 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: MGarrison
Date: 2005-02-05 22:44
Hi
I am seriously considering buying a new clarinet, possibly an R13. I have never owned a "new" instrument, my alto sax, bass clarinet and soprano clarinet were all used at purchase. I have a Noblet 27 which I have enjoyed for the last 3 years or so, but would like to move up as I find it a little stuffy and the altissimo hard to play (above D) which might be me rather than the clarinet although I found my ex-teacher's (I have moved) R13 easier to play than my clarinet and with a better sound.
So what I'd like to know is whether I be better to invest in a new R13 (approx $2650 CDN) or purchase a used one (approx. $1500 CDN)? I know each clarinet is different, but generally, do new R13's play better than older or vice versa?
Which would have the higher risk of cracking? New or old?
Is there any benefit to silver vs. nickel keys other than the plating wearing down over time?
I am also keeping my mind open to other brands/models. I would also like some suggestions as to Leblanc models that I might also try, something that might be easy to get hold of as there are only 2 music stores that carry high-end clarinets in stock.
Should I just try everything I can get my hands on?
Should I use my current mouthpieces (Selmer HS* and B*) to try them out or consider a new mouthpiece?
MGarrison
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Author: Celeborn
Date: 2005-02-06 00:58
Many people consider R13s from the 1950s-'60s to play better than current models, however, there is a "Vintage" model currently in production which is supposed to have some characteristics of older models. If an old one hasn't cracked to date, it probably won't. With a new one, you run that risk as the wood hasn't proven itself yet. The plating on the keys causes a different feel. In general nickel is thought to be softer feeling and silver harder. Most people prefer the look and feel of silver, but don't forget about other options such as gold. If you want to try Leblancs, check out Concerto IIs and Opuses, and maybe the Pete Fountain Big Easy model. Yes, try everything you can get your hands on. Test all the instruments with the same mouthpiece/reed/ligature setup. After you find the hrn you like best with that, you can start to tweak to suit that particular clarinet.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-02-06 01:09
A lot of players like Buffet for the key hole size. That affects the sound of the instrument - each brand has it's own setup. A Selmer won't sound, nor feel like a Buffet due to that among many other things.
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Author: MGarrison
Date: 2005-02-06 01:18
Is the key hole size bigger or smaller than other clarinets?
MGarrison
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-02-06 01:26
Varies among brands but Buffet has a smaller hole opening than selmer usually. Compare them head to head and see. Doesn't mean that it's any better nor worse, just not the same. I'd never say to a player to get a Buffet just to get a Buffet (so they can say they have a buffet) if they already have a very good instrument - but that is the case sometimes for players wanting Buffet.
Example is just yesterday I was at my repair persons home getting some minor work done on an instrument I just got and she was telling me about a wind player who has a good set of Selmers, but wants to get a Buffet because he always "wanted to have a Buffet".
It seemed silly to me, especially when in Philadelphia the Selmer Brand has always been connected to that town (early 1900's Henri Selmer (or his brother??) played in the Phila Orchestra.
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Author: Carol Dutcher
Date: 2005-02-06 02:27
I have a Buffet which I bought in 1970. It has never cracked. It was new at that time. I got one with silver keys so they still appear new and shiny.
But my recommendation to you is to try everything you can, because the way one clarinet feels to one person, is not the way it would feel to you. And you are the one spending the money, and you are the one who will be playing it. I bought the Buffet because it felt much "lighter" to me and my wrists are thin and not very strong. It was easy for me to work with.
