 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: mattahair
Date: 2005-01-15 02:52
Alright, need some help guys and gals: I have a college audition in a month and I'm working on the Mozart for my two pieces, excerpts from the first and second movements. In the first, starting around meas. 62, there is an eighth-note B to A# phrase that I am having troubles with. The easiest way I can think of to play this is by what my middle school teacher called "blipping", going from middle-finger B to first-finger A#, making it as smooth as possible. Using the banana key is also an option, but I think it would be more difficult to smoothly maneuver.
Does anyone out there have any suggestions on how to handle this passage??? Maybe there's an alternate fingering that I don't know about!
Thanks,
Matt
Post Edited (2005-01-15 02:53)
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Author: FoxeyJ
Date: 2005-01-15 03:12
I would suggest using the L.H. fork key, but practice it VERY slowly and make sure it's even before speeding it up. Your fingers will get used to it even though it can be awkward at first. Good luck on your auditons!
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Author: mattahair
Date: 2005-01-15 03:17
Thanks for the post FoxeyJ, but I think some clarification is in order: the passage I am referring to is in the lower register of the horn. The B to A# is in the right hand. When I previously stated "around meas. 62", I should have added that that was the 62nd measure of the actual solo, not including the orchestral intro. Do you have any ideas on this section?
Post Edited (2005-01-15 03:17)
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2005-01-15 03:25
For that passage, since the E doesn't slur into it I'd use the fork key. If you absolutely can't manage it fast enough, I'd use the middle finger B for the first one, and the fork for the rest.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: GBK
Date: 2005-01-15 03:57
EEBaum wrote:
> For that passage, since the E doesn't slur into it
Some editions have a slur connecting the E3 to the B3, others don't...GBK
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Author: RAMman
Date: 2005-01-15 11:14
Personally, I find swapping fingers for the first one...and the using the fork for rest of them.
So...
E G E B (middle finger, RH) A sharp (first finger, RH) B (fork) etc.
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Author: David Peacham
Date: 2005-01-15 11:46
I slur the whole phrase, and I agree with RAMman: middle finger for the first B, banana key for the other three B's. Care is needed to move cleanly between the first B and first A#, when you are flipping between your second and first fingers. Also between the last B and the Anatural, when you are flipping between your third and second fingers. But I don't find it a problem - there are plenty of bars in that piece that give me far more trouble!
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If there are so many people on this board unwilling or unable to have a civil and balanced discussion about important issues, then I shan't bother to post here any more.
To the great relief of many of you, no doubt.
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Author: Alphie
Date: 2005-01-15 12:08
I think it's important to keep in mind for the ones who prefer to slur the whole passage that there is absolutely no way to make a clean slur from E3 to B3, or to slur between B3 and A#3 on the instrument that Mozart knew. This is itself a proof that Mozart wanted it articulated.
Alphie
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Author: Clarinetlover18
Date: 2005-01-15 14:33
I personally like the fork fingering, but practice it VERY SLOW, then work your way up to speed!
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Author: mattahair
Date: 2005-01-16 01:09
Thanks a bunch for all the great posts! I am going to go with the combo method, starting with the flip and going to the fork in the middle of the phrase. Happy playing!
Matt
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Author: Ken Shaw ★2017
Date: 2005-01-18 14:16
Alphie -
I think it's reasonably clear that the original, written for the basset clarinet, didn't have this sequence of notes. Instead, the preceding two bars were played an octave lower.
Also, even with the notes as written, Stadler's clarinet used the German fingering, where the B is played with the index finger and the A# is played with the index and ring fingers, or, on later instruments, with the index and middle fingers plus the right hand sliver key.
I'm of two minds on which fingering to use on the standard Boehm clarinet.
Playing the first B with the middle finger and switching to the index finger for the A# is perfectly possible. Bassoonists and recorder players switch fingers all the time, as did eminent oboists (e.g., Tabuteau) whose instruments did not have a left-hand F key.
It's also possible to slide the right ring finger up onto the sliver key when going between the preceding low E and the B, particularly since almost all editions have the B tongued.
This change is also useful when going from altissimo Db to Eb, since the middle finger Eb is dreadfully out of tune. Many years ago, I worked on it until I could do it reliably. The method for working it out is the one invented by Fernand Gillet. See http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/read.html?f=1&i=158256&t=158204.
Ken Sahw
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Author: Alphie
Date: 2005-01-18 19:05
Sorry, the attachment didn't work
Post Edited (2005-01-18 19:22)
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Author: Alphie
Date: 2005-01-18 19:07
Dear Ken! This sequence exists indeed in the original manuscript from Mozart’s hand in the Winterthur manuscript, the only document we have of the concerto. Try this link: http://www.woodwind.org/clarinet/Music/Manuscripts/Winterthur/
Clic: winter7 Scroll down, it’s all there note by note, without a slur.
As for Stadler’s instrument, or for any clarinet of the time for that matter, the “German” fingering with the first index finger is at least a quarter tone flat. You have to play the b natural by half shadowing the hole with the finger. The key for rasing the B natural is a much later invention and existed hardly before Mueller came out with the “clarinet omnitonique” (even Spohr writes for the players who don’t have this key when performing his concertos, that they can drill a hole for the right hand thumb). The Bb you can sometimes play by only using the German RH 1,3 but very often RH 1,3,4. The effect slurring this passage would sound like a glissando between B and Bb and I don’t think that would be preferable.
Alphie
Post Edited (2005-01-18 19:17)
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Author: Alphie
Date: 2005-01-22 00:13
What I wanted to say with this last post was that you should be very critical about the editions you play from. There are far too many editors who just love to put "graffiti" between the notes. If it pleases you, try to do some research yourselves or play from editions marked “Urtext”. They are usually more reliable and they mostly put the graffiti between “( )”.
Alphie
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