SEGAL
-Where the Sound Matters Most(tm)-
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Author: Alseg
Date: 2006-10-26 16:59
Aha, couldnt see the rings. Guess that is why he thought it was not Morrie's.
I agree with poster.... Well designed web site.
Former creator of CUSTOM CLARINET TUNING BARRELS by DR. ALLAN SEGAL
-Where the Sound Matters Most(tm)-
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