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Author: punkinn
Date: 2006-06-18 03:39
Not a question, just a "Hey, it works!" post.
I mounted my Kooiman Etude thumb rest this evening and tried it out. I did have to enlarge the existing screw holes slightly, but using a bit of common sense and care, it wasn't difficult. The position will take a *little* getting used to, but overall, I am really pleased with how it feels. My thumbs are double jointed, and with a history of borderline carpal tunnel syndrome, using a standard thumbrest is extremely uncomfortable for me. I sometimes use a neck strap, but don't really care for that approach all that much. With the very reasonable price of the Etude, I thought it was well worth a try.
The two "contact points" significantly reduce the perceived weight of the instrument, and my fingers really do feel more relaxed. The feel of the rest is very positive, like I have a good, secure grip without tension.
Just my 2ยข...
Regards,
Nancy Revelle
Arroyo Grande, CA
Nancy Revelle
Arroyo Grande, CA
Fine Hand-Crafted Writing Instruments
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Author: Kchui999
Date: 2006-06-18 03:52
Thanks for the info, I've been thinking about getting one for my R13, but never really got around to it.
Anyone have anymore information on Mr. Kooiman's professional thumbrests, which cost about $200 more? Any difference, besides the pro model being metal and more cool-looking?
~Chui
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Author: Morrigan
Date: 2006-06-18 04:12
My experience with the Etude model was bad. The short version is that it snapped in about 10 minutes.
Glad it works for you though.
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Author: ariel3
Date: 2006-06-18 20:23
HI,
I have used the professional Kooiman thumbrest for about three years now. In fact, I have two - one for the Bb and A horn. I have found them to be wonderfully comfortable to use and worth every penny, considering that I can play pain free now. Believe me, you will not "break" this thumbrest. It is a marvelous piece of craftsmenship and is infinitely adjustable.
Gene Hall
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Author: seafaris
Date: 2006-06-18 22:12
I have been using the Etude model for about a year, my wife for 6 months. They work just great. No thumb or wrist pain of any kind. No big callus or deformed thumb anymore. I am just semi careful with it, and so far it hasn't broken (or seems as if it might). An extra bonus for me was in the more consistant finger alignment for my right hand. It comes off easily and the clarinet stores in the case the same as before. I put superglue in the screw holes and it is still rock solid. You need the correct size screw driver to install so you don't damage the screw head.
Cheers,
Jim
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Author: Sean.Perrin
Date: 2006-06-19 03:50
Interesting I was just thinking of gettin one of these for the same reason (double jointed... extreme pain. I couldn't even play for the past four days, the pain was incredible. It was so bad I was afraid I'd ruined my hand so I took a break out of panic.... I think I should buy this.
Founder and host of the Clarineat Podcast: http://www.clarineat.com
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Author: Pathik
Date: 2006-06-19 11:59
A few months back I tried the Ton Kooiman Etude thumb rest, but gave up on it. The problem for me was that it made the clarinet more difficult to hold, it felt as if it was "falling" to one side all the time, but more than anything that it doesn't actually take away the weight of the instrument from your thumb and hand. The solution for me turned out to be the FHRED telescoping peg which transfers virtually the entire weight of the clarinet from your arm to the peg. The manufacturer's web site is at http://www.quodlibet.com/FhredGen.htm
Different things work for different people, and I'm glad the Ton Kooiman thumb rest works for you, but for anyone who has tried various kinds of thumb rests without finding one that takes the strain from the right thumb/hand/arm, I recommend the FHRED. The only thing to bear in mind is that you will need a thumb rest with a ring on it to fasten it to.
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Author: tetiana
Date: 2006-06-19 18:24
This message is for Sean.
Several years ago I had developed rather bad wrist pain and got really terrific advice from posting a message on this site. Of the many things recommended, I tried what seemed like the easiest and least dramatic - a neck strap and simply inverting the thumb rest (so that the thumb rests higher on the instrument and is more closely aligned with the index finger). This really did the trick for me and I have been essentially pain free since.
tetiana
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Author: Sean.Perrin
Date: 2006-06-19 18:50
/\
I have tried the neckstrap... to no avail... the clarinet doesn't seem well suited to a neckstrap. As for the inverted rest... i'll give it a try and see. I was thinking of getting the Kooiman maestro (more expensive one) simply becuase I am very sure that is what i need (my double jointed thumb just bends to far and the weight kills my wrist and hand).
