 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-08-19 18:34
I wouldn't bother glueing a sax or clarinet reed, but I have thought of running thin superglue down an oboe reed that split from the tip down to the binding, and still played for a long time considering it was split - I wonder if even soaking the cane in thin superglue might even plasticise the reed as well.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: D
Date: 2006-08-19 20:06
I'd check for toxicity of glue first. I think cyanoacrylate can burn you after prolonged contact, especially with the lips
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-08-19 21:13
Even after it's gone off?
I glue up (accidental) scalpel or razor cuts on my fingers with superglue to stop them opening up - could I be poisoning myself by doing this?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2006-08-19 22:18
Cyanoacrylate is - officially - used in medical environments. AFAIK it has a different solvent (that evaporates) than the oboe finishers' choice but I don't think that's a problem as long as one isn't prone to allergies.
I'd let the reed dry before using it, though. ![[wink]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie3.gif)
--
Ben
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Author: Chalumeau Joe
Date: 2006-08-19 23:20
A bit of googling came up with:
http://www.krazyglue.com/products/mkg0583_a.htm
Note item#10:
"10. Stability and Reactivity
Normally stable, but may become unstable at high temperatures or may
react with water."
Why screw around with something that may pose a health hazard? If you're reed is cracked, just throw it away and get a new one.
Joe
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-08-19 23:26
With the expensive nature of oboe reeds, it's not as easy as it is to do as it is with single reeds - so anything to get an oboe reed to last as long as possible is always a plus.
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2006-08-19 23:54
"...Two different brands of shoe patch glue have proven satisfactory; Kiwi Shoe Patch and Sportsman's Goop, and other brands are available. The labels warn against breathing of vapors, but the same warning is used for vapors of the same chemical used in airplane type glues used in sealing the string of the turks head of bassoon reeds and routinely soaked in the mouth of bassoonists. The amount of glue employed in the gluing processes of this article are relatively negligible, and there is no vapor or taste of glue after the reed has thoroughly dried..."
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Author: Alseg
Date: 2006-08-20 01:59
Disclaimer: Professional scalpel driver on closed course
Dont try this at home.
I glue incisions all the time (esp. laparoscopic slits, hernia incisions, etc) and use it on hangnails and my dogs' claws.
Ethicon, the largest manufacturer of sutures, produces it ...Dermabond....and it acts and smells just like KrazyGlue, only at ten times the cost (because of product liability issues.....drat those litigators)
So....once the volatile agent is gone...it is fine....."as seen on TV"
Former creator of CUSTOM CLARINET TUNING BARRELS by DR. ALLAN SEGAL
-Where the Sound Matters Most(tm)-
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Author: David Niethamer
Date: 2006-08-20 04:18
I have a Richmond Symphony bassoon colleague who has done this with his reeds for years. He wouldn't play "Rite of Spring" on it, but a repaired reed worked just fine for those Pops concerts and kiddie shows. Never trierd it on a clarinet reed.
David
David
niethamer@aol.com
http://members.aol.com/dbnclar1/index.html
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Author: Sean.Perrin
Date: 2006-08-20 05:15
Rather than do any of this, i'd just grab a new reed.
If you have time to glue a reed - or do whatever else you have contrived to fix it - you surely have time to get a new reed, even break in a new one... or grow your own cane and cut your own reeds for that matter.
Founder and host of the Clarineat Podcast: http://www.clarineat.com
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2006-08-20 06:39
"I glue up (accidental) scalpel or razor cuts on my fingers with superglue to stop them opening up - could I be poisoning myself by doing this?"
If you cut your finger a very good thing to put on it is instant coffee (I think that is the English name for it). Stops the bleeding very fast.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2006-08-20 09:12
"I glue up (accidental) scalpel or razor cuts on my fingers with superglue to stop them opening up - could I be poisoning myself by doing this?"
I've been doing this for a long time, when the cut is in a place where the skin is thick. The cut keeps tearing open up because it is the weakest place in the vicinity, and a tear takes longer to heal than a cut. So I do the instant superglue fix to make the area strong, so that I can carry on comfortably working. I just keep the finger away from the acetone solvent :-)
My web research found no problems at all associated with such use. What Alseq wrote supports this too. I suspect an MSDS sheet for cane might be more scary than one for set superglue.
My other approach for cuts on thick finger skin is to use a small diamond wheel to greatly thin down the skin around the cut. This reduces the stress that the cut itself is put under.
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Author: D
Date: 2006-08-20 10:06
I'm probably thinking of epoxy resins! I totally forgot superglue was developed to replace stiches......
I guess you can tell what sort of grade I got on chemistry from that!
I fixed my nanas broken china with some araldite the other day, not superglue. that what must be in my head. Perhaps I ought to go back to bed!
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Author: Bruno
Date: 2006-08-20 16:03
Chris said:
"Even after it's gone off?
I glue up (accidental) scalpel or razor cuts on my fingers with superglue to stop them opening up - could I be poisoning myself by doing this?"
No. Don't worry about toxicity of super glue. It's been used for years to "stitch" corneal lacerations with no untoward reactions.
