 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 1999-02-23 01:16
Reed makers seem to advertise their reeds are german cut.
My understanding is that this comes from MORRE reeds developped by Marcellus.They are characterized by narrow width and thick heel(at least 2.8-3 mm),which are typically viewed in Vandoren WhiteMaster(but they are too short to match French mouthpiece).I found following manufacturers:
1)Vandroren V12
2)Rico Grand Concert-Thick Blank
3)Zonda
4)Reeds Australia
5)GS reed(Sabine Myer's favorites-but I don't like her lookes and tones.They are stone-finished and 1,2,3 times finish GSs are differently priced.What is stone finish?)
Does anyone know other "german cut" reeds? (They are now not german but American! He-he-he).
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Author: Daniel
Date: 1999-02-23 03:35
Again. The Morré reeds were not developed by Marcellus. He used them, and had his students play them on Kaspar mouthpieces. But he did not design them. The Vandoren V-12 line looks and feels nothing like Morré reeds.
"German cut" refers to reeds that are narrower and with a shorter vamp and thicker butt. Not simply to reeds that try to copy the Morré style. I don't know a single commercial reed that comes anywhere close how the Morrés played or were cut.
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Author: Daniel
Date: 1999-02-23 04:30
Personally, i wish Morrés weren't so expensive. And I with they were more consistent and reliable for the price that they are. But for $30 a box, and the amount of time it takes tork for the reeds that are too hard and throw out the ones that are too soft, it's just not worth it.
So i go with traditional Vandorens even though they don't have enough wood in the butt of the reed. The V-12's have no heart and the tip is like tissue paper even though the butt is a nice thickness. The problem with commercial reeds is that they go for quantity, not quality. Even the traditional cut Vandorens aren't all that great. Especially since they changed from a three cut to two cut production method. So even the traditional cut Vans aren't quite hearty enough.
Zonda's are too stuffy and muffled for my taste. Grand Concert's are too dry and brittle sounding. Glotin's are too short and has the same problem as Vandoren with paper thin tips and no heart.
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 1999-02-23 05:26
Daniel:
Thank you for stating your own preferences on reeds.
I tried Vandoren traditonals(at first 2-1/2) and hand select (same) 10 years ago to match 2RV of Vandoren.After aquiring GREG-SMITH 1(very long faced MP) I started to experiment reeds.Your observation about V12(too vacant heart) and Zonda(too densed heart) are just what I feel about these manufactureres.Now I would like to try Reeds Australia and B..which are used by Sabine Myer.
As I understood the reed lives solely depend on microorganism entererd in pores,I started to keep my reeds in Japanese tea cylindrical container made of cherry skins that avoids microorganism enter the pore.
Just FYI.Thank you for your professinal advice.
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Author: Arnold the basset hornist
Date: 1999-02-23 06:52
I remember the following "german" area reed manufacturers:
1. "Gebhard Steuer" (GS), now owned by Hans Gillhaus, Lindau/Bodensee, Germany - their frech Bb clarinet reeds are sometimes described as german Bb clarinet reeds resized to the french sizes (keeping it's german cut)
2. BK
3. Pflaumer
4. foglietta (Marianne Rieckhoff, Switzerland)
At least some of them are so small, you cannot call them 'companies' (I think Mr. Pflaumer doesn't have any employees)
Tell me, if you need some addresses, I'll have to look them up.
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Author: Greg
Date: 1999-02-24 03:13
You are only partially right Daniel and Hiroshi. Robert Marcellus WAS responsible for the development of the Morre reed if only in a SLIGHTLY roundabout way. For many years, Karl Marks Sr. was Marcellus' friend, a former student and as Marcellus told me "his ears" from the audience in Severance Hall, Cleveland (approx.1959-1970). Marks Sr.(of Marks Music fame) was also the sole distributor of Morre reeds after Marcellus encouraged him to establish that sole distributorship when 2nd clarinetist Jim Rettew had a student show the reeds to Marcellus for the first time in 1960 or so. Marcellus thought so much of their potential at that time that in succeeding years he literally gave instructions to the maker in Vienna (Karl Firstl) via his friend and U.S. distributor Karl Marks of Pennsylvania on how to improve them and what resultant changes worked or didn't work. This included any number of things concerning cane quality, length of cut, width of cut, etc. They were not scientificly calculated recommendations but they were general, alterations that Marcellus believed would help the reed and it's basic playing characteristics. And with a few simple rules of carpentry, they could be worked down with rush or preferably sandpaper to produce the most magnificent sound on a Kaspar (Cicero, Chicago and even Ann Arbor) of any reed at that time, or any time.
The V12 style would never have been developed if it were not for it's predecessor, the Morre. The difference being -amongst other things - that it seems Vandoren wanted the V12 to play right out of the box for mass marketing purposes...hence the comparative flimsy quality of the V12's
in relation to the Morres of the 1960's and early 70's.
The Morre (German Cut 12.5 tip width) that Marcellus used was in it's heyday from around 1962-1973 as he told me (and as I've experienced!!). There were shipments that were dogs every once in awhile even back then but most of the reeds were what he refered to as "lolipops" out of the box, needing very little if no work. If you knew how to work them down as he showed you, they were incredible. The Morres left over today don't even come close to resembling what they were before 1973 or so. The maker went defunct about 10-12 years ago and destroyed his machines and has never revealed the source of his unique cane.
I hope that I have been able to shed a little useful information to this bulletin board and to Daniel and Hiroshi.
Gregory Smith
Clarinetist
Chicago Symphony Orchestra
Mouthpiece Craftsman
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Author: Hiroshi
Date: 1999-02-24 13:30
Thanks Greg.By the way your mouthpiece does work great with the Cadash A barrel.I experimented V12 3.5,Zonda 3&3.5,and RICO grand Concert-thick blank 3&3.5, and now try GS reeds and Reeds Australlia,which seem all German or Vienna cutted.
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Author: Daniel
Date: 1999-02-25 00:37
Thanx Greg,
I was not aware that Marcellus had given recommendations to the Morré reed maker. All i had known was that they were around before Marcellus started playing them.
To Mark: you should post this in the equipment section. :-)
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