 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: klarinette728
Date: 2005-02-26 16:17
Is there a way to add an Eb / Ab key (like what the Buffet r13 Prestige has) to my regular R13? What are some things that i could add to my clarinet to turn it into a "super clarinet"? Thanks!
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2005-02-26 18:11
As I recall the added key structures on my Full, 3/4ths, 1/2 Boehm cls, a 3rd pivot rod is required with space among the left L F long keys for action, and with finger accessability for all 3. It looks like it would be very difficult [and expensive] to try to have a tech add this key. I like this Ab/Eb the best of the 4 additions and have bought several cls with this on EBAY, sometimes at higher than average prices. Pete F's [and clones] have this and the 7th ring Eb/Bb as standard. IMHO, best to have the maker do it. Luck, Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2005-02-26 22:23
Eb/Ab key CAN be added on. For a price . . . . .
I too like having it there as an option. My current best clarinet doesn't have it, but I can't get rid of it. It sounds too darned good. That'll all change when I have enough to order my set of Rossi's . . . . ![[right]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie8.gif)
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: donald
Date: 2005-02-27 08:45
didn't Yamaha used to have an "add on key" that could be installed aftermarket? i vaguely remember this from the 1980s, and don't know if one could be fitted to a Buffet.
it's by no means difficult for an instrument-maker/craftsman to do this, but time consuming
donald
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2005-02-27 14:01
Interesting, DonALD, perhaps you or someone has an older Yamaha and/or a Buffet catalog, beyond the "flyers" from our discounters, a web site perhaps, that would help inform us. I looked at several of my horns with the Ab/Eb lever, they ALL position the lever BETWEEN the long B/E and F#/C#, and ABOVE the two for accessability, and preferably all three are individually pivoted. I'm more familiar with Leblanc and Selmer, and am quite sure that Leb still makes at least their LL with a variety of the four "Special Mechanism" add-ons, at higher costs of course. My thots would be to sell the present cl and invest in a maker's well-designed-engineered clarinet. Comments? Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: Julie
Date: 2005-02-27 19:12
sorry, but what key are you talking about? low Eb?? I'm very confused! How could that be an Ab too? sorry for my ignorance
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2005-02-27 19:32
Julie - There are 2 ways to describe a key's function, I prefer the low-note/higher note version, and now observe everyone else has used the opposite here, SORRY. This results from the cl's {range-beneficial] overblowing 12ths, not octaves like other woodwinds, so is capable of confusion. We are talking the same thing, Eb/Ab is also OK for me. Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: John Stackpole
Date: 2005-02-27 21:03
I share Julie's confusion:
Is there a side-by-side picture of a "normal" clarinet and one with this additional Eb/Ab key (and hole too, I presume?) somewhere.
A good photo or line drawing will do fine.
(And a pair of Chinese CSOs will do just as well - I just want to see it!)
Thanks
JDS
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2005-02-27 21:17
Attachment: 7.gif (78k)
Picture titled "7" is a picture of a clarinet and it's added Eb/Ab key.
You can look at your own clarinet to see that in that spot, there are normally only FOUR pinky keys (higher register G#, C#, C, and B)
US Army Japan Band
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Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-02-27 23:52
I met a kid with that extra key on his clarinet last year at all state. He seemed to really like it. However, in my exitement at this new finding, I asked my clar. teacher about it, who told me that she knew a number of people who had bought new clarinets with this "extra" key on it, and immediately had it removed, since most clarinets (as far as I know) dont have that key, and dont really need it (except to get rid of Left-Right pinky problems...) and that it usually gets in the way when one is not used to having it there. They claimed that with the key, their pinky would constantly hit it when going for the next one over (I think third line B?) by accident...
It seems like a wonderful extra key to have, but what's clarineting without the crazy alternate fingerings and fun pinky work?
-Lindsie
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Author: John Stackpole
Date: 2005-02-28 01:00
Thanks for the picture - from what I can tell (or guess) then the hole that that key covers or uncovers is off to the right (in the picture) and is near the bell.