Thank you, I will try the thumbrest reversal!
Founder and host of the Clarineat Podcast: http://www.clarineat.com
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Author: sylvangale
Date: 2006-06-20 02:52
The FHRED is an amazing little device and they have two methods of latching onto the thumb rest. One way is securing to the ring of a thumb rest (standard/professional) and the other is a wire frame that any thumb rest can fit into (student).
The student model's fault is that when you lift the clarinets weight from the FHRED, the thumb rest can slip from the FHREDs little frame. Though I've had this model and it actually works quite well and I liked the ease of slipping it on and off and had no problems with it coming off on its own.
The FHRED is like a mini fishing pole which can fit in a case and extend to support the weight of an instrument by resting the thumbrest on it. To experience how it works simply find a desk corner or some other object that will allow you to rest your clarinets thumb rest (without touching the clarinet body). Completely free moving with no weight affecting the hand.
The FHRED allows for one to shift as much weight as desired to the hand. Was absolutely wonderful when I switched from a plastic to wood oboe. I was able to gradually get used to the weight and then stopped using the FHRED when I built up the strength in my hands.
Regards,
Stephen
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Author: David Niethamer
Date: 2006-06-20 03:35
I've had the expensive Kooiman on my clarinets for the past 4 years, and wish I'd discovered them many years before. They do change the balance of the instrument in your hands, though, and that takes some getting used to!Also, it takes careful setup to make it do what it is meant to do. I very nearly sold mine because I didn't notice much relief for my thumb, until a physical therapist friend helped me to set it up properly.
I have a student with the Etude model. For her thin fingers, it is a help, because it distributes the weight on her thumb in a better way and makes the "grip" of the clarinet a bit "fatter." Her finger action is now much less tense, and she can stand to play, which was too painful in the past. Installation can be tricky if you attempt to use the thumb rest screws from your original thumbrest. SuperGlue solved that problem (thanks Walter). I notice that the new packaging includes slightly longer and wider screws for installation. Haven't tried them, but it must help.
One of my colleagues uses the FHRED. It is simple to set up and looks comfortable. It's also less intrusive on the instrument than either Kooiman.
My $0.02
David
niethamer@aol.com
http://members.aol.com/dbnclar1/index.html
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Author: ohsuzan
Date: 2006-06-20 16:11
Another thumb rest improvement which I have found helpful is the one that Tom Ridenour makes. It is simplicity itself -- just a molded piece of rubber-like material that fits over the existing rest. And it is way cheap (see his website for details). I have them on both of my oboes now (just cut a slit in the upper part to accomodate the neckstrap loop on my thumbrests). It also has the benefit that David N. described, that of making the right-hand grip "fatter" and more relaxed.
I used the Kooiman "Etude" on my clarinet, and got along well enough with it, although it was cumbersome and had to be disassembled to put the instrument into the case. With the Ridenour device, you just slide it off.
I have also seen the FHRED in use at close range, and was impressed with the flexibility it allowed the player. It seemed less instrusive than a neckstrap, actually. It was hardly noticeable.
Susan
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Author: bob49t
Date: 2006-06-21 06:16
See also previous extensive threads on "Kooiman" "thumbrests" etc.
I've been using the Maestro on both my Eaton clars (very heavy) and they transformed my RSI when playing from painful to no pain and pleasurable.
The Maestro is infinitely adjustable........but again, see the search for info.
BobT
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Author: Tom Schmidt
Date: 2009-03-31 18:36
I am very happy with how the Kooiman Etude works for me..., except that I've just broken my third one in about two years. It can be a fearful experience when it happens at the gig. The last one I reinforced with carbon fiber cloth and super glue over the inside and outside of the rest where it had broken previously, about where the thumb curve straightens. No problem there. This time it broke where the thumb portion attaches to the main frame at a place where I can't imagine applying reinforcement. I've only found the Etude 2 on internet from Europe, about $100. I guess I'll break down and get the pro model.
