 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: sfalexi
Date: 2005-02-27 00:55
For orchestra class, we have a piece that is supposed to use an A clarinet. I only have a Bb, so I have to transpose as I go.
So to double check, I have to take whatever key it's in, in lower it by a halfstep (meaning that since it's in the key of G, I have to play as though I'm in the key of F#)? And play every note as though it's a half-step down (meaning if the note is a B, I have to play an A#)?
Just double checking. Man is this semester's piece going to be a challenge. . .
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: clarinetwife
Date: 2005-02-27 01:03
Yup, that's the story. Does your school not have an A that you can use? I always played on a school A in high school and college.
In some keys, including your G, you can use many of the note names on the page by thinking flats and playing the piece in Gb, dealing with accidentals and the odd natural as they come.
Good luck--this particular transposition is quite handy to have among your skills.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: John Stackpole
Date: 2005-02-27 01:05
Here's a set of crib notes......
http://www.grahamnasby.com/misc/clarinet_transpositionguide.shtml
Go get 'em tiger, you'll get an "A" (thats a grade, not a key)
JDS
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: sfalexi
Date: 2005-02-27 01:08
Yeah . . . the orchestra class was just RECENTLY began about four or five years ago and the instructor is going to ask the school to purchase an A clarinet for next year. But this year, it's up to me. Which is tough.
Thanks for the tip about just thinking about the note as a flat. I didn't even think about that. That could probably work out pretty well in this piece.
And thanks for the link JDS.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-02-27 01:08
Transposing is very confusing! I sight-transposed an orchestra concert after two 3-hour rehersals and no time for practice- Sibelius symphony no. 2 (I think), finale; and Shostakovich "festive overture"
the shostakovich was in C (an odd key to be in, in my opinon- for that piece anyway), so I had to read it in B! However, I don't ever remember thinking "this is in the key of B, and I am playing 5 sharps". maybe that's how you're supposed to do it, but I got through the concert FINE, going at quarter = 152 thinking "every note is down a half step". EVERYTHING has a flat next to it, unless it has a sharp- then you read it as a natural. And if it has a flat already, it's a double flat, so you read it a step down.
maybe my approcah is wrong, but it worked for me!
shostakovich in the key of B on Bb clarinet @ 152 = HARD!
-Lindsie
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: clarinetwife
Date: 2005-02-27 01:32
music_is_life wrote:
> shostakovich in the key of B on Bb clarinet @ 152 = HARD!
Festive Overture is one of the more challenging Bb-A transpositions partially because of the tempo, partially because of where some of the intervals fall fingering-wise. My husband had to do that one, though, because I was on the first part and we do have one A clarinet. He usually plays bass cl in our orchestra but pulled out his Bb on this piece for the third part.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-02-27 01:56
Quote:
Festive Overture is one of the more challenging Bb-A transpositions partially because of the tempo, partially because of where some of the intervals fall fingering-wise. some of those crazy fingerings were Cb-Db-Eb-Cb, etc. I think I just developed a REALLY fast right pinky! but that's the thing, not only do you fry your brain thinking (unless you're lucky...for the Shostakovich I had my B scale down REALLY well, and luckily I already knew the piece, so even though it was in a different key, I knew how it sounded...had to retrain my fingers, but really the trouble was the fingers and really fast 16ths with evil Fb and Cbs and other such oddities...) - but you have to put up with bad fingerings sometimes.
john- for a moment I thought that was a Graham Nash link...started to wonder what HE had to do with the clarinet!
I hear C transpostion is also good to know... just a though ![[wink]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/smilie3.gif)
-Lindsie
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: BobD
Date: 2005-02-27 15:12
"with evil Fb " Of course!.....the unevil Enatural
But...back to the opening post. I thought I was beginning to understand transposition but now I'm having a mental block on the "key of F#" thing.
1. The piece was in the key of G, that's one sharp...an F#.....right?
2. You have to transpose each as-written note down a half step....right?
3. To arrive at the key of F# you need 6 sharps....right?
4. ...and they are D#, E#,F#,G#, A# and C#....right?
And although I see the E# in the key signature for the key of F#....there is no E# on the piano keyboard.....it's actually a Fnatural......but it is the key adjacent to the E natural....ergo it's a half step.
5. How do I get my brain to think E#?? instead of Fnatural when I'm playing a half step down??? I must be missing something.........
