 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: wolfercdat
Date: 2005-10-19 03:44
I'm having trouble determining what type of clarinet I purchased many years ago at a junk store for about $10. Because I had never seen anything like it, I thought it was cool (especially since it still had the case). Now that I'm playing my Bflat clarinet in the church orchestra again (after a 21 year break...boy is it fun), my curiosity has brought the instrument off the shelf as a decoration. The problem is, that the only markings are a very clear B flat with L.P stamped at the top of the clarinet and the same marking at the bottom next to the bell. I can find no serial number or even what looks like a worn off serial number. Though it has all of the keys it's supposed to, it looks nothing like a "normal" clarinet. For one thing, there are only two keys to either side on the bottom part, unlike the 4 that are usually there. It also has a very interesting wrap around key at the top. The metal looks dull not shiny or tarnished like silver would. But at the same time it doesn't look like any of the metal has been worn off. I forgot to mention that the clarinet is wood. If someone could help steer me in the right direction as to the type of clarinet it is, I might be able to finish researching this on my own. As it stands now, I feel like I'm shooting in the dark. Thank you
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Author: ron b
Date: 2005-10-19 04:44
You're describing my clarinet(s) to a tee, Wolfer. It's commonly known (in the States anyway) as an 'Albert system', although, depending on the number and configuration of the rest of the keys, it could be a 'Simple System'. Further description of its mechanism or, better yet a picture, would help pin it down. A few of us around here still play them. The keys are most likely nickel-silver and will shine nicely with a wee bit of polish and some elbow grease. An L.P. (low pitch) instrument is probably worth restoring because L.P. is today's standard pitch, A=440. If the body and keys are in good shape why not get a play-condition re-pad and have some fun with it?
- r![[cool]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/cool.gif) n b -
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2005-10-19 13:40
Ron says it very well, I'd just add that it prob. dates from around [+/- 10 years?] of the 1900 turn-of-century. I believe at that time, many French-made "no-names" [and some US mades] were being sold here, I have a couple also. They are "simple", so can be made to play quite easily, and were the fore-runner to the present German "system" horn. They have several fingering differences from our common Boehm cl, and charts may be found in old cl "tutors". Luck, Don [et al]
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: wolfercdat
Date: 2005-10-19 15:53
Thank you both very much for the insight. I can't wait to begin a quest to learn more about this very funny looking instrment. I hope to find someone in the San Antonio area that can fix her up. She looks to be in O.K. shape definitely not playable)...has a thick coat of grime and dirt, most of the pads look like they need to be replaced, and the cork holding the sections together are completely worthless. The only thing I'm actually concerned about is the bell; the finish on in almost looks like someone got the bright idea to refinish the stain yet never got around to actually staining it again. It's significantly lighter in wood color than the rest of the instrument, but also doesnt' have the characteristic stain of any clarinet. It's almost as if it has the look and feel of wood that has only had one coat of stain and yet the metal looks exactly like the rest of the instrument and also lines up to the other piece. I dont' think it's water damage but I'm also not convinced that someone didn't swap out bells at some time in it's history. Of course I would like the entire instrument to match in color, so I'm left with the challenge of finding someone who can "change" the color of the bell. Or is that a really bad thing to do? I will try and post a picture next time...thank you again.
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Author: joannew
Date: 2005-10-19 16:47
Aren't there some Cousenon clarinets of similar vintage with rosewood bells?
If I can remember where I have seen a picture I will get back to you...
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Author: Terry Stibal
Date: 2005-10-19 17:01
A non-matching bell on a horn that age indicates to me that the original has cracked through and through and someone has added a bell from another horn. Not the end of the world, but still not the original horn. Better a cracked bell than a cracked long joint, after all.
The wrap around register key closure can be tricky to set up. If you find problems occurring with your Bb in the middle of the staff, or with the jumps up to the 2nd and 3rd register, the repair person needs to look at the angle that that pad in the register key is set to. Once it is right, be very careful when assembling or disassembling the horn, as a twist too much here can cause all sorts of problems.
In order to learn all of the tricks with an Albert horn, you need a fingering chart. The easiest way to get a full scale printed one is to purchase the Rubank Elementary Method book. On their fingering chart, the "normal" looking clarinet is an Albert, while the spindly one is a Boehm.
Some Albert style horns have fixtures like a patented C# mechanism, which gives you an alternate fingering for this most problematic of lower joint fingerings. Others do not. Fiddle around with the little finger keys (i.e., play B in the staff (all closed except register key), then use your little finger on the right to push down keys and see what happens. If you've got it, you'll be please; if not -- well, whole generations of clarinet players got along without it so you can too.
In many ways, playing an Albert horn is a lot like playing a saxophone. The lower joint keys are the same, and the first finger on the upper joint sort of works "in reverse" like on a sax. But, on an Albert clarinet the first fingers of each hand play a different role than they do on a Boehm. In any event, spend some time running scales up and down and you're adapt surprisingly well. The big issues (hole coverage, sliding fingers to positions and the like) are much the same.
Also, depending on the make and model of the horn, the left thumb arrangements can feel pretty "funky" until you get used to what's going on.
(Aside from other instruments, I can currently "get by" on an Oehler horn (about the same as an Albert), but I can keep up equally well on Boehm or Albert. It's just a matter of getting enough playing time in on each to allow your hind-brain to do the thinking for you, rather than having to consciously send messages to your arms to "put left little finger down there right now". It will be hard at first, but with practice will come facility.)
Personally, I find the Albert system to be "less stuffy" than the Boehm horn. "Free blowing" is a term that I have heard used, and Albert horns that I have played (both clarinet and bass clarinet, over many many years) are a joy to play if they are set up well and properly maintained. Many who are into traditional jazz agree with this point of view. I also think (personal preference here) that they are more facile in sharp keys, while the Boehm horns are better in flat keys.
Enjoy your new toy, and the puzzled looks you get when you show up to play with other clarinetists. I know that my old Albert basses (two, one was mine and one belonged to a school that I attended) were the nine day wonder wherever they were played.
leader of Houston's Sounds Of The South Dance Orchestra
info@sotsdo.com
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Author: wolfercdat
Date: 2005-10-20 04:04
Now I really feel like an idiot....since the instrument is not in playable condition I never really thought much about the two old pieces of music that were folded up in the top of the case. I pulled them out tonight and what I found was the original Albert System fingering chart "Scale for the Clarinet with 15 Keys" by C. Rose, Professor of the Clarinet, at Paris Conservatory. On the reverse is the fingering chart for the Boehm System. It's copyright is 1898 by Carl Fisher from New York.
I really appreciate everything you all have taught me in regards to my instrument and look forward to the day I can hear it played. I'll probably never know if the bell was original or not, but I agree that it's highly unlikely given it's color. Just for curiousity, is the bell on any of the Albert's that you all have mentioned, stamped with the word "France"?
There is also a piece of sheet music for the 2nd Bb Clarinet from Carl Fisher called Campus Memories.
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Author: Wes
Date: 2005-10-20 05:13
Hi!
You have described perfectly an old clarinet given to me by my oboe teacher. It is marked Bb LP on each section and the bell. The bell is of a lighter colored wood than the body parts. Presently, I'm totally restoring it and hope that it plays ok at 440. If it does, there appears to be a number of people that play dixieland or klesmer music on these instruments with great skill, and the instrument would be in demand. Although I started on a $7 pawnshop Albert system, I don't know how far I'll go with it. Good luck!
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