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Author: liam_hockley
Date: 2009-03-31 19:42
I have been using the Etude for about a year, and have gone through 3 in that time! I recently purchased the Etude 2 (in Canada.... $32!) and found that, although it is a much sturdier design, it is not nearly as adjustable as the first generation model. The thumb "hook" does not move up and down, which means that you have to move the whole unit around to find the exact fit you want. I recently ordered the Maestro, because the Etude 2 really doesn't work for me.
-Liam
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Author: chris moffatt
Date: 2009-04-01 13:30
For all you folks who like the Etude but have experienced breakages, the Etude II is much more solid. I got mine online from Howarth in London. Cost about $40 including postage. Arrived in a week, fitted in 10 minutes, works great. The price varies with exchange rates and changes often as the USD and GBP race each other to the bottom but nowhere near $100. For those who can justify the cost of the Maestro that would be even better.
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Author: Carson
Date: 2012-07-14 03:07
This thread is pretty old but thanks to all that posted here.
I recently started playing my clarinet again. I noticed I was getting a spot on my thumb that was losing the feeling. It is right at the place I pinch my thumb and my finger.
I remember thumb problems years ago that were solved with a piece of foam. The old piece was pretty flat so I tried adding more. It didn't seem to be kicking in. I started wondering if I had let it go to far. I'm not sure if the bump from the rest was cutting off the circulation or was pinching a nerve.
Also the thing that got me to pick up my horn again was the concept of amplification. That an the idea of manipulating the sound like can be done on an electric guitar. It has worked out pretty well except for the thumb thing. That also added a small amount of weight from the microphones.
I run the sound from the clarinet through a pair of microphones, though a couple of boxes and out an amplifier. The first box is called a DigiTech Vocalist Live 4 Harmony-Effects Processor. It is designed to manipulate a vocalist. You can do things like add harmonies. The second is a DigiTech Vocal 300. It will add things like a guitar whammy bar. With the foot pedal you can change the pitch a full octave. The thing that has really struck me with it is the echo effect.
Anyway between the two boxes there are hundreds of presets to chose from. They are still new to me. Just a handful of the presets have given me a lot of pleasure. It's really a trip.
After reading this thread I looked into the Ton Kooiman Etude2 thumbrest. I've only had it a few days and the feeling in my thumb is returning. I used my old screws to install it. I suppose I will have trouble as the heads on them are too small. I was thinking I didn't want to burn any bridges if I wanted to go back to my old rest. I suppose I could close the holes back up with some sort of wood filler, if I did drill them out larger.
The new rest has been very easy to play with. The only time I fumble is when I pick up my horn. It takes a little bit of, Oh Ya, for a second there.
Post Edited (2012-07-14 03:11)
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Author: ariel3
Date: 2012-07-14 14:00
Wow, I just discovered that I responded to this post early on in 2006. My results would be reported today to be the same as before. The Maestro Kooiman rest continues to provide superior service for me.
Over the years of pain free service for the ten or so years I have used them, the cost has been only pennies per day - plus, they don't break or wear out.
Take care,
Gene
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Author: bradfordlloyd
Date: 2012-07-14 17:57
I like my Etude rest. I've been using it a few months and have released a bunch of tension and pain I felt previously.
I'm still getting used to not pulling up on it though, since that changes things (i.e., since its adjustable). As long as there's downward pressure (as there usually is since you're holding the clarinet), all is well. But, occasionally in transition (i.e., during rests, or switching instruments), I sometimes knock the thumb rest and accidentally readjust it. Oops.
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Author: Gordon Giedt
Date: 2012-07-17 17:16
I bought an Etude after trying unsuccessfully to reduce pain in my wrist by inverting the thumbrest and also by using a neckstrap. The Etude relieved the pain in my wrist for ten years until the hook broke. I emailed Ton to see if I could replace the hook, and although he offered to send me a full replacement, he mentioned the Etude3 was coming out soon. I passed on the (yellow) replacement since I was able to superglue my hook together, but after finding a good price on the Etude2, I bought one. The Etude2 hook is much stronger and padded.
