 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: vollkommen
Date: 2006-10-22 23:35
I've been wondering about the Yamaha student bass clarinet and its keywork for a few months now, but haven't been able to find any definitive answers. What I want to know is, since Yamaha markets this instrument by saying that the keywork on it is identical to that of the 621, does this mean that Yamaha put a double-register system on their student basses? Although it doesn't seem likely, it would explain why the Yamaha student models make the ones from Leblanc and Selmer sound cheap.
Does anyone actually know the answer to this question definitively?
Post Edited (2006-10-22 23:36)
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Author: swkeess
Date: 2006-10-23 01:52
I had a Yamaha 221 before I bought a Yamaha 621 and can definitely say that the student model 221 did not have a double-register system. The 621 does have this, however. As noted in several posts in the past, the YCL-221 has a problem with sharpness from clarion B on up. The 621 model does not seem to have this problem.
Susan Keess
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Author: allencole
Date: 2006-10-23 16:54
I have the newer model 221, with the body the breaks down into two parts. It does NOT have a double vent, although it responds very well. Tuning issues tend to diminish some of that response, though.
Allen Cole
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2006-10-23 19:43
A quickie search of "Yamaha AND bass clarinet" found 3 US patents which I've thot about " trying to tie" to their newer basses. They are 4,809,580 ; 4,848,206 ; and 4.922,792, and may show/describe what your are interested in. Go to USPTO.gov, Databases, Pat #'s for a look-see. Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: Low_Reed
Date: 2006-10-24 00:08
Ditto on the double-register decision: The 2-piece-body YCL-221 does not have it. And it does have some sharpness in the upper register. But I was able to eliminate almost all of this, as I described last year, at the other end of this link.
Since then I have been able to reduce the magnitude of the sharpness of the only remaining problem note: the long B. My ace woodwind expert increased the thickness of the cork on the "handle" of the bell-mounted low E-flat key, to reduce the size of that air passage when open. She put on just enough not to make the low E-flat stuffy.
There's still several cents' sharpness, but just in that one note. The rest us up to my ear, my lip, my throat, etc.
And, by the way, with either of my two Grabner mouthpieces: CXBB (now CXBB_PERS) or CXBB_90, the lack of a double register key mechanism has been reduced to a very minor problem.
Allen, did you try the extra O-ring trick yet?
Cheers,
Bruce
**Music is the river of the world!**
-- inspired by Tom Waits and a world full of music makers
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Author: allencole
Date: 2006-10-24 17:16
Haven't done that yet, Bruce. Did you need to do anything to your bridge key in order to use that trick?
Will follow your link to see what else you have on this. Love the horn, but it's really working my chops to tune it!
Allen Cole
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Author: allencole
Date: 2006-10-24 17:20
OUCH!!!
I just followed low reed's link, and found my own statement of intention to follow his suggestions. Haven't done it yet, and will start working to wipe that egg off my face...
Allen Cole
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Author: Low_Reed
Date: 2006-10-24 23:09
No, Allan, the extra o-ring provides a small enough gap that the bridge key sections still work properly as is.
Also, I should have said that the extra cork on my low E-flat key does not make the bottom of the chalumeau (low E, F, F#) stuffy. Of course, the bell tonehole is closed for low E-flat.
Allan, I'm curious to see if you get similar results with the o-ring. (But I wasn't trying to poke you, honest! All in good time.)
Bruce
**Music is the river of the world!**
-- inspired by Tom Waits and a world full of music makers
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Author: allencole
Date: 2006-10-25 15:57
How thick is your cork on the low E-flat key? Or...approximately how far do you allow your low E-flat pad to go from the tone hole?
Allen Cole
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Author: D
Date: 2006-10-25 18:59
Someone was playing a 221 in a quintet with me last week. The tuning was quite nasty in parts (she's just got it and it hasn't been fiddled with yet) but the actual sound was really really rather good. She commented that she wasn't having any double/single vent related problems and was very pleased with the way it responded.
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Author: Low_Reed
Date: 2006-10-26 03:27
Allen,
The modified cork is just under 3 mm thick. The low E-flat pad is 3mm from the top rim of the tone hole on the bell, and 7mm from the bottom rim of the tone hole.
I suggest you do a quick test, before putting on new cork and ordering the o-ring:
1) Use white plumber's tape to augment the existing cork.
2) Temporarily borrow one of the two bottom-joint o-rings, and put it on the middle joint. Careful - the lower joint connection to the bell will be less stable.
3) Work with your tuner and see what happens.
Let us know what you hear!
Bruce
**Music is the river of the world!**
-- inspired by Tom Waits and a world full of music makers
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