 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: Mark Charette
Date: 2003-11-25 02:25
clarinetstudent wrote:
> Do you think clarinets should be allowed in a highschool jazz
> band?
Sure - if the HS has music that calls for a clarinet.
Most of the time the band is just learning jazz, and overpowers any clarinet that might be playing.
So generally, IMO, the clarinet is too "delicate" of an instrument at the HS level.
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Author: clarinetstudent
Date: 2003-11-25 02:28
I see.....at my highschool clarinets aren't even in jazz band, and I found that odd since it was one of the first jazz instruments.
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Author: msroboto
Date: 2003-11-25 03:07
They weren't in my HS jazz band either. I usually find that the clarinetist plays Tenor Sax. I'm not sure if it's because the Tenor is a Bb instrument too or what.
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Author: sfalexi
Date: 2003-11-25 03:21
hehehe. I was that clarinetist playing tenor sax in jazz band. My instructor did ask me if I wanted to play clarinet on one or two pieces (Sing Sing Sing and one other), but I respectfully declined. I wouldn't have done the music justice.
In my opinion, join the band as a sax player. It's good practice, and then if you want you can request clarinet on one or two charts if you want. The instructor should be ok with that.
Alexi
US Army Japan Band
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Author: clarinetmajr
Date: 2003-11-25 03:27
I doubled the trumpet part on clarinet, which couldn't be heard but then again I got to transpose the flute solos and play them too. My director had me do it for the experience so when I teach I will know what it was like to be in a jazz ensemble. It was fun and I learned a lot!
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2003-11-25 13:59
In most of the (many) jazz bands I've played in, clarinet is a doubling instrument for the four or five sax players, and is played maybe 10-25% of the time (compared to the primary saxophone). So my advice would be: join the jazz band as a sax player, double on clarinet, and at some point it wouldn't hurt to double on flute also.
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Author: William Hughes ★2017
Date: 2003-11-25 14:33
Most of the commercially available jazz band charts do not have clarinet parts, hence, high school jazz bands do not include clarinets.
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Author: Mel
Date: 2003-11-25 14:43
When I played jazz in high school, we played the trumpet parts up an octave. In college I played tenor sax and clarinet when there was a part for it.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2003-11-25 14:52
Dave , as usual, says it well. We have been "down this road" before. If the charts are [or based on], Miller, Goodman, Shaw, Herman, J Dorsey 's etc of my big jazz band era, if the saxes/brass/ rhythm can't be "hushed-up" to a cl- hearable level, try to find suitable amplification, or just give up and everybody "blow their brains out". We used to want 5 minutes of quiet on our juke boxes. Too critical?? Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: sinkdraiN
Date: 2003-11-25 16:32
In the "real" world you would play in a big band as a sax player who doubles on clarinet. I think its important for a clarinet player in high school to learn saxophone if he or she is interested in jazz. Of course their are lab bands that use all sorts of interesting instrumentation like bassoons and french horns. However, I believe that a clarinet player will be offered a lot more musically if a director pushes them to pick up a sax double. It will offer the student the ability to play both pits and swing bands outside of the school.
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Author: Pam H.
Date: 2003-11-26 12:35
I second Dave S. recommendation. Sax is really easy to get started on if you have clarinet already and flute is not hard to learn either. Many of the fingerings are similar. The flute embouchure makes me work a little. That's my experience though - maybe others find it easier.
You'll probably get more opportunities to play if you add those two.
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Author: fred-jazz
Date: 2003-11-26 13:53
Good comments, I also played clarinet in High School and was forced to play sax in jazz band. That was fine for me, I could play sax, but the bottom line for me is you can play jazz on any instrument and the school should support it if reasonably possible. The jazz band is usually not scored for it, but dixieland bands always are, so I formed a dixie band in high school. We went on to win the talent show at the state fair and I have been playing jazz on the clarinet professionally for the last 22 years, even got called to work out of New Orleans on the Delta Queen Steamboat which I did for about a year. If you want to play clarinet jazz, do it and make it happen. No one told Benny Goodman or Artie Shaw to switch to sax, and they played in small jazz combos before the great big band era.
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Author: clarinetstudent
Date: 2003-11-30 01:19
Thanks for the advice. I believe jazz can be played on any instrument too, and maybe my band director will allow us to form a dixie band- what instruments are included in that?
