 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Julie B
Date: 2006-01-14 22:13
Is the Forte clarinet turning out to be as good as expected? Since they can't be found used, are they worth the additional cost over a used Vito V40 (which seems to be the most suggested plastic model on this board)? Thanks.
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Author: pewd
Date: 2006-01-15 01:35
if you don't need to attach a marching lyre to them, yes, worth every penny.
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
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Author: L. Omar Henderson
Date: 2006-01-15 03:08
(Disclaimer - I am maker of the Forte')
Paul - as I have written earlier - Bell Lyres for Forte' are now available and will be listed soon on the web site.
L. Omar Henderson
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2006-01-15 11:48
"Is the Forte clarinet turning out to be as good as expected? Since they can't be found used..."
Well not QUITE true.
I bought one out of curiosity to keep up to date with what is offering, and in my limited areas of expertise, was quite impressed with it, which is really quite positive, coming from me!
However I have been trying to sell it in my country's version of Ebay for months now, with a very low 'starting price'. Many people look at the advertisement, but other than that, very little interest. (By comparison I sold a Yamaha equivalent very quickly for 3.3 times that price.)
This does not do the Forte justice. I guess it takes a while for a market to recognise value in a new brand name, even with a locally trusted trader selling it.
Post Edited (2006-01-15 11:50)
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Author: pewd
Date: 2006-01-15 15:12
in that case, buy one, you won't be dissappointed
- Paul Dods
Dallas, Texas
Post Edited (2006-01-15 15:13)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-01-15 15:14
Omar,
Have you tried any of Amati's Mopani-bodied clarinets?
More to the point, is Mopani around the same density as Kingwood or Cocobolo, and would you offer any of your clarinets (esp. the C clarinet) or barrels in Mopani as an option in the future?
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2006-01-15 16:05
Yes, they're excellent instruments. Search them out here on the board and you'll find many, many recommendations for them among us.
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Author: L. Omar Henderson
Date: 2006-01-15 16:08
I tried two Mopani Bb clarinets when they were first introduced at the 2003 ClarinetFest - Graham Golden brought them to show. The ones that were brought were equivalent to the student grade ACL 311. The wood has a reddish orange color which darkens upon exposure to air, oil, and time. I liked the wood itself and the clarinet had a slightly "warmer" (excuse the subjective terms because they only show my inability to put them into any quantitative format). The only thing that I noticed, and has been brought to my attention by several customers who have purchased Mopani Amati clarinets, is that each piece of wood darkens and changes color differently than its brother or sister joint, bell, or barrel giving a distinct two-tone appearance which may be a visual turn off for some. Oiling the wood darkens the color to an orange chocolate brown but still with significant differences in color between pieces of wood.
From my investigations, Mopani may be a very good wood for clarinets because it maintains structural integrity when machined and is even more impervious to excess water accumulation than Grenadilla. Mopani roots have a large usage as decorative elements in aquariums. Mopani has a greater density (not sure of SG) than Cocobolo and Kingwood and is harder. I do not know about the machining characteristics of the wood but all the tone holes and post insertions were smooth and tight. It would be interesting to compare examples of professional level clarinets from Amati in both Mopani and Grenadilla - I do not believe that they make one in Mopani as yet. Amati thus far has not aggressively marketed instruments made from Mopani but this may be a wood of the future for instrument manufacture if plastic composites do not win the race.
Forte' "C" for the time being will stick with Grenadilla wood "C" clarinets, possibly with a custom barrel in Cocobolo (not sure) because of the expensive prototyping steps necessary to bring any clarinet to market. The material (Mopani) may be similar to Grenadilla but time and money for another "new" element is not envisioned at this time.
L. Omar Henderson
(Disclaimer - a maker of Forte' clarinets)
erratum - (Depends on source of measurement) Grenadilla (depending on species and origin) sg 1.1 - 1.3, Mopani sg - 1.1 to 1.17, Cocobolo sg 0.98 to 1.05, Kingwood sg 1.05 to 1.1 (hardness measurements depend on the units but the general observation is: Mopani > Kingwood > Cocobolo)
Post Edited (2006-01-15 16:59)
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-01-15 17:52
Cheers for the info Omar - though I didn't realise Kingwood was more dense than Cocobolo, so I'm glad you added that too.
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Author: Bradley
Date: 2006-01-15 19:51
I had the good fortune of trying the Forte C clarinet prototype that Dr. Henderson had at the Midwest Clinic in Chicago last month. It was a lot more warm sounding that I had expected, and I anticipate a great final product- I will be one of the consumers checking them out when they arrive on the scene.
Bradley
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2006-01-15 19:52
Gordon wrote:
> This does not do the Forte justice. I guess it takes a while for a market to
> recognise value in a new brand name, even with a locally trusted trader
> selling it.
When an "unknown" brand is for sale somewhere I usually google the name and visit the mfgr's site.
Well, behind a reasonably tight company firewall there's not a lot to be seen from the Forté site. I hate to say that. Just by looking at the web site(s), without addl' (read: insider) knowledge I'd be hesitant to buy one.
