 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: claclaws
Date: 2005-04-18 08:25
In my recent trip to Geneva, I bought a box of 56 Rue Lepic from Servette 92.
GBK, your post (http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=121293&t=121293) and another discussion (http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=141710&t=119003) were very helpful, and somewhat mitigate my initial excitement about these reeds. At initial 2-3 tries, I found them superb, played really so differently from other ones from the blue box. (Maybe I became biased towards a new product?)
What does 'break-in' mean in your review? Is that the 'preparation' of the reeds for several days before you actually play them (=putting in water for some time, etc) ?
Thanks in advance.
Lucy Lee Jang
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-04-18 11:22
Although I primarily use Gonzalez FOF and Gonzalez Regular Cut reeds, the break in procedure on the Davie Cane website is a good pattern to follow for all reed brands:
http://www.daviecane.com/Pages/FAQ.html
The Vandoren 56 Rue Lepic reeds were clearly an attempt to recapture some of the market share lost by the sudden rise in popularity of other brands. It is Vandoren's logic that: "If a thick blank reed is good, then a thicker blank reed must be better." The only problem was that the cane quality was identical.
The Vandoren 56 Rue Lepic reeds were not to my liking, as I did not see any improvement in either cane quality or consistancy over other Vandoren reeds to warrant their price.
See my initial review at:
http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=121293&t=121293
Over the past few years, as I have played with many professional freelance clarinetists, I have tried to make note of their preferred reed choice. Most are either playing (in descending order) Vandoren V12's, Gonzalez FOF, Grand Concerts, or Zonda. I have yet to find anyone using the Vandoren 56.
Strictly unscientific, but perhaps interesting.
BTW - All Vandoren reeds will benefit significantly from 2 simple steps:
1. As (IMO) the cane has not aged long enough - purchase and date your boxes of Vandoren reeds. Build up a supply of Vandoren reeds, and let all boxes "age" for an additional 6 months before playing.
2. Almost ALL Vandoren reeds are harder on the left side than the right side. When balancing, first remove a tiny bit of material on the left side before making any other adjustments. Sometimes, that it the ONLY adjustment you will have to make.
...GBK
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Author: jim S.
Date: 2005-04-18 14:42
GBK-- You mention Grand Concert reeds used by professionals. Was there any preference expressed for Evolutions over regular thick blanks, or vice versa?
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-04-18 15:17
I noticed that more players used the Evolution reeds...GBK
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Author: Clarinetgirl06
Date: 2005-04-18 18:51
GBK, you said:
1. As (IMO) the cane has not aged long enough - purchase and date your boxes of Vandoren reeds. Build up a supply of Vandoren reeds, and let all boxes "age" for an additional 6 months before playing.
Well, I read Perfect a Reed and Beyond by Ben Armato and it says that you can't age cane unless it is still in the ground. He says that it's just a myth that by keeping a box of reeds for 6 months before playing them will age them. "Aging" won't help the sound of the reed or the quality at all. All it does is make the reed sit there for 6 months...
Correct me if I am wrong or if I am misunderstanding either you or Ben Armato.
I never age my Rue Lepics or my V12's.
I find that the Rue Lepics take longer to break in, but I actually do like them better than the V12's. I just soak them for about 5-10 minutes, let them dry, play them and put them away. I then will soak individual reeds again if they still seem too hard/stuffy/unresponsive. Just gradual playing and reed rotation will help too. Like GBK said, you should look at the break in process at Davie Cane- it's very informative.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-04-18 19:21
From Vandoren (paraphrased):
Cane takes 4 years from planting until manufacturing into reeds. After 2 years the cane has reached the proper size and diameter. It is cut, bundled and let dry for an additional 2 years before beginning the manufacturing process.
Many players (including myself) have complained about the greenish tint and often lack of aging/drying of the cane. Perhaps 4 years is not enough total time? Perhaps they have not been let dry for 2 years?
An additional 6 months (or more), certainly will not hurt the reeds, and in fact may significantly improve them.
BTW - The Gonzalez FOF and Regular Cut clarinet reeds presently being sold are from the harvest of 1998 and 1999 ...GBK
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Author: Clarinetgirl06
Date: 2005-04-18 19:26
Thanks for the information GBK.
Where is this greenish tint on the reed? I have never noticed it... I see a yellowish tint.
So is Ben Armato wrong in what he is saying? I have never aged a reed, so I don't know what to think about it. I am just confused about what I should do with reed aging, etc.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-04-18 19:33
Like all wood products, reeds after being cut, must dry and adjust to temperature/humidity/climate conditions.
Just like with grenadilla, where aging is crucial, the proper aging of cane is imperative to bring relative stability to a product which is more porous and where critical tolerances are measured in millimeters.
Ask any carpenter who has used newly cut 2x4 lumber to frame with. After a short time, the wood dramatically changes - often twisting, shrinking/swelling and changing dimensions.
Why would you not think cane is any different?...GBK
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Author: larryb
Date: 2005-04-18 19:59
GBK - the Gonzales alto saxophone reeds that I recently purchased were from 2001 harvest year.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-04-18 20:25
larryb wrote:
> GBK - the Gonzales alto saxophone reeds that I recently
> purchased were from 2001 harvest year.