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Author: john gibson
Date: 2003-11-30 15:08
I used to just "jump" on stage with my clarinet....and start playing....until the band director got mad.....then I'd throw him off.....and kick the drummer out of the way......and started playing the part of "Gene Krupa"....THAT'S how I got started in Rock and Roll in the SF Bay area.....now that I've "mellowed"....I'm back to clarinet.....and looking for a band director to throw off the stage so I can play.....clarinet or drums.....just as long as I can play.......
Dear Clarinet student,
Yes. Clarinets should be allowed. They are an essential part of ANY musical experience. Listen closely to radio/TV commericals......and you'll hear clarinet as the predominant instrument most of the time.....Unless it's a Cadillac spot and LedZepplin is "rockin'"....Ooh Yeah...Ooh Yeah......
I still remember Artie Shaw telling Benny Goodman....."....you're into clarinet...I'm into music..."(paraphrase)....BUT to the point.
PLAY MUSIC FIRST. If you're a musician.....your instrument of choice is secondary. Get to the people. Make them "understand" what you are trying to "get across" and they won't care what you're playing...trumpet...
drums....clarinet....or.....one of those weird things you shake that have beans/seeds inside......DO IT WELL.....and you'll get applause.....
Really......
John Gibson
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Author: paulwl
Date: 2003-11-30 18:00
Clarinetstudent:
Dixieland bands typically have one trumpet, one trombone, one clarinet, sometimes a tenor sax (these instruments make up the "frontline"), a piano, banjo if available, a bass (or tuba if banjo is used), and drumset.
There are some arranged dixie books for school jazz bands, but outside of school you typically take a tune, learn a routine by heart, and jam on it according to your roles in the frontline. The clarinet's role is fun because you get to weave and embellish – basically just stay out of the way of the trumpet. Its role is to put out the melodic lead and then improvise on it. The trombone provides the foundation – longer notes, root tones and such.
Fredjazz:
Goodman and Shaw both played good lead alto sax as young pros. Most of their work was in the slightly smaller, pre-big-band-era "dance orchestras" (10-13 pieces). Matter of fact, Shaw began on sax as a kid, and only then added clarinet!
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Author: Mark Pinner
Date: 2003-11-30 21:45
It sounds like you are using the phrase 'jazz band' to describe a stage band or big band or the like. Clarinet is only occassionally called for and doubling any oter part is probably wasting time. It is debatable for the most part whether these bands play jazz as such or in a jazz style. More often than not it is a mixture of swing, funk, latin and rock. It should be remembered that the swing musicians of the 30's, 40's and 50's were playing popular music for the most part. Any jazz input, or improvisation, was a small part of the whole. This music was carefully orchestrated, with the exception of the Basie style although his routines were pretty well worked out. Did the swing musicians of this era refer to themselves as jazz musicians? Evidently not. From my research it seems that these musicians were playing popular dance music. Many bands during this era would have a smaller group within the big band that would play a 'jazz set' or some 'hot jazz' as a feature, not for the whole night. Jazz itself during this era was fairly well divided into 3 camps. Traditional, the most recognisable jazz form to the public, Be-bop, the underground and cool, the commercially palatable crossover. Jazz is ALL about improvisation, not improvisation as a small segment of the whole, as with big band swing, latin etc.. Traditional jazz, and to a smaller extent cool jazz, uses collective improvisation whereas Be-bop and most cool jazz uses extended individual improvisation. If you desire to learn how to play jazz then improvisation is where you should be heading.
The clarinet is a more than capable jazz instrument but requires the right setting. The traditional jazz frontline is a good starting point as is small group swing. The most important facet is getting some interplay between the front line instruments. By this I mean keeping out of each others way and giving each other a chance. One of the worst practices when learning, or getting involved in, jazz is overblowing. Another bad practice is overplaying. Overblowing, simply, refers to playing too loud, it is generally used to cover up deficiencies in technique and ideas. Overplaying is not shutting up and letting anybody else have a go, generally exhibited by players whose ideas are not coherent or those who feel guilty because they are doing nothing, a perversion of a work ethic. Another good practice is to be careful rhythmically, never rush, jazz, rhythmically is like a rubber band. When you really start to play jazz each single beat is far longer than you first thought. (esoterics 101) Think 'back of the bus'.
