 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-05 19:54
does anyone know of any good clarinet duets...possibly with piano accompaniment... that's at my playing level (I've been playing for 8 years and have had private lessons for 6)? this should exclude Baermann or anything that's like 30-60 seconds long. thanks.
-Lindsie
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2005-03-06 05:38
I remember liking the Hindemit Sonata for clarinet and piano. Another nice sonata for clarinet and piano is by San Sans (have no idea how to spell his name).
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Author: Aussiegirl
Date: 2005-03-06 06:29
Theres a really sweet ave maria that can be two clarinets or clarinet and soprano...its really pretty, but i couldnt tell you the composer sorry! I played it as clarinet/violin piano and it worked really well, not too hard but its a lip killer!
Fiona
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2005-03-06 06:54
Oh I missunderstood you. I thought you meant clarinet and piano, but I guess you meant 2 clarinets and piano or just 2 clarinets. In that case a really great piece is the Poulenc clarinet duo!
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2005-03-06 12:59
From the 2 genres I know in music, good and bad, the Poulenc clarinet duo is good.
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Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-06 13:23
oh, never mind...1899 - 1963, that means he's from either the romantic period (1820-1900) or the impressionistic period (1870-1920). Not sure. I bet there is some other period of music I'm missing...
anyway, I found a site that will give me an idea. If anyone else is interested, here's the site:
http://www.vcisinc.com/clarinetmusicpiano.htm
thanks everyone!
-Lindsie
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2005-03-06 13:54
I don't like all those definitions. Romantic, impressionistic, etc.
Did I understand you correct that you are not interested in the Poulenc clarinet duo because the time he wrote it? Maybe I misunderstood.
Actually thing thread reminded me of how great Poulenc. There is a CD with a lot of great pieces by him, like the clarinet duo, and the clarinet and basoon duo that I'm going to order soon.
Music is life, I have to thank you fo creating this thread or else I would probably forget about it Poulec and his great music.
If you want to listen to samples from that CD (including the clarinet duo played by the great Michel Portal) you can do it here: http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/B000024XZ0/qid=1110120628/sr=1-6/ref=sr_1_6/102-5339669-0141716?v=glance&s=classical
Sometimes links to Amazon don't work so if it doesn't just search for Michel Portal in calssical music, and look for the CD Poulenc: Chamber Music.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-06 14:04
The best duo I know of with piano is the Ponchelli - Ill Convegno.
A favorite of mine.
Also there is a nice arrangement of the Dvorak Slavonic Dances for 2 Clarinets and Piano.
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Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-06 14:08
clarnibass wrote:
> Did I understand you correct that you are not interested in the
> Poulenc clarinet duo because the time he wrote it? Maybe I
> misunderstood.
no! of course not! I was just wondering what genre of music he is. I have little knowledge of music history. It's sad. I really like Debussy, who's from the impressionistic period, if I am not mistaken. So I try to find composers from the same time period. Not that I dislike other periods, I'm just not a lover of the music that came from the classical period. (not to say I hate it all, of course, just not my favorite time period)
thanks, btw! ![[grin]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie5.gif)
![[toast]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smiley15.gif)
-Lindsie
Post Edited (2005-03-06 14:09)
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2005-03-06 14:18
The 2 Poulenc pieces (sonata and duo sonata) are pretty much essential pieces of our repertoire, and are both crowd pleasers - very approachable and pretty tonal, and would be great introductory pieces for a concert or recital of 20th century music.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-03-06 15:47
The Poulenc Sonata for Two Clarinets (1918) is written for a Bb clarinet on the top part and an A clarinet on the bottom part.
That often presents a problem for high school students wanting to perform this piece...GBK
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Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-06 15:56
GBK wrote:
> The Poulenc Sonata for Two Clarinets (1918) is written for a Bb
> clarinet on the top part and an A clarinet on the bottom part.
>
> That often presents a problem for high school students wanting
> to perform this piece
why? lack of A? or transposition issues? because my friend and I are both very good at sight transposition and I have the tools to transpose it into a notated form if needed, so that wouldn't be an issue
-Lindsie
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-03-06 16:09
Most high school students either do not have an A clarinet, or own one that has acceptable intonation.
BTW - do not play the Poulenc Duo transposed with 2 Bb clarinets. It defeats the entire effect of the piece. Also, it is NOT a piece you can sight transpose, no matter how good your skill is...GBK
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Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-06 17:28
GBK wrote:
> BTW - do not play the Poulenc Duo transposed with 2 Bb
> clarinets. It defeats the entire effect of the piece. Also, it
> is NOT a piece you can sight transpose, no matter how good your
> skill is...GBK
why, timbre?
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-03-06 17:43
Obviously.
Since the written range of the A clarinet part in this piece could theoretically be played by a Bb clarinet (the A clarinet part only goes down to a written F3) if Poulenc had wanted the Duo to be played by 2 Bb clarinets he would have originally written it that way...GBK
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2005-03-06 18:19
That makes a lot of sense GBK, but have you actually heard it played by 2 Bb clarinets? I wonder if the loss of playing it with 2 Bb clarinets is so big that it's worth not playing this piece at all, since it's such a great piece.