My advice would be: keep it simple. Simple (but sharp) pictures, simple layout, simple words. Even the product pdf has a striking resemblance to far-east products.
I think Forté is selling far below value. There's only one opportunity to make a first impression...
--
Ben
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Author: SolidRockMan
Date: 2006-01-23 21:52
I have just taken delivery of a Forte'. I expected it to be a good buy based on the opinions I've read here, but I am hugely impressed with this instrument. The difference in response and intonation compared to my B12 is quite amazing.
The Forte' package is great value as apart from the technical advances of the clarinet itself it includes a really nice Gennusa mouthpiece, an excellent case and accessories from the Doctor.
In answer to the orginal post I can't say how it would compare to a Vito V40, but to anyone looking for a superb plastic clarinet I can heartily second pewd's comment above - "buy one, you won't be disappointed"!
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2006-01-24 15:18
I agree that the Forte is a better choice than the Buffet B-12. And, the V40 isn't made anymore, so you're looking at a used one if you want one of those.
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Author: Mike Clarinet
Date: 2006-01-25 12:17
After reading the views here, it seems as if the forte is a good recommendation for beginners. Are they exported to the UK? If so, who stocks them?
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Author: Chris P
Date: 2006-01-25 13:06
Although Rosetti (in Essex) are the UK importers/distributors of Amati instruments (who make the Forte clarinet to Omar's specifications), Forte clarinets are only availlable to us here by mail or online order - maybe UK distribution through Myatts or Howarths etc. will come with demand - I can see the C clarinet offered in the near future to be in demand as it's more affordable to everyone that would like one.
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Author: Brenda Siewert
Date: 2006-01-25 14:04
If you want to be a dealer, you can contact Dr. Henderson from his sponsor ad here on the board. You might mention to him about the UK situation and perhaps there would be a contact there who would be interested in selling the Forte.
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Author: L. Omar Henderson
Date: 2006-01-25 16:34
(Disclaimer - I am a maker of the Forte')
From my experience, in today's competitative maketplace, dealers will take on a new line if:
1) There is significant customer demand; 2) mark-up/sales price are attractive; 3) the instrument is sturdy/ spare parts readily available.
L. Omar Henderson
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Author: johnsonfromwisconsin
Date: 2006-01-25 19:06
I think "Band Teacher Recognition" is an important factor as well. I'm not certain the average Jr High band instructor has the time or inkling to put a lot of thought or research into various brand student horns. I gather that they usually stick to a few names they know, like Yamaha or Selmer and might be a bit alarmed if they a student show up with something different.
-JfW
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Author: tictactux ★2017
Date: 2006-01-25 19:24
How does one define (and better yet prove) "Band Teacher Recognition"? I mean, even the CSOs on That Auction Site are advertised with "approved by band directors".
Unless there's a trustworthy seal of approval people will stick to the big 4 or 5 names.
--
Ben
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Author: sylvangale
Date: 2006-01-25 20:11
Well... it would also depend on your band director.
A flutist band director for instance with no clarinet forte may be wary of brands that are known to be horrid for flutes... but are good for clarinets.
Like Selmer and Buffet for instance.
Though one would hope that the immense popularity of the Buffet would even catch the eyes of the flutist... but what of Selmers?
I have had a band director that thought colored instruments were "cool"...
and would recommend Bach... regardless of instrument.
so... I recommend people come here.
Regards,
Stephen
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Author: BobD
Date: 2006-01-25 20:12
My personal opinion is that "Band Director Approved" or similar designation should not enter one's decision regarding any clarinet as it is simply marketing fluff.
Bob Draznik
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Author: johnsonfromwisconsin
Date: 2006-01-25 21:03
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How does one define (and better yet prove) "Band Teacher Recognition"? I mean, even the CSOs on That Auction Site are advertised with "approved by band directors".
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What I call "Band Teacher Recognition" is an assumption that has nothing to do with manufacturer claims and advertisements. It's a matter of individual brand loyalty, trust, experience, information, and misinformation any given director may have. It assumes that few band teachers have done an exaustive test of many of the different instruments out there and haven't been aquainted with forums and BBoards for flute, clarinet, sax, trumpet, oboe, percussion, and low brass on an intimate level.
-JfW
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Author: GBK
Date: 2006-01-25 21:24
"The Lark clarinet is recognized by band directors"
Yup...I'm a band director and I recognize it as a CSO.
...GBK
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Author: 3dogmom
Date: 2006-01-26 01:27
Don't believe everything you read in an advertisement...
It's a shame more parents didn't actually ask us band directors.
Sue Tansey
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Author: SolidRockMan
Date: 2006-01-26 09:27
As the old saying goes, 'no-one ever got fired for choosing IBM'. Music educators are no different and with CSOs now flooding the market they will more than ever stick with the big four if recommending an instrument.
Where I am Jupiter clarinets are starting to make some inroads but the 'gold standard' for beginners remains the Buffet B12. I'm not saying the B12 is a terrible instrument or anything, but the Forte' is simply superior in every respect. It doesn't feel or sound like a beginner clarinet.
As is the case with many innovations it will take time for the Forte's merits to overcome long-entrenched attitudes but I've no doubt it will happen.
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