With collective improvisation interplay is essential and is where the clarinet shines. Bouncing around in between the melodic phrases played by the cornet/trumpet but notgetting in the way of the trombone and or tenor is an art form. Extended impro is another art form. IMO the best way to learn how to function in a jazz group is to start small not big. There are too many egos to placate in a stage band setting and too much volume to contend with. You can learn more about interplay by playing the right kind of duets with the right teacher, who hopefully can both play a single line horn of some kind and at least comp on piano or guitar. Extended impro is best learned along 2 paths. Firstly melodic embellishment, in other words 'jazzing up' the melody. This will take you to other directions that the melody may have gone if the composer had written it differently and start to give you some idea of impro over a frame work. It is a good idea to use some basic piano or guitar accompaniment for this. The second path is to explore the blues, both rhythmically and tonally (note: not harmonically as the essential blues harmony is rather simple, its tonality, however allows you to exploit some harmonic ambiguity). This will also help with interplay if done the right way.
I think Jimmy Giuffre summed up interplay when he said that there is no use yelling at a guy if he is talking to you. (paraphrased)
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Author: WinJ
Date: 2003-12-01 00:35
I am one clarinet out of two in my high school jazz band. I think a clarinet is a good idea, not only for the experience but as part of the instrumentation as well. First of all, it's not like it doesn't fit in. I myself bought a jazz mouthpiece rather than use my concert mouthpiece, and it fits in with the ensemble really well. Second of all, if the band is any good, you should be able to hear all instruments. My high school's jazz band is of about 20 people, and you can hear the clarinets most of the time, but especially when either of us are soloing.
B (the other clarinet) and I sometimes double on trumpet or second tenor sax part. Now...if your school ever plays Ellington...a unique aspect of his music is that he writes in clarinet-time to shine!
I'm all for clarinets in the jazz band. (I certainly didn't want to switch to sax :-P)
-Winnie^_^
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Author: Roger Aldridge
Date: 2003-12-01 16:12
Clarinetstudent,
Just to add my 2 cents.....
There are a number of variables involved with using clarinet in a high school jazz band. The biggest factors, I think, are the creative vision & experience of the Band Director and the musical level of the band.
Some high school jazz bands are at a pretty advanced level. There are several schools in my area that have very strong jazz bands. Such a band is able to play arrangements by some of the best contemporary arrangers. Many of today's big bands use a considerable amount of doubling. Take, for example, the Maria Schneider Jazz Orchestra. Her sax section goes from soprano to bass and the guys double on various members of the clarinet & flute families as well as double reeds such as oboe and english horn. Thus, if one is in a high school that has a jazz band and Band Director at this high of a level it's likely that a clarinet player showing a strong desire to be in the jazz program should be able to fit in.
Of course, this is not the case in all high schools. If one is in a school where there isn't much of a jazz band or where the Band Director has limited jazz experience it will a problem to just play clarinet without doubling on saxophone. In those situations the jazz band typically plays arrangements in which the sax section plays only saxes.
If your school is in the latter category you may have to explore some creative options on your own. One option is to attend a summer jazz camp. That would be a great experience. Another may be finding a group in your area that you could play with. There may be a community big band that plays swing arrangements calling for clarinet doubles.
The clarinet is a GREAT jazz instrument!!! Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. Just point to Duke Ellington and the ways he used clarinets in his band. That should say enough!
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Author: allencole
Date: 2003-12-01 17:12
A couple of ideas.
In a lot of ways, it would be nice for school jazz bands to reach out to clarinetists. A lot of clarinet students are highly frustrated at the apparent lack of opportunity there. However, the real world does not make this accommodation and by delaying the learning of saxophone, we might simply ensure that clarinet players never get the chance that should be so easily within their grasp.
Clarinetstudent, listen carefully to those who tell you to go on and learn saxophone. They are the voice of reality. Even if your high school jazz band takes you as a clarinetist, a rehearsal or professional group is unlikely to.
We once had a big band in Richmond called the "Saxtette." In addition to the normal five saxes, there were three clarinets replacing the trumpets, and two tenors and a bari replacing the trombones. It was formed by a former Miller reedman, and contained some of his private students.