But this raises a physics question: when all the holes are covered (in my cl, anyway) I get an E (well, OK, I really get a concert D but lets stick to the written notes) . To get any lower note, like an Eb, I need a longer resonant tube, or pipe.
Where is that extra length coming from? Is the bell just a little bit longer, or is the lower segment of the cl. longer?
I don't see how just adding a key (and hole) to a "standard" cl could make a difference.
Or am I missing something?
JDS
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Author: stagehand
Date: 2005-02-28 01:37
I have two clarinets with the extra Eb/Ab key and I love it. I struggle when playing y clarinets that do not have it. Each of mine has it in a slightly different place, buy it has never got in the way. It connects into the same key as the one on the bottom hand. One of my clarinets that has this key also has the low Eb key (like a bass clarinet has); it also works as an alternant Bb throat tone to help fast passages over the break. It is a lot of fun to have in jazz, but I do not really like it in concert band. To make room for the extra key they had to make the clarinet a little longer which makes it sharp. They also put the top hole on the bottom hand joint in this the connecting cork. This means it has to be lined up correctly or it becomes fuzzy. The other "extra" this particular clarinet has is an extra C#/G# key. It is on the lower hand joint and looks like the alternant B/F# key. I do not really use this one. The few times I did need it, it was great to have.
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Author: donald
Date: 2005-02-28 02:53
the key is opening the hole already operated by the right "pinky" to get the the note Aflat in the lower reg, and Eflat in the upper (NOT the low E flat that would be the lowest note on the instrument).
it is a very useful key every now and again, but most of the time you can get away with only the right hand key. At the Oklahoma Symposium in June i will be playing a piece, for instance, that has one bar that requires this key (without it it's still possible, but very insecure and awkward).
when it is "added on" after market, it is possible to mount this key on the same axel (not sure what they're officially called) as either E/B or F#/C#. This is done rather than to add a new mounting for that key, but it is considered more technically secure (and long lasting) to add a new mounting. That is open to debate (if you only use the key a few times a week, sideplay on the sleeve would take years to develop.... side play on another key sharing an axel would need to be fixed regardless... if you see what i mean).
The yamaha key i remember was from the days BEFORE the INTERNET!!!!!!! so i doubt it's on a website. Anyway, it's not difficult to make an extra key if you know what you're doing and have3 the equiptment, only time consuming and costly.
donald
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Author: Terry Stibal
Date: 2005-02-28 04:38
The "full Boehm" version of the alternate Ab/Eb lever found on the Selmer and LeBlanc horns was far more integrated into the design than have been the Buffets and Yamahas that I have tried with same. On my Selmer horns, the key is located well "out of the way" beyond the normal finger position for the E/B and F#/C# keys. It's a little bit of a reach, but I got used to it quickly and have been happy as hell with the added facility and ease of use.
The Yamaha and Buffet versions seem to be more "hung on" to the standard "Boehm" layout, and it was far more intrusive.
The bass clarinet versions of same are all "out of the way", at least as far as I have been able to tell.
leader of Houston's Sounds Of The South Dance Orchestra
info@sotsdo.com
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-02-28 10:01
Removing it can throw off the balance slightly - unfortnately.
I never use it, and never miss it either.
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Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2005-03-01 00:42
The added 'key' being discussed should be called a 'lever'.
By convention, keys have pads on them. A lever has no pad on it, but is linked with a key in order to operate that key from a remote location.
Eb/Ab, Ab/Eb, G#/D#, D#/G#.... The terminology does not matter. They all define the same key or lever, in such a way as not to confuse with any other key or lever on a typical soprano clarinet.
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Author: John Stackpole
Date: 2005-03-01 20:15
Thanks to those who pointed out (most kindly) that I was indeed "missing something".
What I was also missing was the convention of refering to "Ab/Eb" vs. "Eb/Ab".
The first one: low Ab to 12th higher Eb made sense, (all the same fingers plus register key) but low-to-higher-note "Eb/Ab" got me bolluxed up because that isn't an overblown 12th (besides not being possible on a "normal" clarinet anyway).
Is there a better way of thinking about this?
Or better, don't think, just play and make music?
JDS
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