Just because it sounds better with a Bb and an A, doesn't mean it sounds bad with 2 Bbs.
I think "do not play the Poulenc Duo transposed with 2 Bb clarinets. It defeats the entire effect of the piece." is a bit of an exaggeration.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-03-06 18:27
Why don't we just play it with 2 alto clarinets? How about 2 C clarinets?
One of the unique challenges of the piece is the blending of the two different (Bb and A) clarinets.
The Poulenc Duo is once again in the NYSSMA (New York) manual as a Level 6 competition piece. It was removed for a while because too many high school students butchered it to death.
Any attempted performance with 2 Bb clarinets will not be scored by a NYSSMA judge for the reasons I previously cited...GBK
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-06 19:06
GBK - I had a student who played the Husa Evocations on the wrong clarinet and transposed.
Doesn't get much more difficult than that one. (but I totally agree with your statement that it shouldn't be played transposed - the Husa was done by his chamber group and I didn't know he was going to be working on it till he brought it to a lesson).
16 yr old too!
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-06 19:09
---------------------------
I think "do not play the Poulenc Duo transposed with 2 Bb clarinets. It
defeats the entire effect of the piece." is a bit of an exaggeration.
-----------------------------
I agree with GBK on that one completely. The timbre of the notes is just wrong to play it both on Bb.
If you want to prove it, just record it both ways and I'll tell you which is which.
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Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-06 19:12
I personally like the way the A clarinet sounds on the mozart clarinet concerto...better than the Bb anyway. But I've played the Bb transposition from the original A on the A, just for fun, then on the Bb- there was just something about it... I know it's not the saem- actually it's kind of the opposite of what you're saying, but I do understand the purpose of having an A as opposed to a transposed Bb- it's different and there's a reason that it's in A.
but GBK you just make me want to play it!!
Quote:
The Poulenc Duo is once again in the NYSSMA (New York) manual as a Level 6 competition piece. It was removed for a while because too many high school students butchered it to death.
gee. thanks. I'm sure there are plenty of HS students who CAN play it, and very well too.
Quote:
Most high school students either do not have an A clarinet, or own one that has acceptable intonation.
wouldn't say I've met a lot of adults (unless they have the cash) who have decent As.
-Lindsie
Post Edited (2005-03-06 19:13)
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-06 19:19
Yes, of course Mozart sounds better on the A, but the timbre stays the same if you play it on the Bb as the Piano part is the only thing which is transposed.
Playing it on the Bb with the old music minus one version of the Quintet which they transpose the A to Bb clarinet is the same problem of the timbre being completely wrong.
It doesn't start on a low Clarinet F# on Bb clarinet, it starts on low G on A clarinet.
Completely different sound even though the pitch is the same.
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2005-03-06 19:34
"Why don't we just play it with 2 alto clarinets? How about 2 C clarinets?"
Because most clarinetists have a Bb clarinet, but probably don't have alto or C clarinets. A lot (including myself) don't have an A clarinet either.
"The timbre of the notes is just wrong to play it both on Bb.
If you want to prove it, just record it both ways and I'll tell you which is which."
No need for that, I absolutely believe you. I also agree with you and GBK that it probably sounds better on an A clarinet.
All I'm saying is if you can't or don't have the money to rent/buy an A clarinet it doesn't mean you can't play this piece. I didn't see he/she (is lindsie a male or a female name?) say it's for an exam. If that is the case, then like GBK said, it's a different story.
I bet that if I would only hear that piece played by both Bb clarinets and didn't even know it's for a Bb and A I would still think it's a great piece, because it is.
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2005-03-06 19:42
clarnibass wrote:
> All I'm saying is if you can't or don't have the money to
> rent/buy an A clarinet it doesn't mean you can't play this
> piece.
But it would be much better and infinitely more practical to work on those pieces of the repertoire for which you have the correct instrument.
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Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-06 20:44
Lindsie is a female name.
I am playing for a recital. A student recital which I suspect will be filled up with younger and less experienced players than me. A few at my level. Most of the audience will contain parents who are not well-versed in classical music literature. Maybe my director and teacher (and I guess everyone else's teachers, as most of them tend to be their student's accompanist). So I'm not looking for anything magic. But if this piece needs to be transposed and cant be done by sight, I wont play it, since I dont have time and my friend doesn't have sibelius, so...
Mark Charette wrote:
> But it would be much better and infinitely more
> practical to work on those pieces of the repertoire for which
> you have the correct instrument.
agreed. however that doesn't always work. I'm lucky and have a choice, but many times in orchestra, without the proper instrument, you have to transpose.
-Lindsie
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2005-03-06 20:50
music_is_life wrote:
> Mark Charette wrote:
>
> > But it would be much better and infinitely more
> > practical to work on those pieces of the repertoire for which
> > you have the correct instrument.