But back to reality. Prior to having their own bands, Benny Goodman and Artie Shaw actually played together for a while in a studio band--both on tenor sax.
High school jazz bands can go VERY inclusive--we have one in Richmond that includes every imaginable instrument--but this seems to me more likely to lead students AWAY from a real future than towards one.
Allen Cole
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Author: Celeborn
Date: 2004-12-22 23:07
Clarinets should be miked and amplified for jazz. Every other aspect of recorded jazz is handled electronically. So let's join the party! Scadeeten daten, Yeah!
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Author: john gibson
Date: 2004-12-22 23:47
Uhhh
Just wondering as I looked at this posting.....and was going to respond.....
I already HAD......A YEAR AGO! How come the old postings?
ANYWAY......DAMN RIGHT CLARINETS SHOULD BE IN JAZZ BAND!!!!!!!
AND IF YOU WANT TO BE HEARD........USE A POMARICO CRYSTAL MOUTHPIECE...........THE NEW JAZZ MODELS ......
BLAST..................................
JG
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Author: Topher
Date: 2004-12-23 00:26
What is beyond me is why so many people want to play clarinet in a jazz band. The clarinet does not fit at all in a big band. JUST LEARN THE SAX! Clarinets have to be highly miked, and they just don't sound right. Along with lack of volume, the clarinet lacks the timbre to play big band jazz. It is too "clean;" it lacks that raw, powerful sound the saxes and brass have. There are places where that is appropriate, but 99% of the time, high school big bands are not those places. As for people saying they don't want to learn sax, it is usually for one of three reasons; the think it is hard, they think it will make them as stupid as the primarily saxophone players, and they think it is beneath them. My saxophone teacher at a local summer jazz camp, who has a doctorate in saxophone performance, tells his students that a monkey could learn to play the saxophone, and I agree with him. Embochure, fingering, all easier. The stupidity of the run-of-the-mill saxophone player is due to the simplicity of their instrument. As long as you don't drop the clarinet completely, you should be fine. As for thinking that the sax is beneath you, PLEASE. That is pretty lame. People like that are snobbish, narrow-minded jerks who are incapable of realizing that classical music is not the end of good music, and that there is no one "better" instrument than another. The saxophone is another instrument with a great variety of uses and traits. Everyone should at least be exposed to the sax for the edutainment value.
topher
PS I do play baritone sax in my schools top jazz band, and, having played clarinet in it before, I know from personal experience that the sax is more fun. By the way, the comments about dumb saxophonists is entirely a joke. My girlfriend and my two best friends are sax players, and I torture them constantly about it only because I play bass clarinet, which has an even worse reputation for dumb players.
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Author: Aussiegirl
Date: 2004-12-23 01:48
Our school had a latin jazz band, which had even less of a position for a clarinet player, so i ended up on bari sax. Its fun. it has a spit valve, and you can blast out all the bass parts with the trombones!
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Author: allencole
Date: 2004-12-23 04:59
Why not take oboes, french horns, and bagpipes? Western groups including those of Bob Wills and Spade Cooley included the normal big band instruments plus violins, steel guitars, and even a harp!
Our greatest advantage as clarinetists is that we tend to be pretty adept at saxophone if we properly practice and respect it. Jazz band provides us a dose of reality, and a chance to practice taking the bull by the horns later in life.
We should learn to adapt our situation--not bang our heads against the wall trying to adapt the situation to ourselves.
Allen Cole
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Author: conrad
Date: 2004-12-23 12:13
This is a very intersting thread. As a new (but mature) musician I play 3rd clarinet in local windband. I originally wanted to play clarinet because of my interest in (listening to) jazz. There is a wide range of instruments in the band.
I recently joined a "play jazz" group supported by the local education authority. I thought it might help me improvise but it is a "big band" type of jazz, ie all sight-reading and playing our parts. There are limited opportunities to improvise but only the established, good ones really get a chance.
The band is dominated by trumpets and sax players and with me joining I have doubled the number of clarinettists. There is no clarinet parts and we play 3rd trumpet or flugelhorn parts. We can't hear ourselves above the others and feel we may not be adding anything to the ensemble
I recently tried out the tenor sax of a windband clarinet colleague whilst visiting his home. I found it easy to blow but, not being totally familiar with the fingering, I couldn't play from memory any of the tunes I can on the cl.