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Author: Dano
Date: 2005-02-06 04:45
I think that older clarinets have alot going for them. Ebay has alot of older R-13s that seem to be well preserved. In my opinion, the older the clarinet is, the less chance of it cracking unless it is abused or the environment changes drasticaly because it is considered "broken in". I have a new R-13 Vintage that plays like a dream and if you can fork out about $3000, you will have a clarinet that is (in my opinion) close to perfect. I think that every clarinet is different also. I have played some R-13s that can't play as well as my plastic Bundy. Trying as many clarinets as possible is the best thing. You might find that special one that you would not have even looked at just because it is not a Buffet or a Selmer. I also have a Leblanc Concerto II that was a gift, and I just can't get into it. The ads say that it is great from classical to jazz and that Eddie Daniels uses one and so forth but the sound on mine is very dark and I don't usually play "dark" being a jazz musician. So my suggestion is to try as many as you can and if it is well made and feels and sounds good to you, that is your horn. There is nothing worse than playing on the most popular, best made clarinet that just does not work for you. Don't worry too much about Buffet vs. Selmer or Leblanc. Hope that helps.
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2005-02-06 05:50
Remember this one though. The older the Clarinet - the longer it was played, the more key wear (mechanism) it will have. That can be a real problem down the road.
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Author: BobD
Date: 2005-02-06 14:01
At least check out the LeBlanc Infinite' ....a decent high intermediate horn and some good prices new lately....
Bob Draznik
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Author: john gibson
Date: 2005-02-06 16:54
M....
I have both an R13 and a Leblanc LL....as well as a SILVER KING......all are exceptional clarinets. I find they all play very well depending on ME. Somedays the R13 is the best....others its the LL....then agan somedays I feel I play better with the SILVER KING....
I also have a Boosey Hawkes 2-20 that plays well on occassion. I guess it depends on your reed and embouchure that day.
TRY them all however....and choose the one that you feel meets your needs. Good luck....
JG....the clarinator
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Author: jArius
Date: 2005-02-06 22:28
Just keep in mind that even a selection of supposedly identical R-13's may all play differently depending on YOU and you alone, even though they're supposed to be the same instrument. And as was mentioned, don't focus on the R-13 to the exclusion of all else. Try out everything that you can get your hands on, and you might even find something you like better than the R-13. Since it's different for everyone, you never know until you try. The important thing is to find something that you enjoy and feel comfortable with, something that feels like an extension of you, and not the brand name.
(P.S. Sorry about getting corny )
Jeremy Bruins
Proud member of the too-much-time-on-my-hands club.
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Author: Arnoldstang
Date: 2005-02-06 23:16
I vote used R13. Try some new barrels on it. Moennig, Chadash, etc. with a good mouthpiece. ....I recommend Fobes ..Zinner CF++ Ligature.... Spriggs floating rail Reeds.....Vandoren Blue box...3...3 1/2
Freelance woodwind performer
Post Edited (2005-02-06 23:21)
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Author: DougR
Date: 2005-02-07 14:08
Just to echo jArius' post above, I bought a brand-new R-13, had 3 identical brand-new horns to choose from, and found as much variation among the three as you'd find from brand to brand. They came from WWBW, and didn't seem to have been checked since having been shipped from the factory (as far as I could TELL), so maybe it'd be good to find out whether or to what extent the stores you shop at do any pre-sale checking over and/or adjustment, or if they just unpack the factory crates & put the horns right on sale.
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Author: Arnoldstang
Date: 2005-02-07 14:38
I visited WW and BW...They have a good repair department. They made a point of saying all their new instruments are gone over before being sent out. On the other hand I haven't purchased a new instrument from them so I really don't know about their quality control.
Freelance woodwind performer
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Author: D Dow
Date: 2005-02-07 18:40
I have very little good to say about the R13 as a clarinet...currently they tend to crack, quality control is low and on top of this they are very inconsistent. I don't care what anyone says but right now I tend to prefer the Vintage series and find they play better overall..
Personally I play Selmer but own a set of R13 clarinets which I feel are good for certain situations. As to personal preferences everyone will have one...
As to current quality at Buffet with the way the company is being bandied about from buyer to buyer there is no doubt there is some trouble brewing and it has affected the product.
David Dow
Post Edited (2005-02-07 18:41)
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