 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Alphie
Date: 2006-06-19 19:35
Last week we played our final concert before the summer holidays. We played the production: ”Play – a video game symphony”. It’s a production with music from some of the most popular video games on the market such as: ”The legend of Zelda”, ”Super-Mario” and ”Battlefield”. The conductor was one of the composers in the field Arnie Roth. The Japanese composer Uematsu was also there.
For the first time in our orchestras history the tickets were sold out three month before in only 20 minutes. There were ticket sales on the black market for five times the original price. The reception from the public was enormous and nothing like a classical concert. The kids I was talking to after the concert treated me like a rock star and they were stunned by admiration and promised to come back for more of our usual repertoire.
We learned something that night. It’s not the symphony orchestra or the usual repertoire that keep young people away from the concert halls. It’s the whole conservative idea and frame work of going to a classical concert. This, I think, was a good way to break the ice, at least for the kids who were there. They will tell their friends how cool it was to listened to a symphony orchestra and hopefully it’s a start of a new trend in my city. Step by step I think there is a way for our art form to survive the media jungle. Young people want to hear real music performed by real people if they get a chance to do so. Many of them don’t know they want to and have to be persuaded to do so by someone who's pushing the right button by playing music they know.
Alphie
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Author: 3dogmom
Date: 2006-06-19 19:45
That's a really interesting point you've made. People want to hear what they know. Back in the time of Beethoven and Mozart, people wanted to go to classical music concerts because they knew the music and liked the composers. Somewhere along the line we separated the two, perhaps because the new America didn't bring along with it its own classical composers. It's undeniable that jazz, blues, and the forms that came after it have their own huge audience. How many people can name a "modern" classical American composer? Not the average guy on the street, that's for sure. So how can audiences be expected to know that music, unless they've been exposed to it through education or by their parents. And, therefore, why would they go?
I performed with a small group yesterday at an arts festival. The members of the group prefer, in general, to perform esoteric works of the classical genre. I can see the (tiny) audience nodding off, then departing in boredom. However, when we play something they might know, whether it's pop, fiddle, or patriotic, they tap their toes and cheer loudly.
Sue Tansey
Sue Tansey
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Author: mtague
Date: 2006-06-19 21:14
I've been to a Final Fantasy game music concert. It was pretty neat. Honestly, video game music isn't always my favorite, but this sort of concert seems to be really popular with the younger crowd. Most people were my age or younger (teens to mid twenties). They were very excited to be there.
As for music, eh. I was at the BART station in SF a few years ago. Most people ignore the musicians playing there, but once there was a quartet of young people playing some classical pretty well. They had quite a large audience for the duration of a song. No one expected it and it was a nice surprise early in the morning. I've certainly never seen someone playing guitar or sax or belting out some upbeat song make as much money with one song as those people did. The venue makes a difference. They brightened a boring Monday with something nice and unexpected. I think an arts festival patron probably expects rock or jazz or something upbeat while they shop for handcrafted pottery. Classical in that situation would probably be "boring". Classical probably isn't as boring in a place like the MOMA.
Though maybe you can try doing an Apocalyptica sort of thing next time. People will at least be caught off-guard.
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Author: David Peacham
Date: 2006-06-19 21:15
"Somewhere along the line we separated the two, perhaps because the new America didn't bring along with it its own classical composers."
I don't know why you assume that this is unique to America. Alphie is in Sweden, remember.
I also suspect you are wrong that few people can name a modern classical composer. There is quite a substantial audience for modern composers of the minimalist school and the likes of Arvo Part and John Tavener. Whether these composers are worthy heirs to Bach and Beethoven is another matter, but at least they are aiming a little higher than MTV.
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If there are so many people on this board unwilling or unable to have a civil and balanced discussion about important issues, then I shan't bother to post here any more.
To the great relief of many of you, no doubt.
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Author: redwine
Date: 2006-06-19 22:21
Hello,
"I also suspect you are wrong that few people can name a modern classical composer."
Perhaps in the UK or Europe, you are correct, but here in the US, I would wager that you are wrong.