Now I have a dilemma. My ambition is to play clarinet in a small jazz group. I enjoy the windband and it stretches me to read and play better, but do I invest in a sax for the jazz group and abandon my current clarinet partner?
How long before I could play as competently as I play clarinet?
Would I be better to becoming a reedman with the ability to play both in the group of my dreams?
Conrad
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Author: johnsonfromwisconsin
Date: 2004-12-23 14:17
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The stupidity of the run-of-the-mill saxophone player is due to the simplicity of their instrument.
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I dissagree completely. It's due to lack of practice, good instruction, or commitment. Same with mediocre clarinet players.
Personally, I disagree with arbitrary substitutions just to please the desire of the player. If it weren't for the issue of a clarinet being drowned out in a jazz or swing band, there would be little difference between letting them play along with the Tenor Sax or trumpets and with allowing a child who's ignorant parents bought him/her a soprano saxophone (likely a piece of junk) read along with the Clarinets in Concert band.
-JfW
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Author: allencole
Date: 2004-12-23 15:00
AMEN on the soprano sax thing. A very good analogy. Just 4 or 5 years ago, it was such a craze that this very scenario was threatened.
Personally, I don't know what the objection is to taking up sax. It's treated me great, and many of the best jobs that I've had playing sax have been won via strong clarinet chops.
Allen Cole
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Author: Topher
Date: 2004-12-23 16:09
johnsonfromwisconsin, please read ALL of my thread before attacking it. I said that jokingly, as stated in the PS, because I have actually met clarinet players who believe that playing saxophone makes you stupid. It is simple truth that a jazz saxophone embochure is easier to maintain than a clarinet one, and that the sax fingering system is much simpler than a boehm clarinet system. However, becoming a competent saxophone player requires just as much work, intelligence, and determination (maybe more) as becoming a competent clarinet player. Saxophones just have a few more jokes written about them, so I will occasionally poke fun at them. It is all good natured, I assure you.
topher
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Author: Terry Stibal
Date: 2004-12-23 16:41
Nothing wrong with clarinet playing in high school jazz organization, although the director has to take this into account when getting the charts. When you're not playing clarinet, you can always (and should, even if you don't want to) double a sax part. It's an opportunity to learn something that you'll need to pick up sooner or later if you continue playing past your schooling.
High school groups are a bit different than a traditional "big band" or even one of the "modern ones" like Kenton and his ilk. Much of the music that they use is in the form of those horrible "student" arrangements, which ofttimes are designed to satisfy some arbitrary "contest grading" requirements. When that happens, the clarinet (and bass clarinet, and flute) parts get left by the wayside quite quickly.
One of the hardest battles that I have ever fought was over substituting the "real" arrangement of American Patrol (transcribed by Ernie Houghten, aka "Mr. Arranger Who Writes The Notes Backwards") for a Belwin one that was a real gagger. The school's version had the lead line written in unison for the most part, and it was swapped around, with a musical result that was about as shopworn. Once the director could be convinced of the error of his ways and we tried the "real" version, the groups sound improved arithmetically if not geometrically. (And, their clarinet doubling lead alto got to show off his skills in the bargain.)
I have always taught my baritone players that I "mentor" in a local district's program to play bass clarinet as well, and to use it where the original music called for bass or where it "sounds better" than a baritone trying to play piano.
In my musical group, we have perhaps 35% of the charts that call for at least one clarinet, and perhaps half of those that call for a number of clarinets (including bass) and flute. A lot are the Shaw and Miller and Goodman classics, but there are many others that are "modern" (i.e., just had them arranged in the last three years or so).
Clarinet blends well with the female voice (as does the bass), and a lot of the more "sentimental" tunes (i.e., slow tempo, sweet sounding music) gain a lot from them.
I get a lot of folks who play saxophone sending me emails hoping that I'm looking for a sax player. (Almost all of these are alto players, by the way.) When I write them back asking what they double, virtually all never reply. All the better, less for me to worry about.
