 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: andy
Date: 1999-02-25 14:28
i'm doing a research project for my physics class on the physics behind both the flute and the clarinet. any info which would give any insight into how either the clarinet or the flute work in correspondence with air, sound, and anything else. also, if u could just give me some sort of direction that would be suffiecient in itself. thanx.
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Author: Arnold the basset hornist
Date: 1999-02-25 16:15
The reed on the mouthpiece works as an resonance unit with high attenuation (and a switching characteristica to support the energy), the rest of the instrument (instrument body) as an resonance unit with low attenuation. This instrument body consists of a tube which works as a wave guide (both directions, primary delay effects), both the chain of open holes or the bell works as a filter - high pass transmission and low pass reflection (back to the reed).
This simplified principle is valid for all reed instruments like clarinet (+ basset horn), saxophone, oboe (+ english horn + heckelphon), bassoon, tarogato, sordun, racket, shawn, sarrusophon, ...
Details are much more complex of course (I do not know them exactly enough to tell you).
Arnold (the basset hornist)
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Author: Don Poulsen
Date: 1999-02-25 17:09
A number of years ago, Scientific American published a paperback book entitled The Physics of Music : Readings from Scientific American edited by Carleen M. Hutchins. It is out of print, but you should be able to find a copy in a library. I recall one article that focused on woodwinds that I found interesting. It explained, among other things, that the characteristic wavelength of a cylindrical-bored instrument, such as clarinets and flutes, is four times the effective tube length whereas the characteristic wavelength of a conical-bored instrument, such as saxophones, oboes and bassoons, is twice the tube length.
There may be some articles on Sneezy related to the physics of clarinets also.
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 1999-02-25 17:23
Andy wrote:
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i'm doing a research project for my physics class on the physics behind both the flute and the clarinet. any info which would give any insight into how either the clarinet or the flute work in correspondence with air, sound, and anything else. also, if u could just give me some sort of direction that would be suffiecient in itself. thanx.
Andy -
The place to start (and probably to end) is Arthur Benade: Horns, Strings and Harmony. It's available in paperback, and there will certainly be a copy in your library, more likely under "Music" than under "Physics." Benade was the great original on the subject of the physics of wind instruments in general and the clarinet in particular.
There's a lot of research being done on the surprisingly complex physics of woodwinds. There was an interesting article on the physics of the recorder in the New York Times about a month ago, which could give you some ideas and people to follow up with for current developments. It's unfortunately not available on the Times web site any more, but I'm sure it's been downloaded and saved by someone.
Good luck.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 1999-02-25 17:45
Since I do not know the level of physics, I would like to be general and my infos are somewhat indirect:
1.Key words to know are:
1)acoustics:a field to research how sounds are produced.
2)closed tube or open hole
3)harmonics(may need matematics called Fourie series)
2.Where to find sources?
1)Indiana university have vast musical library and its library may help via internet.Might be include in this HP.
http://www.flutemaker.com/book/book.htm
2)Ohio state has a page on how to get music infos:This is their page for serach music strategy:
http://www.lib.ohio-state.edu/gateway/bib/music.html
2)In this Klarinet archive there are clarinet acuoustice archive(Stanford university I remember?).By copyright limitation articles are not directly available.But you can see the titles,which may help your obtaining help from librarians.
3)As to flute,the biggest home page will be Larry Kranz's one:http://user.uniserve.com/~lwk/welcome.htm
It is not academic but he may help what flute sources are available.
4)Regarding to flute making of course Theobald Boehm's articles should be searched.A very practical source(may not be academic) is availabe by Burkhart and Phelan:
http://www.flutemaker.com/book/book.htm
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 1999-02-25 17:57
1)This is Scientific American Home Page.You may be able to find the article Don quoted via here.
2)Oxford university has music site and may also be good;
http://www1.oup.co.uk/music/
3)This may also be good:
http://www.music.qub.ac.uk/~tomita/mlinks.html
Sorry,not to be specific.
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Author: Doug P.
Date: 1999-02-26 01:50
I would like to second the recommendation to look up Benade's work on the subject. You may also want to check out "Clarinet Acoustics" by O. Lee Gibson (Indiana University Press, 1994,1998) I purchased a copy through Barnes and Noble's online store (it was in stock.) One correction to an earlier posting, though, the flute is a half wavelength instrument due to the fact that although it has a cylindrical bore, it is open on both ends, as opposed to the clarinet which is closed at the mouthpiece when the reed closes against the moutpiece.
Good luck with your research!
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Author: Dee
Date: 1999-02-26 03:22
Some more tidbits.
1. Flutes respond acoustically like a cylinder open on both ends. Flutes thus make their first register jump as an octave. The basic wave form is close to a sine wave.
2. Clarinets respond like a cylinder closed on one end and is very similar to an organ pipe in that regard. Thus the clarinet sound is rich in the odd harmonics while the even almost non-existent. The basic wave form is close to that of a square wave. Their first register jump is a twelfth rather than the octave.