Bob Draznik
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: 3dogmom
Date: 2005-02-27 15:53
If you have notation software you could put in your part, then with a flick of a switch transpose it to the desired key. You can download NotePad for free, or PrintMusic for less than $100. There was a huge debate about this stuff recently, but you don't need a monster program to do this. I use PrintMusic a lot because I play with a flute choir and get tired of transposing up a whole step.
Sue
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-02-27 18:46
Quote:
But...back to the opening post. I thought I was beginning to understand transposition but now I'm having a mental block on the "key of F#" thing.
1. The piece was in the key of G, that's one sharp...an F#.....right?
2. You have to transpose each as-written note down a half step....right?
3. To arrive at the key of F# you need 6 sharps....right?
4. ...and they are D#, E#,F#,G#, A# and C#....right?
And although I see the E# in the key signature for the key of F#....there is no E# on the piano keyboard.....it's actually a Fnatural......but it is the key adjacent to the E natural....ergo it's a half step.
5. How do I get my brain to think E#?? instead of Fnatural when I'm playing a half step down??? I must be missing something.........
wow! you made that so much more confusing than it has to be! My teacher told me that when transposing from C to B (or, I guess, what is written for C clarinet to Bb clarinet) one should actually change the key signature and read it that way. But I don't know about going from A to Bb....
but I seriously think it is SO much more complicated to read the music in the transposed key of F#, when all you have to do is read it in G, but mentally put a flat in front of everything. And if you learn the piece (recording)beforehand, know your scales, arpeggios, and thirds...and etc., then this shouldn't be a problem. But I think reading it as F# just makes it much more complicated. Maybe your brain can handle it, but mine cant!
Bob:
1. yes
2. yes
3. yes
4. (you really should order it: F#, C#, G#, D#, A#, E#...sorry, theory...) yes, E# is F natural...
5. like I said, I think it's much easier to read it in G with flats next to everything, then you dont have to think about E#...granted, that might mean reading Cb, Fb....sometimes double flats, but hey, no one ever said transposing was gonna be easy!
I'd say that if you don't want to sight transpose (and I stand by doing it by sight, it's a good ability to have)- and you have the equipment and time, transpose it via Sibelius. I'm not sure if Finale does it...I use Sibelius. It's a great program and I believe that you can simply scan the music in and bring everything down a half step (so you'll read it in F#). Or if you dont have a scanner or something, you can sit there and put it all in yourself- tedius, I know TOO well... (Debussy's Afternoon of the Faun for a friend who had no ability to sight transpose...) but, it'll lighten your load a bit.
-Lindsie
Post Edited (2005-02-27 18:46)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: BobD
Date: 2005-02-27 21:48
I don't know anything about music theory that's why I'm having the problem. The best that I can come up with is this: If you don't put a E# in the key signature then you have to "accidentalize" every F that you don't want sharped. I still don't get your flats thing, but as they say "there's more than one way to skin a cat". I'll have to think about it. I do have Smartscore if I want to print out a transposition.....but that's the easy way.
As I said....I must be missing something. Thanks....
Bob Draznik
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: music_is_life
Date: 2005-02-27 23:47
BobD wrote:
> I still
> don't get your flats thing, but as they say "there's more than
> one way to skin a cat".
ok- I'm not really good at explaining these kinds of things, but here it goes:
ok, the piece is in the key of G, which means there is one sharp, which is F#- I'm just going to pretend that this is a measure of 16th notes in the piece, in the key of G- which is how you'd read it if playing an A clarinet...
F#, G, A, G, D, Eb, A#, C
ok... never mind that you probably wouldn't find an Eb in a piece that's in G (or as far as I know...unless it has to do with modulation or something...I guess...) but here's that same line, but read from a Bb clarinet player's view:
F, Gb, Ab, Gb, Db, Ebb, A, Cb
so the flat thing- since everything is lowered a half step- you mentally place flats in front of everything. Of course, you'd never play F#b, you'd just take away the sharp, which "flattens" it, which is what you want to do. Things that already have a flat in front of it gets another one, hence the double flat- which really means read it down a STEP. (so Ab would be read as Abb, or G). I hope that makes a bit of sense, and that I'm explaining it correctly
-Lindsie
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: klarinette728
Date: 2005-02-28 02:55
I tried to do that exact same thing last year in orchestra, but everything i played on my Bb sound wrong :-( My orchestra director finally gave in and found an old Buffet A clarinet, it was in pretty bad shape but it surprisingly played like a dream!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