My last purchase of alto saxophone reeds was from the 1999 harvest. Obviously they are now all sold out.
Since the Gonzalez (1999 harvest) alto saxophone, (2001 harvest) tenor saxophone and (2001 harvest) bass clarinet reeds are still a relatively new product, my guess is that, after initial testing, and retooling, the first batch of blanks which were of sufficient size and age to produce these reeds were finally ready. The alto saxophone reeds, in particular, sold much more quickly than Gonzalez had anticipated.
Phil Shapiro, of course, would have the definitive answer, but I would think that the 2001 harvest will be available be quite a while ...GBK
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2005-04-18 21:46
When playing the new Rue Lepic,
if you don't break it in you will squic.
So make sure that you wet
and dry them 'till you get
a reed strong and long-lasting, not wic.
With apologies to nos amis français......
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Author: L. Omar Henderson
Date: 2005-04-18 22:58
Attachment: Musicalis1.jpg (414k)
(Disclaimer - I have developed a genetically modified Arundo Donax, ss Musicalis)
I have recently been involved in growing test plots of a genetically altered Arundo Donax and the harvesting, drying, and aging techniques.
Attached is a photo of harvested Arundo Donax - the two right canes are recently havested an put horizontally on drying racks to dry and cure in the sun, they have a green tint characteristic of the native plant. The left hand cane is a partially dried cane which is showing more of the characteristic yellow color after sun aging and turning for about a week, and the middle short section is a completely dried, sized, and cut portion of cane suitable for use in making reeds.
I have discovered that the plight of all farmers and reed cane growers is the weather and environmental conditions surrounding the harvest and curing and drying of the cane. This is an experienced based rather than a time based procedure. If there is not enough sun and dry conditions the process takes much longer and may in fact not be complete if environmental conditions are not right. The Var region of France is blessed with relatively dry and sunny conditions most of the spring and summer but not always. If the harvest season is short the aging and drying space may force growers to cut short the sun aging process due to space and time considerations.
Interestingly, most of the cane used for reeds does not come from the plantations of Rico, Vandoren, etc. but like the grapes used for California wine, they can come from many regions and also from other countries - primarily Spain. Like tobacco auctions in my home state of Maryland, the growers bring their product (tobacco or cane) to an auction house and a sample is displayed and then the bidders buy it at varying prices depending on the quality. It is up to the bidders to get a mixture of qualities at the best average price to mix to produce the companies product.
L. Omar Henderson
(I do not sell cane - these are tests)
Post Edited (2005-04-18 23:01)
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Author: Ed
Date: 2005-04-18 23:58
Recently, I have tried a couple of boxes of Vandoren's Rue Lepic reeds. I have used them professionally in a few orchestral jobs. I was very impressed with these reeds. They worked very well and had a nice ringing tone with lots of warmth. They played very comfortably and responded well. They were very stable, did not take long to break in and lasted a long time. These are all characteristics that I look for in a good reed. I have a couple of other colleagues who have had the same results.
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Author: claclaws
Date: 2005-04-19 00:02
Thank you, GBK and others, for your inputs.
This thread is for me THE guidance for reed selection.
I bookmarked the daviecane.com webpage, and copied the reed break-in information to make continuous reference.
David Spiegelthal,
you really summed up what one should do with new Lepics, with such sweet rhymes!^^
By the way, do we have many Francais on this bboard? I want to know what 'ecouvillon' means..?
Please let me quote this thread in my clarinet blog.
[ OK with me - GBK ]
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-04-19 00:43
I think that the Lepic reeds sound a lot better than the V-12
They are similar in sound to the Grand Concert Thick Blank to me.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-04-19 07:58
I could write page after page,
But it just fosters my rage.
Let's all go tell Lauren,
(The rep from Vandoren),
"Please let the cane properly age!"
...GBK
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Author: L. Omar Henderson
Date: 2005-04-19 23:51
As an addendum to the auction of reed cane:
The most desirable - dense, reed quality cane comprises only about 10%
(the French auction cane) of the total cane sold to make reeds (private communication with a buyer) and the total supply has remained pretty much the same over the years. Some say that the supply has gone up but due to new growers that do not take the care in aging their cane as old growers.
With increased demand the same 10% must be spread out over more buyers which means less high quality cane per buyer - unless they are willing to pay a premium price. Also, a company can quickly increase their bottom line profit by buying less desirable (density, aging, etc.) cane lots that in the past would be passed up by all buyers.
Of course I am biased but I see the future of natural cane production focusing on improved growing techniques and improved plant stock. The plastic reed may also take over before we run out of high quality cane! (Disclaimer - I have developed a genetically altered Arundo Donax, ss Musicalis).
L. Omar Henderson
Post Edited (2005-04-19 23:53)
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Author: VermontJM
Date: 2005-04-22 22:35
I love the Rue Lepic reeds, but I think they die faster. They just seem to get soft a whole lot faster than V12s
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