Ben Redwine, DMA
owner, RJ Music Group
Assistant Professor, The Catholic University of America
Selmer Paris artist
www.rjmusicgroup.com
www.redwinejazz.com
www.reedwizard.com
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Author: 3dogmom
Date: 2006-06-20 00:26
I hope I am wrong, but I feel that if you were to poll the average person on the street, and ask for the name of a classical composer, the "average" person would be hard pressed to come up with something more than Beethoven or Mozart. The occasional educated person might be able to remember Gershwin, or Copland.
Maybe I'm just letting my blue collar surroundings get to me. Hopefully you are right, and people out there are really interested in listening to "modern composers of the minimalist school and the likes of Arvo Part and John Taverner".
Don't shoot the messenger here - but there was a time when "classical" music, so to speak, was music that the common people knew. Unfortunately, now, I do not see that for the most part. I think we have to realize that we here on the board do not represent the "average" listening public. I teach and play among the "average" listening public.
Sue Tansey
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Author: ginny
Date: 2006-06-20 05:26
Hi Alphie,
My son Jesse who corresponded with you about AS sometime ago got a big grin on his face when he heard you'd played game music at the concert. I happen to like Uematsu's music, even though I don't play video games. I once sang (in parts) some Uematsu with two SF conservatory instructors of my aquaintance (after a Mexican dinner and some beer.) My Klezmer band (we aren't interested in being traditional or anything, mostly in their twenties) has been playing some video game music as well. Obviously gamer music lacks form (since it has to be played while in that bit of the game) but much of Uematsu's melodic and harmonic content seems very amusing and creative. I think he has inspired my younger son's interest in classical composition, as well as other young people I have contact with. All good stuff. It's not ALL that easy, look for the Blind Pianist on line, very fun and nice.
I started my kids playing (one on clarinet, the older one on bass) by transcribing videogame music for the three of us, and yes it helped get them interested. They got a recording of (perhaps the London) Symphony orchestra playing a bunch of it.
I really think it has gotten some kids more interested in classical music, as players, listeners and composers.
So, did you like the music at all?
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Author: David Peacham
Date: 2006-06-20 11:02
Have a look at amazon.com's classical best sellers list. This uses a very broad definition of classical - much of it is musicals, movie themes and the like.
Morton Feldman is at #19. Ranked in sales of music of all genres, he is just in the top 300.
Now, I'm not suggesting that the boyz are whistling Morton Feldman on the streets of Harlem. But I think this is evidence that some sort of mass market exists.
But I would agree that Marty Feldman is much more famous, were it not for the observation that Morton has him well beaten on Google.
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If there are so many people on this board unwilling or unable to have a civil and balanced discussion about important issues, then I shan't bother to post here any more.
To the great relief of many of you, no doubt.
Post Edited (2006-06-20 11:03)
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Author: BobD
Date: 2006-06-20 11:48
"People want to hear what they know."
That's a very thought provoking comment since peoples' tastes in music seem to have some relationship to their tastes in food.
Bob Draznik
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Author: David Peacham
Date: 2006-06-20 13:23
"People want to hear what they know."
But is it true? Think of modern pop culture (excuse oxymoron). Kids don't want to listen to last year's hit. They want today's hit. Maybe they want to hear it a dozen times nonstop, but still they want to hear what is new. Not the old stuff.
I think the same was true in Beethoven's day too. Most of us have heard every Beethoven symphony over and over again, and know them almost by heart. But that would not have been true in his day. People went to concerts to hear this year's work, not last year's.
I think the thing that puts many people off classical music (in the broad sense) is this reverence for the old. Unfortunately, so many of today's serious composers are unwilling (or unable) to write music that any sane person at all would want to listen to.
There's a good deal of discussion on this Board about the relative merits of different recordings of standard works. I've contributed to it myself. But this attitude is maybe part of the problem. Mozart didn't write his clarinet concerto so people could listen to twenty versions and analyse the differences. He wrote it to be played, enjoyed ...... and the world moves on.