(If some find this harsh, you should see the ratio between vocalists interested versus vocalists who aren't in the alto range. A good soprano voice is a marvelous thing to hear, but unfortunately the day of soprano leads died out around 1930 or so. It pains to say no to a gal who looks good and sings great, but 99% of vocals since the 1920's are pitched in the alto (and often contra-alto) range
Sax players who play sax only don't even get through the doors at Sounds Of The South. When we try someone new out, I always hit them with some moderate clarinet stuff in the first thirty minutes; it tends to sort the wheat from the chaff (or the spelter from the dross, if you prefer) pretty quickly.
Of my regular five sax positions, Alto I doubles clarinet, flute, soprano sax, Alto II doubles clarinet, flute and piccolo, Tenor I doubles clarinet and bass clarinet, Tenor II doubles clarinet, alto and (poorly) baritone, and Baritone (moi) doubles clarinet, bass clarinet, alto and flute. All of my subs at least double clarinet, several double flute as well.
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Author: johnsonfromwisconsin
Date: 2004-12-23 20:30
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johnsonfromwisconsin, please read ALL of my thread before attacking it.
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Oops, sorry!
-JfW
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Author: Camanda
Date: 2004-12-23 20:55
My band director does not allow clarinets. If we want to play, we must learn saxophone. I did; I play tenor saxophone. However, he has a flute player who plays transposed second tenor sax parts. WHAT? Why not piano or something? Sheesh, it drives me batty, plus her vibrato is absolutely grating (she gets mad at my section because we play straight), the timbre doesn't jive, and she plays the parts so they'll sound two octaves higher than they're supposed to, rather than the one octave I can understand.
On the plus side, not having a dedicated clarinetist allows me to take a clarinet solo when the opportunity arises.
Amanda Cournoyer
URI Clarinet Ensemble, Bass Clarinet
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Author: allencole
Date: 2004-12-24 19:35
And so we come full circle. Amanda, you made the right move. You already play clarinet, so why not let jazz band give you some experience on sax? There's no reason that we clarinet players have to be left out. We just double!
Who knows? Maybe you'll meet up with Terry one day.
Terry, funny thing that you mention charts by Ernie Houghton. I play in a big band led by one of his old associates, and we have a ton of his 'reverse stemmed' charts. They drive me crazy to read, but the quality is very good. I've played that American Patrol chart many times along with Carribean Clipper and others.
I also play regularlly in a four-horn group with some great Sinatra type charts, and the other reed player doubles as well. Unfortunately, our bandleader asked us to stop writing for doubles in our arrangements because he can't find substitutes who double--particularly on clarinet.
Amanda, take note of this. Just as symphonic training fails to prepare clarinetists for non-symphonic situations, many college jazz curricula do not adequately prepare their saxophonists for the need to double. No matter where your education takes you, you will have opportunities if you:
1 - Investigate all styles of music that involve your instrument(s)
2 - Take your 'doubles' seriously
3 - Work hard on your sight reading
For the rest of your life, you will be called on to adapt to various situations. If you take this need seriously, your phone will ring often.
Allen Cole
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Author: conrad
Date: 2004-12-26 13:12
How long would it take a reasonabaly competent clarinettist to be comfortable with sax fingering?
Conrad
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Author: Terry Stibal
Date: 2004-12-26 15:39
"How long would it take a reasonabaly competent clarinettist to be comfortable with sax fingering?"
If you've played for a few years, then you'll be doing useable sax playing inside of a couple of days. The Sax sax system duplicates the "clarinet" register as far as note name to key correspondence, with the exceptions being the first and second fingers LH, and the lack of a thumb hole/ring. For the rest, it's like playing an Albert system clarinet, with no duplication of the little finger keys. Side keys and the "sliver" key on the lower joint are there, but no Eb/Bb sliver key (for which you instead get the "bis" mechanism).
You do have the palm keys (at the top end of the range, but also as a useful alternative fingering ("palming"?) in the middle register), and the oddity of first finger LH B but all fingers up save second finger LH C. Against this, the "break" on the saxophone is much less cumbersome (shift between middle of staff C to middle of staff D, instead of clarinet A to B).
I picked up enough sax quickly enough to play the tenor part in Threepenny Opera in four weeks, this being some thirty odd years ago. I won't say that I could read much at sight at that point in my "development", but I mastered the embouchure and fingers well enough at that point to deliver a "pro" performance. Within a year, I was comfortable sight reading on the horn. Or, should I say "horns", since I've since played the big four (SATB) ever since. I even got paid to play bass sax for a season many years ago.