>
> agreed. however that doesn't always work. I'm lucky and have a
> choice, but many times in orchestra, without the proper
> instrument, you have to transpose.
We were not talking about orchestra repertoire here, were we? We were talking about very significant portions of the clarinet repertoire as a solo instrument or duo instrument. In a recital you have a choice - find something different if you don't have the instrument!
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2005-03-06 20:56
Lindsie,
Do you know someone that you may be able to borrow an A from? A teacher or something perhaps? That could be an option if you really want to do this duet.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-03-06 21:24
I have a friend with an A, but he might not let me...some people just dont like lending out their instruments. My clar. teacher has an A but claims it's a POS. no good rentals around here...closest there is is NY (Im in CT). I'll just play something else. there is an endless amount of clarinet literature out there. anyone have a personal favorite (TWO B FLATS! ) they'd like to recommend??
-Lindsie
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-03-06 23:32
music_is_life wrote:
> wouldn't say I've met a lot of adults
> (unless they have the cash) who have decent As.
You DON'T have to be an adult to have a decent A clarinet. I have students who own excellent ones.
Of course, they have worked hard to save enough money for one and also have had professional guidance in selecting a good one...GBK
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Author: Jack Kissinger
Date: 2005-03-07 00:31
As Mark C noted, the Mendelssohn Konzertstucke are standards of the repertoire. Here are some others I have excerpted from the Luyben catalog that are, perhaps, worth exploring (most of these are apparently not in the database):
Early works, mostly classical, perhaps some early romantic:
BACKOFEN Concertante Op 10 (w/pa)
CRUSELL Drei Duos (Op 6)
DEVIENNE Duo Concertante #1, 2, or 3
HOFFMEISTER 12 Duos
HOFFMEISTER Concerto in Eb (w/pa)
KREUTZER Duo in C
KROMMER Concerto in Eb Op 91
KROMMER Concerto Op 35 (A personal favorite.)
MOZART (12 Duets arranged by Magnini - IMO, worth playing)
PLEYEL Duets (Op 8 & 59)
STADLER Duo
STAMITZ, C. Concerto #4 in Bb
TAUSCH Concertante #2 Op 26
Romantic period:
MAGNINI Duets (not sure when these were written but IMO, they're great)
RIMSKY-KORSAKOV Duet (Bb and A cl duet)
VERDI Parafrasi e fantasie di Rigoletto (Carulli)
French 20th century:
BOUFIL Grand Duo Op 2 #1 (Weston)
CAHUZAC Sonate Classique #1
CAHUZAC Sonate Classique #2
KOECHLIN 15 Pieces (probably not in the same tradition as the others in this group)
MAILLOT Douze Duos Progressifs (3 volumes, increasing difficulty - the third volume group are quite challenging and, IMO, worthwhile)
20th century. Most are likely to be quite difficult. Mostly, important composers.
BENNETT Conversations for Two Clarinets
BENNETT Crosstalk
CHILDS A Music That Might Be
DAHL Five Duets
GENZMER Capriccio
GENZMER Concerto
KOLB Rebuttal
KUBIZEK, KM Sonatina
KUPFERMAN Tip of the Iceberg
LaPORTA 14 Jazz-Rock Duets
PERSICHETTI Serenade #13
SCHOCKER Sonata for Two Clarinets and Piano (Difficult, should be a crowd pleaser.)
SCHULLER Duo Sonata (Bb Cl & Bs Cl)
SEMLER-COLLERY Piece de caractere
SKOLNIK Serenade in F
SMITH, Wm Around the Blues
SMITH, Wm Essay (1995)
SMITH, Wm Jazz Fantasy
SMITH, Wm Jazz Set (Bb/Bs Cl or 2 Bb's)
SMITH, Wm Three Duets for Clarinets
SYDEMAN Duo
Perhaps some novelty value. (I know nothing about any of these.)
GORTHEIL Cartoons
GRIEVE Sherlock Holmes Suite
LEWIN Views of the Blues
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Author: larryb
Date: 2005-03-07 01:05
"The Mendelsshon are standard repertoire, and if I remember right need a strong piano player ..."
Well now, are we suggesting that the Mendelssohn concert pieces should be played with two Bb clarinets?
As I recall, these pieces were written for Clarinets in Bb and F (as in basset horn).
If you are hesitant to endorse the Poulenc with two Bbs, then how can you similarly recommend in the Mendelssohns?
Of course, musicians have enjoyed playing the mendelssohns in several combinations: Bb/Bassethorn; Bb/Bb; Bb/bassoon; and Bb/cello.
So, if you want to try the poulence with two Bbs (unless one of you have an A) go ahead and enjoy.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-03-07 01:26
Huge difference Larry, the Poulenc is practical and the Mendelssohn is not. Just like the Mozart Concerto on the G Basset Horn isn't either.......
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