 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2005-03-15 06:51
This article is priceless. Thank you.
As an aspiring non-ed composer who has a piece for middle school band on the back burner (which is the exact opposite of, and lightly pokes fun at, everything the article describes), I can't agree more.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: ohsuzan
Date: 2005-03-15 13:11
Thanks for the link to this amusing article.
I was immediately transported back to my high school days and a particular piece called "Woodland Journey", whose evocations of forest glades and babbling brooks and chirping chipmunks cured me of any interest in "program music" forever.
And I can tell you, from my more recent experience, that much of what is being published as "church music" (for adults) has fallen into the same abyss.
But I don't quite understand the author's affection for medleys from Broadway musicals. To my mind, these are among the worst offenders. Why not use the actual overture to the musical -- modified as necessary for instrumentation or difficulty level -- rather than these pastiches of often unmemorable tunes taken out of context (she asks, gagging)?
Susan
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Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-15 13:31
speaking from experience, and recent, I might add (last week I played in the all new england music fest), I must say I agree. And I think most of the musicians in this festival did to. Someone asked the director why he had chosen the music he did (by no-name composers- I can't even recall their names, nor do I care to). He replied, "There isn't much music composed for a concert band this size [to give you an idea, there were about 6 tubas, 3 bass clarinets, about 25 clarinets...] anything you could play would be a transcription of orchestral music, so we're stuck with this contemporary music"
indeed we are. and what a shame. I love that people are still composing, but sometimes when you have high altissimo clarinet F# and Fs (at the same time!)- for that "rub" effect, it gets to be a little much. and there are only so many tri tones you can throw into a piece, I mean really!!
If I have to play another piece that comes near the name of "zion" or "apocalyptic dreams", I think I might scream. I'll take Mozart and Debussy any day!
-Lindsie
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Author: BobD
Date: 2005-03-15 15:35
"initial helicopter landing of the 1st Marine Division during the Korean War (yes, that really is one frequently played high-school band piece), "
Well, I was tending to agree with Buyansky until I came upon the above example of his argument at which point I lost some confidence in it. The reference is to the piece "Inchon" which, if you have rehearsed and played it, ain't that bad. The problem is, however, as B mentions later, that the composer's other pieces seem to sound similar. But that problem is not unique to contemporary composers.
Bob Draznik
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Author: johnsonfromwisconsin
Date: 2005-03-15 15:47
I'll just take advantage of this thread by going on record with this:
I hate patriotic and holiday medleys.
-JfW
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Author: ohsuzan
Date: 2005-03-15 15:48
<<The problem is, however, as B mentions later, that the composer's other pieces seem to sound similar.>>
OK -- as I said above, I agree with the author's basic premise. But, for the sake of argument, what might we say is the difference between a composer's works demonstrating an identifiable "style" (e.g., Mozart), vs. being boring and repetitious?
S.
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Author: Terry Stibal
Date: 2005-03-15 16:00
Well, my current objection to this is the presence of a "arrangement" of American Patrol in the local teaching "big band" library that is, without a doubt pure, unadulterated "dreck" of the worst kind. It shares the melody across all three horn sections, adds cute little quotes of other tunes from American musical history, and has endless repeats to pad the damn'd thing out.
Contrasted with a straight transcription of the original arrangement used by Miller's group, there's absolutely no comparison. Houghten's arrangement, while it does have two (easy) doubles, clarinet and alto subbing for an alto and the baritone for some sections (and it does have particularly nasty horn changes for the poor baritone player), is more melodic and "fun" while not being technically beyond the level of advanced middle school students, much less high school kids.
During the Christmas season last year, we had to gin up a set list toute suite for a public event, and we were short by about ten arrangements of the "right" number of charts for same. My band director members managed to scrape up enough "Xmas" charts to get us through, but the difference in the writing is so obvious when these charts are contrasted with, say, the Harry Connick arrangement of Sleigh Ride. Sometimes, though, you've got to hold your nose and play it through. Ditto with some musicals.
leader of Houston's Sounds Of The South Dance Orchestra
info@sotsdo.com
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2005-03-15 16:20
One of the wind ensembles I play in has a former member, a friend of some of the other musicians (all of whom are current or former school band directors), who is now a full-time composer of band music. i won't name his name, but he is EXACTLY the person described in the article. I HATE the guy's music and cringe every time I'm asked to play it -- and I feel sorry for the school kids who get that sort of drivel shoved onto their music stands.
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Author: clarinetwife
Date: 2005-03-15 17:36
Boy am I with ohsuzan about the medleys-- we play WAY too many of them in our community orchestra. The actual overtures work much better. It was really disappointing when we were going to play Superman that we ended up with this mickey mouse school arrangement that simplified and ruined the entire rhythmic underpinning of the piece. Just teach kids the real rhythm, they can do it! Unfortunately, the rental for John Williams own version was a hefty chunk of our entire music budget for that concert , and we could buy the mickey mouse version for probably a quarter of the price.
By the way, ohsuzan, I like your screen name. My husband's brother is called O'John by all his nieces and nephews. When the oldest was just a little guy he used to wander the house looking for his uncle calling "Oh JOOHHN!!"