As for soaking a reed in it as you would in a glass of water, I don't think it's possible.
Dr. b/
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-08-20 16:53
When I meant to say soaking a reed in superglue I should have added I wouldn't do this as I would normally do with a glass of water (by dunking the whole reed in), I'd add very thin superglue to the scrape with the idea (or hope) it gets absorbed into the cane as water does, though the superglue will harden, and with any luck it will stabilise the cane and eliminate the need to soak it to play it.
But is it better to add superglue to well soaked or dry cane? I know some woodies like to use superglue on damp surfaces of wood they're joining (not sure what the reasoning is behind this, but it seems to work for them), so would the soaked cane absorb thin superglue so the glue replaces the water, in a kind of osmosis sort of way?
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Alseg
Date: 2006-08-20 17:37
You mean to say you do NOT soak the reed in super glue???
Gee......now I know why I am so dizzy all the time. ![[grin]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie5.gif)
Some jazz sax players advocate an intentional slit be cut in the reed....maybe an excuse for glue?
Former creator of CUSTOM CLARINET TUNING BARRELS by DR. ALLAN SEGAL
-Where the Sound Matters Most(tm)-
Post Edited (2006-08-20 18:55)
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Author: Katrina
Date: 2006-08-21 03:06
I know a percussionist whose specialty is hand drums (doumbeki, dafi, etc.) and due to all the splits in his hands from smacking those things, he frequently patches them with superglue.
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Author: Ray
Date: 2006-08-21 04:11
I think the super glue bond to cane may not stand up to soaking the reed in saliva or water.
This I know for sure: water will destroy the bond of super glue to glass. Years ago I made a small aquarium to fit inside an old Macintosh computer case (Oh, how cute.). I made a lid for the aquarium out of several pieces of glass glued together so there would be a removable piece for feeding. For some reason (speed?) I chose to use super glue rather than the silicone seal I used for the aquarium proper.
The next day all seven separate little pieces of glass were at the bottom of the aquarium because condensed water had loosened the bonds. I also found thin sheets of super glue which looked like clear plastic.
Second, if you were to soak the tip of the reed in super glue (for longevity?) you would make the reed stiffer and heavier. This would make it play much harder, don't you think?
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2006-08-21 06:50
I agree that superglue on smooth surfaces that are not soluble in superglue, is not too successful under water.
However I think that applying THIN superglue to cane is very different to using it on glass. The superglue partially soaks INTO the cane, so that we finish up with a cane-fibre-reinforced polymer, and splits are successfully bridged by the polymer. IMHO
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-08-21 12:58
I remember the episode of Juliette Bravo with the glue-sniffers - it made my cousin feel sick!
I think they've taken toluene out of Evo-Stik now (probably some EEC regulation), and there have been complaints that it's not as good (in it's correct use) as before.
There was a water-based Evo-Stik which was pretty useless - it took ages to go off and was as weak as Copydex - but the one redeeming feature is that it didn't stink like Copydex does (which was somwhere between cat wee-wee and rotting fish)!
Former oboe finisher
Howarth of London
1998 - 2010
The opinions I express are my own.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2006-08-22 01:32
"I think they've taken toluene out of Evo-Stik now "
The Evostik I had imported from England a few months ago still had toluene in it. AS long as toluene is in petrol ("gas") I can't see it being removed form the contact glues that really work.
"Isn't glue addictive????"
We can't compare set glue with unset glue. They are quite different materials. Toluene is one of the materials that glue sniffers like to sniff, and glue sniffing may be addictive - perhaps mainly psychological - but I can't imagine there being much toluene remaining in toluene-based adhesives once they are set.
Likewise, for other solvents. (Superglue is not toluene based)
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Author: L. Omar Henderson
Date: 2006-08-22 01:58
I developed a process for crosslinking the cellulose strands in cane reeds which, by some long term testing by several players in a statistical way, made reeds last longer. The process was a take off on the garment manufacturers research to make permanent press pants in cotton material.
Alas it was a failure because reed companies did not want it -- they do not want reeds to last longer!
L. Omar Henderson
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Author: Bassie
Date: 2006-08-31 14:38
"We can't compare set glue with unset glue."
Yes indeedy. Epoxides - really, really nasty chemicals, react with all sorts of things. Set epoxy resins - practically inert. I guess it's that 'reactive chemicals react and then stop' principle - think sodium chloride. I believe set epoxy resins can be used in a variety of implants (please correct me if I'm wrong!)
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Author: Cuisleannach
Date: 2006-09-01 00:10
One possibility for the "glue-soaked reed" would be to use super glue along with a retardant, thus you could apply the glue all over, rub the excess off, and then let it sit quietly for the time it takes to set.
The only concern I'd have here is that cyanoacrylate glue is very hard but very brittle, and it's not very workable. Another alternative would be to use the glue that balsa modelers use. I have NO idea if it is safe for this and NO idea if it should even be put in the mouth, so I'm not suggesting it. (That should make the lawyers happy).
-Randy
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2006-09-01 01:46
The model aeroplane glue is much the same as nail plish, so once it is set, well..... finger nails get in mouths.
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