As the Nike people are fond of saying, "Just do it". It's not like sax playing is the equivalent of nuclear physics, and you'll not know if you don't try. Rent a student horn for a couple of months, work at playing some music that you already know on clarinet, and you'll surprise even yourself. Then, get some advice on vibrato from a "real" sax player, since clarinet players are going to go too light on this essential element of the saxophonist's arsenal without any coaching.
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Author: Terry Stibal
Date: 2004-12-26 15:56
"Terry, funny thing that you mention charts by Ernie Houghton. I play in a big band led by one of his old associates, and we have a ton of his 'reverse stemmed' charts. They drive me crazy to read, but the quality is very good. I've played that American Patrol chart many times along with Carribean Clipper and others. "
The first Houghton chart that I played was that very American Patrol, which I sight read on a sub job with a local big band about six years ago. Two things that immediately impressed me were that 1) he knew how to voice parts well, and 2) he was a bit tight with the horn changes. But, even while I was struggling with the less than two bars to get from Alto to Baritone in the second last horn change, I had marked Houghton's stuff as being a cut above most of the rest.
(Houghton also didn't write dumbed down bari parts, another plus. Sometimes, he kept the baritone and switched clarinet parts to the first or second alto, though.)
Since I started my group, I've made it a point to purchase every Houghton chart that I can find, and have yet to be disappointed with any of them. I do have two trombone players who both don't like to read them due to the backwards nature of the notation, but then again I don't understand how they can read their sixty ledger line parts in any event. His Miller and Goodman record copies are faithful to the originals but they also tidy up some long standing omissions in the originals as well.
We did his Canadian Sunset, Caribbean Clipper and American Patrol at an oldies-themed performance a week ago, and (as usually) all were well received by those who were around when the originals were performed.
Too bad that all he apparently did (or does; some of the tunes are relatively new in the grand scheme of things so he may still be around) were instrumentals.
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Author: ClarinetGirl312
Date: 2004-12-27 00:30
If you want to play in the jazz band, I suggest you do some major sucking-up. I play piano for my high school's jazz band (not the best part, but hey, at least I'm in it) and because my director loves me so much, he purposefully chose a song that had a clarinet part. Now, it's not a solo, just a lead, but I still have 2 more years after this and he's promised more if I pull this off. So just get to know your director real well, and if that requires having to play another instrument to get in, so be it. As long as you get to play the clarinet at some point, it's all good, right?
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Author: Rick Williams
Date: 2004-12-27 15:45
Conrad
I picked up an Alto sax on a lark and had never touched a sax before and 20 minutes later was playing Blue Velvet, Hail to the Chief and Happy Birthday in two different octaves. Sax for whatever reason seems very intuitive. I bought one and now a month later feel fairly comfortable with it but like anything to be really good requires time and practice.
Best
Rick
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Author: conrad
Date: 2005-01-05 20:20
Thanks for info. I've been away for a few days so just picking up the threads again.
I've been playing clarinet for five years and one early difficulty was matching the note on the page to the fingering on the insrtument. Now I see a note and know what holes to finger. I suppose my fear is having to re-learn this automatically on the sax, i.e. see a note and play it instinctively.
I'll try my local music shop for a short-term hire. The owner teaches sax.
Any benefit in trying tenor as it is a Bb instrument or should I go for alto? Which is most flexible or useful in smallish jazz groups?
Conrad
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Author: Pappy
Date: 2005-01-05 21:56
conrad wrote:
> Any benefit in trying tenor as it is a Bb instrument or should
> I go for alto? Which is most flexible or useful in smallish
> jazz groups?
>
Not really. All saxes pretty much finger the written notes the same. Just think of both main registers being fingered basically like the clarion register of the clarinet and it's an easy transition. Clarinet players sometimes find it difficult not to have a "hard mouth" when playing a sax. The embouchure is "softer" and the angle of the mouthpiece is different. I double on Alto. My teachers were always wary of the potential "damage" you could do to your clarinet embouchure. Don't know if that is a legitimate concern or not, but I caution my students that way as well.
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