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Author: Shorthand
Date: 2005-03-15 18:58
When raising funds for our community band by making demo recordings for one of these publishing houses, we actually did play a piece that was named after an apartment complex.
However, I have a great deal of hope going forward. Our director's wife is the most active comissioner of middle school pieces around, and we've been playing a lot of the more musical middle-school level pieces, including Alligator Alley, Shenandoah (one of her earlier comissions), and honestly most of the Ticheli pieces on Hash's list.
I'm impressed by much of what's coming out these days. However, I have to wonder how much of what's driving this is pricing. I'd like to see pricing added to Hash's list. The other problem is of course search costs for directors - its hard to find the pearls, and lists like Hash's are based on the reputation of the composer. For example, I for one was not impressed with Ticheli's new "Simple Gifts" - I didn't find it adding much at all over and above Copland's setting.
We have about three aspiring composers and/or arrangers in the group as well. Thankfully, none of them, though two are band directors here, have anything like a cookie-cutter attitude towards their music. On the other hand, reading some of the early drafts definitely demystifies the process.
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Author: clarinetist04
Date: 2005-03-15 22:37
I tend to agree with the author on the point of (what she alluded to as) "Education Music." That is a wretched term but bear with me. However, like Bob Draznik, I also was a little swayed to lose confidence in the article.
The main reason so is that he is, for all intensive purposes, attacking some of the band staples that have pioneered the future of the band. The most obvious one is Variations on a Korean Folk Song. This is not your run of the mill piece and, while he uses it to speak volumes about the use of folk song settings, it is important to realize that this is a FINE piece that won the Ostwald Award for crying out loud. It seems as though he is attacking the inspiration behind a piece and not necissarily the skill of the composer. If I write a piece about a man on drugs, he would probably not like that because it is cliched nowadays...but I bet he has no problem with Symphonie Fantastique.
I guess my main complaint is not his view, as for the most part, I am in aggreement with him. But rather I have a problem with the way he generalized the whole of new music. David Gillingham's music, Ticheli, Charles Rochester Young, Michael Djupstrom, Timothy Broege, Mark Camphouse, Jack Stamp...all of these composers wrote great pieces but he contends that they aren't as worthwhile as a Mozart Serenade because they are too "programatic" (for lack of a better word for music that is inspired by something like recycling or whatever). It seems as if he is judging that book before he has even openned the cover, thus shadowing a bit of contempt around the whole piece and not giving himself a chance to like it.
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Author: Synonymous Botch
Date: 2005-03-15 23:47
Programming could be worse; your Director could be set about to personally save Circus Music - an oxymoron if ever there was one....
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2005-03-16 01:23
1) <<If I have to play another piece that comes near the name of "zion" or "apocalyptic dreams", I think I might scream. I'll take Mozart and Debussy any day!>>
Dan Welcher's "Zion" is a pretty cool piece.
2) Medleys should not be played. Ever. And Broadway should stay on Broadway. :P
3) I don't think people upset in such matters have anything against program music per se, but rather against the SAME program that so many pieces seem to have: Something majestic happens (native peoples, animals, old city), and it is hip and nice, then something sad happens (industrialization, economic collapse, death in the family, constipation), but it's alright [sic] because the true spirit lives on. HUZZAH, and on to a grand conclusion that happens for no adequately explored reason!!!!!
I think the problem with program music lately is that it's all been played out. Most new "program" music, especially for band, falls into one of a few categories:
- something is nice
- ooh look, nature!
- we are traveling somewhere that an adventure may occur
- grand victory
- something sad happened
- the sea!
- a festival where everyone is happy
Heck, 19th and early 20th century program music included guillotines, sleeping around, swordfights, wood nymphs, mythological heroes, violent storms, the underworld, and sorcery, to name a few.
4) Clarinetist04, try "formulaic" rather than programmatic.
--
Anyways, back to writing my piece that *embraces* the possibility that an ensemble may have 35 clarinets or none at all.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-16 01:28
Quote:
Programming could be worse; your Director could be set about to personally save Circus Music - an oxymoron if ever there was one....
heh...ever hear of Karl King's "melody shop"? perhaps that's not circus music, per se, but it sounds like it! (mixed with a march).
-Lindsie
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Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-16 01:30
anyone ever hear the piece Godzilla? sorry, I can't remember who wrote it...it was by the same guy who wrote October (BEAUTIFUL PIECE!!)
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2005-03-16 03:42
The piece in question is "Gawd$illa Eats Las Vegas", by Eric Whitacre.
It's an extremely fun, cool piece, especially toward the beginning. The ending leaves some to be desired. Be sure to have the program notes when you listen.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: allencole
Date: 2005-03-16 06:01
Actually, I agree with the author on the Broadway thing, too. The point is that Broadway show tunes are real music and an important part of our musical history. Music ensembles should be exposing students to it, rather than doing some of the contrived educational stuff that I think most of us shudder at.
I agree that overtures would do a lot better than some of the medleys, but some of that invokes technical issues that most high school bands can't handle.
