 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: studioline
Date: 2005-06-24 19:41
Just want to clear something up.
Milhaud's Scaramouche was originally written for 2 pianos, right? Then, Milhaud himself arranged it for Saxophone and Orchestra, am I right so far?
The Clarinet and piano version is taken from the sax and orchestra version- was this by Milhaud as well?
What I want to know is do you think it acceptable to change a few things in the clarinet part, ie in the Brazileria movement I think it works better when the theme in the clarinet does NOT jump between different octaves, and works better when the line is kept within the same octave.
Also, in the 1st movement, I would like to change a few things to make it sound more like the original version, as much as possible for the clarinet and piano combination anyway.
If Milhaud did do the clarinet and piano version then I don't think I should change things, however if he didn't, then I think it perfectly reasonable.
What do you think?
Thanks
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Author: ken
Date: 2005-06-25 03:21
Why is it ethically acceptable to change a written part of an arranger or publisher but not the composer? v/r Ken
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Author: Tony Pay ★2017
Date: 2005-06-25 11:51
A post that summarises a recent thread about the genesis of Scaramouche on Klarinet, still not satisfactorily resolved, is at:
http://test.woodwind.org/Databases/Klarinet/2005/02/000272.txt
It contains the suggestion that Milhaud arranged it for saxophone and orchestra himself
BTW, I'm sorry about the dreadful formatting of that post -- I think I must have had my mailer outputting MIME by mistake.
In fact, I think I'll reproduce it better here:
David Glenn wrote:
> > Scaramouche was written for Sigurd Rascher in 1939. Here's what I hear from Carina Rascher: She tells me that her father Sigurd was forced to emmigrate from Germany in 1939 and for his protection, an obituary was published. Otherwise, he was afraid the Nazis would chase him down. Milhaud had written Scaramouche originally for Mr. Rascher as a saxophone solo with orchestra but upon seeing the obituary, made a new version for two pianos. It wasn't until 1952 in Aspen, Colorado that Rascher met Milhaud again where the composer was conducting at a festival.> >
I wrote:
> > Whether this is true awaits final corroboration, but it's not what appears in Grove, and at least one other source has it round the other way.> >
David Glenn:
> > I've been in contact with Carina Rascher and she let me know, that everything above is correct except that she wanted to qualify the word "flee". As Sigurd Rascher liked to put it, "The clouds were getting too brown." I think Dan and Lelia had described it best. He was not in immediate danger but he saw what was going on.> >
Me:
> > Well, we still don't learn anything more about the order of composition of the various versions, which is what interests me; the other source
http://www.brazzil.com/daniv/Texts/Le_Boeuf/boeuf.pt.30.htm
still gives:
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In 1937 Milhaud composed "...a piano work that gave me enormous trouble. It was a suite for two pianos, to be played by Ida Jankelevitch and Marcelle Meyer. I took some passages from two sets of incidental music for the stage, and called the mixture Scaramouche. At once Deiss offered to publish it. I advised him against it, saying that no one would want to buy it. But he was an original character who only published works that he liked. He happened to like Scaramouche and insisted on having his way. In the event he was right, for while sales of printed music were everywhere encounterig difficulties, several printings were made, and Deiss took special delight in informing me: 'The Americans are asking for 500 copies and 1000 are being asked for elsewhere'."
Scaramouche is a suite in three mouvements: Vif, Modr, and Brazileira. What Milhaud doesn't tell us is that it was commissioned by Ida Jankelevitch for a performance at the 1937 Paris World's Fair (Exposition Internationale des Arts et Techniques dans la Vie Moderne). It became so popular that Milhaud arranged it for saxophone and orchestra....
Milhaud himself recorded Scaramouche, op. 165b with Marcelle Meyerin 1938.
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We can't know what Rascher's thoughts were as he left Germany, but we can know for certain that the version for two pianos was recorded in 1938, and that Milhaud said he wrote it in 1937. That doesn't square with the assertion that Milhaud wrote the version for two pianos only after seeing Rascher's obituary in 1939, as per Carina Rascher.
Tony
Post Edited (2005-06-25 19:33)
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2005-06-25 15:30
FWIW, the copyright on the piano reduction that accompanied my copy of the clarinet version is 1939 by Deiss. The copyright on the clarinet part is 1942 (also Deiss). The only one given any sort of authorship credit on either part is Milhaud. The solo cues on the piano reduction are actually the alto sax part. The subtitle to Scaramouche on the piano part is "Suite pour Saxophone et Orchestre." The subtitle on the clarinet part is "Suite pour Saxophone (ou Clarinette SIb) et Orchestre. The implication is, to me at least, that the clarinet part came later but was probably prepared by Milhaud.
Also FWIW (which frankly may not be much) in the liner notes to Eduard Brunner's recording of "Scaramouche" on his album "Hommage a Benny Goodman," Ekkehart van den Hoogen claims that Milhaud prepared the "clarinet and orchestra" version for Benny Goodman. He further claims that Goodman enjoyed performing the work, in contrast to the concerto that Milhaud wrote for him, which he never performed. This may be but van den Hoogen doesn't give any sources and, if the clarinet version was indeed prepared for Benny Goodman, it seems to me it would have to be simply the alternate clarinet solo part. From the copyright dates, it seems clear that the orchestral accompaniment and the sax solo came earlier. (If the clarinet version was already available by 1939, why wait until 1942 to copyright it?) There are some other comments in the liner notes that cause me to doubt their accuracy but the wording is sufficiently vague to allow for more than one interpretation.
Best regards,
jnk
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Author: studioline
Date: 2005-06-25 21:53
Interesting.
Regarding the clarinet version though, the general concensus is that Milhaud arranged this himself too then?
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