 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: janlynn
Date: 2005-09-15 15:47
hello... we are playing toccata marziale by vaughan williams in band and uh .. umm - i dont "get it."
it doesnt sound like a song to me. the notes dont even sound like they go together.
has anyone here ever played it? (thots, impressions?)
does anyone know anyplace online where i can hear what this sounds like?
thanks, jan
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Author: Merlin
Date: 2005-09-15 16:07
I've never been a huge fan of that work myself, but I've played it several times in the past few years.
Toccata Marziale always sounds like an exercise in counterpoint gone wild.
One nice thing about being a doubler is that I've had a chance to play several different parts in this work. So far I've performed it on alto sax, bass sax, bass clarinet, solo clarinet, first clarinet and Eb clarinet. Once you hear how the melodies get tossed around, and learn which parts need to be brought forward, you can start making some music with this piece.
There are several decent recordings of it; I'd start by looking for one by the Eastman Wind Ensemble.
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Author: graham
Date: 2005-09-15 16:25
I like it. Hidden subtleties. I suggest you aim to play it quietly to start with to hear what is involved
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Author: Hank Lehrer
Date: 2005-09-15 17:09
Hi,
This composition has been a staple in the wind ensemble literature for about 50 as I recall. While I have not played it in quite some time, it is a real challenge.
As far as an explanation of what the composer might have had in mind, most music dictionaries indicate that " The toccata was usually rhapsodic, often interspersing rapid passages of brilliant figuration with fugal sections" and marziale refers to "martial."
The EWE recording is probably the easiest to find although I have a great reading by the USAF Band of the Rockies (now again the USAF Academy Band).
HRL
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Author: BobD
Date: 2005-09-15 19:24
It was a Fennell favorite and very challenging but I can't say that I'm particularly fond of it. It's probably more of a showcase for the director than anything else.
Bob Draznik
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Author: clarinetist04
Date: 2005-09-16 00:26
It has so much counterpoint, indeed...that is what makes this piece a challenge. Your own comments exemplify this in that you don't think it sounds like music; i.e. you don't understand how the parts fit together. Listen to the other musicians (it is a wind "ensemble" after all) and you will start to hear why this is such a tough and rewarding piece. I have three or four recordings of it and would suggest either the US Marine Band (on their 10 CD set issued several years ago) or the EWE edition. They are both very well done, although the USMB is in a league of its own.
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Author: janlynn
Date: 2005-09-16 00:34
thank you for sharing your thots on this piece. we just got the music on tuesday and i was so focused on trying to sight read my part, i didnt really get to hear how everything fit. hopefully next time we play it i will be more familiar with my part and not have to concentrate so much on that aspect. our conductor says we will grow to love it as much as he does. i hope so.
jan
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Author: jbutler ★2017
Date: 2005-09-16 00:55
Lots of errors in the score and parts in the original edition. I don't know if they were ever corrected or not. I would do a search on errata. I made my own list a long time ago (about 25 yrs ago) when we did it for UIL C&SR at a 5A HS, but have no clue as to what I did with it now.
jbutler
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Author: BobD
Date: 2005-09-16 13:41
Playing this composition always reminds me of the quip: A man notices a guy hitting himself on the head with a hammer and asks him why he is doing this. The reply, "Because it feels so good when I quit".
Bob Draznik
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Author: contragirl
Date: 2005-09-17 05:10
heh, in HS I called off of playing contra to play the first clarinet part. I was one of the few that could handle the clarinet parts in HS. I thought it was super fun and it was so interesting. I liked it a lot.
--CG
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Author: D Dow
Date: 2005-09-17 18:47
This is one of the more ugly works for concert band, a repetoire that I find disconcertingly verbose and somewhat dull....as to the scoring one thing is the dynamics MUST be played for this work to sound at all like music. As to Vaughn Williams I find his music overdrawn and boring.
David Dow
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Author: BobD
Date: 2005-09-17 19:16
Nice to hear people who are not afraid to reveal their real feelings. I can stop hitting my head now.
Bob Draznik
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Author: Merlin
Date: 2005-09-17 19:20
"As to Vaughn Williams I find his music overdrawn and boring."
There are a couple of RVW's works I absolutely love. Fantasia on a Theme of Thomas Tallis is sumptuous. The Folk Song Suite for Band is one of the cornerstones of band literature. I really like the Symphony #5 (did ANYONE write a bad 5th symphony??).
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Author: D Dow
Date: 2005-09-17 20:15
My favorite piece by RVW is the Sinfonia Antartica...as to the Folk Song Suite it is played too often and to my ears become tiresome.
David Dow
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Author: clarinetist04
Date: 2005-09-18 01:24
"Nice to hear people who are not afraid to reveal their real feelings."
When I said I liked this piece I was telling my real feelings.
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Author: janlynn
Date: 2005-09-18 01:46
would like to extend another thank you for everyone sharing your thots on this. im glad im not the only one who found this a challenge. ( i might actually be glad to play sleigh ride this year) lol
jan
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Author: clarinetsweetheart
Date: 2005-09-18 03:34
I just downloaded it and I'm in love with it.
But that's just me XD
It's just so complicated and trying to follow everything just makes me really happy. But I'm a composer so I guess it's fun for me, personally ^_^ And obviously some other composers might not agree but I love it.
~*Charlotte*~
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Author: BelgianClarinet
Date: 2005-09-21 18:12
Can someone tell me what 'lol' means ?
Happens to be dutch word for 'fun', but I think you all have a slightly different explanation !!
Post Edited (2005-09-21 18:12)
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Author: graham
Date: 2005-09-22 11:53
Not too much of RVW is overdrawn in my view. Adrian Boult said that he thought RVW often got the length right whereas Elgar tended often to go on too long. But RVW did not always find it easy. His 2nd Symphony was longer than it now is for around 20 years before he shortened it. Chandos have recorded the original, which is very extended but still beautiful. If you want to try challenging RVW which is not easy to follow at first playing try his 4th Symphony. Tocatta Marziale is a doddle compared (so is Rite of Spring for that matter). There is a great deal in RVW to enjoy if you steer clear of some of his lack lustre choral output.
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Author: ginny
Date: 2005-09-23 16:47
While not high on my list of absolute favorites I enjoyed playing it and recall that the devices used amusing. It certainly took a number of rehearsals before it really hung together, but our director was able to make sense of it for us.
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