3. Oboes and saxophones respond like conical pipes closed on one end. Both these instruments jump by the octave for the first register change. The oboe sound wave is close to a sawtooth wave in form. I don't know about the sax.
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Author: paul
Date: 1999-02-26 21:29
An odd sounding title, but here's a set of clarinet physics questions.
If the clarinet plays like a closed end horn when the reed slaps down, essentially giving it a 4:1 (from what I think I understand from the postings above) tube length to wavelength ratio, a register "step" in 12ths instead of 8ths, and a unique sound based on lots of odd overtones (and perhaps a few even overtones), does the clarinet play like an open ended horn when the reed opens up?
I think I know the answer, based on playing the clarinet, but here's the kicker to it all...
If the clarinet plays more like an open instrument with the reed open, yet like a closed instrument with the reed closed, why does the clarinet's overall behavior sway so heavily to the closed horn dynamics?
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Author: Ken Shaw
Date: 1999-02-26 22:23
paul wrote:
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An odd sounding title, but here's a set of clarinet physics questions.
If the clarinet plays like a closed end horn when the reed slaps down, essentially giving it a 4:1 (from what I think I understand from the postings above) tube length to wavelength ratio, a register "step" in 12ths instead of 8ths, and a unique sound based on lots of odd overtones (and perhaps a few even overtones), does the clarinet play like an open ended horn when the reed opens up?
I think I know the answer, based on playing the clarinet, but here's the kicker to it all...
If the clarinet plays more like an open instrument with the reed open, yet like a closed instrument with the reed closed, why does the clarinet's overall behavior sway so heavily to the closed horn dynamics?
Paul -
The clarinet always vibrates as a closed tube. I have read (in Benade, I believe) that the clarinet reed spends more time sealed against the lay than it does open. This longer time spent closed promotes the closed-tube mode, which is why the clarinet sounds and overblows as it does. During the time the reed is open, the vibration remains in closed-tube mode, since any open-tube vibration is overpowered by the longer-lasting closed tube vibration.
An instrument can produce a stable tone only when it reliably acts as a closed or open pipe. The clarinet is designed to stay firmly in the closed-tube mode, just as the saxophone is designed to stay in open-tube mode, even though its reed seals completely against the mouthpiece just as it does on the clarinet, but for a shorter time.
There have been attempts at an intermediate instrument, with a slightly conical bore that balances the open and closed periods, or falls just barely on the open tube side, but they were unsuccessful. A number of years ago, at the late, great Ponte's music store, Charlie Ponte brought out an early 20th century instrument called, I think, an "Octinet," which had a clarinet setup but a bore just conical enough to act as an open tube and overblow at the octave. It was difficult to play, and sounded more like a saxophone than a clarinet. Whenever I tried to make a clarinet sound, it quit playing altogether. Ponte also had a couple of Hungarian tarogatos, a sort of wooden soprano saxophone but with a less severely conical bore. It has a bit of clarinet in the sound, but is mostly saxophone.
Best regards.
Ken Shaw
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Author: Rick2
Date: 1999-02-27 04:05
More tidbits:
1) Paul, If you think of the wave equation, in the case of a woodwind instrument, the differential equation is not equal to zero, but is equal to some function describing the vibration of the reed.
2) Woodwinds are Bessel horns. There are three basic shapes that have fingerings close together enough for humans to finger, the cylinder, the cone, and a very quickly flaring bell shape that is acoustically impossible. That leaves the cylinder (clarinet) and the cone (sax, oboe). Of course, neither instrument has a perfectly shaped bore, they are modified slightly.
3) The shape of the tone holes is far more important than the material the instrument is made from when considering tone quality.
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Author: Don Poulsen
Date: 1999-02-27 18:33
The Scientific American article I cited in an earlier post was based on the author's attempt to create an instrument other than cylindrical or conical. As I recall, he determined that it was not possible.
And, by the way, 4:1 is the wavelength to tube length ratio, not the tube length to wavelength ratio. This means that a clarinet, bass clarinet, etc. only needs to be half as long as a sax, bassoon, oboe, etc. to play the same note.
It is also interesting to note, from what I understand, that the theoretical ranges of clarinets are greater that other woodwinds. Somebody correct me, don't most woodwinds have a range of about 2 1/2 octaves where a clarinet can reach 3 1/2 octaves and a low-C member of the clarinet family should be able to reach 4 octaves. (I haven't quite reached that C in the sky with my bass clarinet, but I come close.)
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Author: Rick2
Date: 1999-02-27 21:40
I surprised a soprano sax player with my range just today and I can't get past altissimo G.
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Author: paul
Date: 1999-03-01 17:45
I believe the Bb soprano clarinet is theoretically capable of 4 octaves (low chalemeau E to high chalemeau E, high chalemeau E to clarion E, clarion E to low altissimo E, and low altissimo E to high altissimo E). At least that's what I thought I saw in Ridenour's Fingering Book.
Perhaps the next time I squeak I'll tell my wife that I was temporarily practicing in the high altissimo range. Something tells me that she won't buy that line for too long. 
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