Ton emailed that the Etude3 was ready, and that he would send me one, FREE! The Etude3 looks the same as the Etude2 and fits on the same base, however its dovetail is deeper and has a more positive locking system. I have bumped my clarinet before and had the thumbrest slide off (mostly with the original Etude), but the new model will make that unlikely. The biggest difference in the Etude3 is that the hook can be adjusted up and down by the use of a single screw. Also the hook is more free swinging so my thumb can move naturally as I'm playing.
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Author: davetrow
Date: 2012-07-18 05:11
I've been using the Maestro for about a year now, and the only downside to it is that I'm still not sure I have it optimally adjusted because it's so versatile. Wouldn't want to be without it, though.
Dave Trowbridge
Boulder Creek, CA
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Author: Malcolm Martland
Date: 2012-08-01 15:27
These were on special offer at Dawkes (UK) so I bought 2. They are brilliant! The clarinet feels like part of my hand now. Finger placement is much better than before in both hands. This is especially important for me as I have reduced and tingly finger sensation.
The base plates were easy to fix to my 2 x Malerne plateau key Bb's, using the original screws from the old thumbrest. A little fiddly to attach the hook when the rest of the band is pushing to begin and it took me a few days to find the optimal setting but it was well worth the effort.
I was about to switch permanently, but reluctantly, from clarinet to tenor sax (bigger keys) in our band but with this rest I'm happy to stay on clarinet. Now we just need to find a tenor player!
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Author: trish24
Date: 2012-08-02 04:42
I have read all the posts in this revitalised thread on thumbrests.
Originally, I didn't consider the Ton Kooiman because I thought it involved modifying the instrument.....drilling holes, etc. I realise now that it depends on the make and it seems it can be installed in the existing screws for the thumbrest on some makes/models. I have a Buffet E11.
I have only been playing for 4 years; am mature age but don't feel that I have any limitations re wrists, fingers and upper body strength.
However, I simply cannot support the instrument and play freely whilst standing. It irritates me that I see youngsters playing standing up for extended periods.
I am a serious learner and do exams and there is no regulation here in Australia requiring you to stand for exams so I play resting the bell on my right knee. I know from other posts that I am in good company with that but I would just like to play standing up when required. I have tried different neckstraps and the Tom Ridenour thumb support. They both help, of course, but still only when seated when, in fact, I could probably get by without them, anyway.
Has anyone been in the same situation as me and prepared to recommend the Kooiman? And which "model" as I now realise there are several?
Thanks in anticipation
Trish
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Author: Carson
Date: 2013-08-04 03:33
I may have found a way to make an already great thumb rest even better.
So may have Tom Kooiman. The new Etude 3 is out!
The thumb rest arm height is now adjustable.
http://www.tonkooiman.com/index.php/26-news/77-etude-3-new-model-availlable
Also I recently found out about Sugru!
It's like play-dough when you open the package. You then have about a half hour to shape it. It sets up like silicon rubber over night.
It seems perfect for customizing the thumb rest to distribute the load.
I'm way jumping the gun here as I've only had it on my clarinet and saxophone for one day.
Others have probably mentioned the stuff but it's the sort of thing that each individual might sort of get that WOW! moment of discovery.
https://sugru.com/us
Post Edited (2013-08-04 03:37)
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2013-08-04 12:31
Be careful using Sugru. It's very easy to spread it around whee you don't want it, and it's nearly impossible to get off cleanly. It's quite difficult to make a smooth finish. Also, wear surgical gloves or you'll never get it off your hands.
It's not a good weight-bearing adhesive. For that, use epoxy putty, such as Devco.
Sugru keeps for only about six months, so buy it in the smallest possible quantities, and keep it in the fridge. Also, it's way overpriced. There's a DIY version at http://www.instructables.com/id/How-To-Make-Your-Own-Sugru-Substitute/step3/Mixing-Oogoo/.
Consider using sheet cork or silicone surgical tubing.
Ken Shaw
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Author: pennywhistle
Date: 2018-05-13 19:59
I see this a very old thread, but wondered if any of you out there could offer any suggestions.
I bought an Etude recently and had it fitted by my usual technician. Overall I find it really great but I have a problem with operating the D#/Eb key. I now seem to need a slight shift in hand position to reach it, which makes the instrument unstable. What I can't decide is whether the Etude is fitted in the wrong position perhaps or whether it just needs more experimentation.
Anyone got any suggestions?
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