I'm not advocating scrapping the classics, of course. But I don't think the classical music business does itself too many favours by emphasising the "great composers" so much as it does. It's a good way of attracting repeat business from a conservative listening public, but that listening public is relatively small. Growing the size of the listening public requires a different approach. We have tried "We know Beethoven, we like Beethoven, it's top-notch stuff, everyone has heard of him, play his music and they will come." It doesn't work.
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If there are so many people on this board unwilling or unable to have a civil and balanced discussion about important issues, then I shan't bother to post here any more.
To the great relief of many of you, no doubt.
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Author: Tony Beck
Date: 2006-06-20 13:30
While few people can name John Williams, I'd be willing to bet that most anyone on the street would recognize the music to Star Wars, Superman and any number of other scores he has written. Bernard Hermann would be in the same situation with older listeners, particularly with his score to Psycho.
Today we tend to define classical music too narrowly. As an example, while most movie scores are forgettable, some are the equals of Rossini or VonWeber. One day this music will be recognized as 20th century classical right along with Gershwin’s “Concerto in F” or Stravinsky’s “Rite of Spring”.
When I was a kid, one of my favorite albums featured a string quartet playing Beatles tunes, one of which was actually from Eric Coates “London Everyday” suite, via the Beatles. To me, it was just as classical as any Schubert quartet.
I’m not so sure that people want to hear just what they know, but hearing what they know gets them in the door and provides the performer a chance to push a little beyond the audience’s familiar ground.
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Author: lifeforms
Date: 2006-06-20 15:33
That piece sounds a very interesting piece of music. I may see if I can dig up a recording and take it into my band leader.
I'm in a comunity band, all ages, all abilities and all sorts of music. We play the likes of Passedena, Highland cathedral*, The rose, All through the night, Unchained melody, Floral Dance >.<, etc. We also now add Eyelevel, and our best audience loved one at the moment seems to be Great Escape**. We're looking for some melody pieces, as we played Instant concert and that seemed to go down well. We don't play it now however.
But.... you can always notice the difference in songs that our public know, over. The atmosphere can become electric.
On the other side of the coin, I help in a school club handchimes group who play from Dream (chorded), to Barcarolle played over 3 octaves (taken from a band pack and modified). Perhaps its because its young (11 and under) kids, even those that the audience don't know, still stir up a response.
*Highland cathedral, when we perfom in public, we also get a scottish piper along who plays with us, and it really gets the audience going.
** At one of our previous concerts our band leader announced this tune and all we got was a very loud "YES!!!" come from the back. The audience, and band members loved this, but we never did work out, if it was because it was a penultimate song, or if they really liked it!
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Author: pmgoff78
Date: 2006-06-20 15:56
Very cool concept!
I have a music degree and feel like I have a pretty good grasp of the "classical repertory" and enjoy it quite a bit.
However...I did a conference in Tennessee and saw a Trombone Choir with a Jazz Rhythm Section play a medley of music from the orginal Super Mario Bros. I caught on instantly. I must say, it was the best playing I heard all weekend. Point taken. People like what they know, and I know my Mario Bros!
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Author: mtague
Date: 2006-06-20 21:35
Some of the songs I really like from Uematsu weren't played at the concert. Usually just the most popular songs are played. Also, some songs I really didn't like were played (I loathe the "Eyes on Me" pop song). I'm not sure if all were done by him. I will say he is a very cool person, at least from the way he connected with the audience. I didn't pay extra for the VIP pre-show meeting, but he was nice enough to address the entire audience and take questions at the end. There are a lot of recordings of his music too, some with strings, some just piano.
I'm not sure the popular music for the really young set should be used as an example of what people want to hear. One, like stated above, it changes really fast, and two, I think a lot of people's musical tastes change when they mature more. Sure I still like Nirvana. I don't still like Tag Team.
Anyhow, just because a song is familiar isn't a guarantee of the audience liking it either. In my high school concert band we would always play the same set of songs between plays (Can't touch this, Not gonna take it, etc.), which people do recognize, but I'm fairly sure the audience hated it as much as the band hated playing it.
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