Ohsusan: You are absolute right about the state of church music. 30 years ago, we were complaining about the sing-songiness of John W. Peterson, but this newer stuff seems straight out of Las Vegas.
The typical Easter or Christmas musical these days seems to always have songs resembling:
Hill Street Blues
Tubular Bells
You Needed Me
My Way
Plus some black gospel sounds that have been gutted of most of their soul.
These things are so identical that we now have church members who for years have become typecast as Jesus, Pilate, Ciaphus, etc.
I also remember playing some really hideous Christian folk-rock during my early teen years and my "guitar phase." Most of that has improved tremendously, but now we have Praise Choruses too send me running and screaming.
I wonder what Fanny Crosby, B. B. McKinney and all those old hymn writers would say?
Allen Cole
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Author: bawa
Date: 2005-03-16 10:32
The article was a real laugh, and the discussion following it interesting.
It was also unexpected...as I have listened to the same minuet played again and again on every instrument.
A comment a bit of the tangent was made by my clarinet daughter yesterday. At her age she is in the wind ensemble of the conservatory (waiitng to joing the full orchestra in a couple of years time). We went to see a concert by their counterparts in strings, who played Steg and Vivaldi this time, and she was a bit tearful afterwards,
"Why do we have to play a certain type of band piece all the time? Why can't we work on something more "orchestral"?"
I can understand her frustration, Mary Poppins medley is fun, Oregon etc. too, but they do this all the time. And they have a good array of all instruments, so they could do something a bit more adventurous.
Any suggestions-???
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Author: Erdinet
Date: 2005-03-16 10:38
As a junior high school band director on Long Island (that's New York for those of you from out of town) I have to say that this article, the follow up written by its author, and even the "Naming Conventions for Bad Bad Music" (link found in the follow up article) are all priceless.
One of my biggest complaint about my gig is the wealth of bad music available. Its incredible to me that my kids all know what the term "Maestoso" means but are totally flummoxed when "Andante" is put in front of them. More incredible is the fact that the kids all think that every piece is written in the key of concert Bb!!!! Well, since just about every piece they have ever played is in concert Bb why would that change?! Rare is the clarinet (or trumpet) player in one of my bands (8th and 9th grade) that knows to play an F# when its not notated as an accidental.
I think what this article has hit upon is a general laziness that abounds in our educational system as a whole. As a second year full time teacher, I have to say first off, that this is the greatest gig ever. Second of all, the gig gives one ample opportunity to slack off and get complacent....really quickly. Other benefits also include plenty of time to practice and improve one's musical skills, and the freedom (in my case) of turning down work in the music world that you do no necessarily want to do any more (ie low paying wedding gigs, throw away copying gigs, and so on.)
The other thing that the gig allows, is the chance to see just how much drek the music and educational publishing businesses put out there. In my view this is a two pronged problem. The music pbulishers want to put out "hits" that will sell. Thus, the plethora of arrangements of "Hey Ya", "Pop Hits of the 90's" and so on. The educational publishers want to put stuff out that will fit into "rubrics" and "lesson planners" and "curriculum enhancers" and other fancy concepts. Thus the many "teaching pieces" that are sent out there. What is rare (and this should not be a shock to any one) is how little there is out there that is actually good. It should not be a shock because quality is rare IN ALL AREAS of life and society as we know it. Quality (almost always) costs more money, and (almost always) takes more time, usually for less reward. Hence the reason that John Williams, Danny Elfman and the like are so busy on their $500+K movie scores instead of writing for my kids.
So what is to be done? In my case, my long term project is to build up a music library of quality over the next 3 to 5 years. It is getting a hold of the students and making them understand the music is in more than one key and working with them to expand their abilities to accomdate this daunting fact. And then taking that or anyt other new-found knowledge, confidence, and ability and applying to other areas of life and school. I am trying from this coming spring concert onwards to put one premier per concert on the program, whether its an arrangementor original by myself or someone else. (This concert its an arrangement that I did of a song by the group Radiohead. You should have seen my kids faces when I played the original for them...talk about confused.) Alot more work for me in terms of time put in and discipline. (When a kids says that your song sucks, you kind cannot take it personally.) But, it gives the kids ownership of the music since they are helping you write (or rewrite it) and it gives them a look into the process of creating the music as opposed to merely re-creating it.
The amazing thing about teaching is that every day is the first day. You never know what the kids are going to put out there next. However, the kids know that when they come into band class that they will get to work (together) and possibly make something amazing happen and may be even have some fun in the course of their day. Does that mean that some really lame, annoying piece that I really cannot stand is going to creep into the repertoire? Hopefully as seldom as possible. But, the most important thing I believe I can show these kids is that you HAVE to give anything a chance before you make a judgement. We sight read a piece yesterday and it sounded that way and the usual grumbles started ("this song sucks" "let's do something we know" blah blah blah). They need to be reminded that anything good takes time. Hell, WE (the teachers) need to be reminded of that. At the same time we need to be reminded that its ok to cut the cord once you have given it enough time....and it still isn't good. Sometimes, that is even harder to do.
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