 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: pguy
Date: 2004-09-10 20:28
I'm still having a lot trouble with rhythm. I regularly use a metronome in practice, but have trouble internalizing the pulse. What else can I do help develop an "internal clock"?
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Author: ron b
Date: 2004-09-10 21:26
Have you tried decreasing your practice time, increasing your listening time? I find listening to others, mildly analyzing and appreciating, very helpful to "internalizing" beat and rhythmic patterns.
- r![[cool]](http://test.woodwind.org/clarinet/BBoard/smileys/cool.gif) n b -
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Author: Dee
Date: 2004-09-10 22:09
Are you counting the beat? Actually counting mentally should help.
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Author: Pam H.
Date: 2004-09-10 22:59
Tap your foot. (when practicing anyway) There's good reason so many students do it. It's an external movement that becomes instinctual and internal over time.
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2004-09-10 23:17
Play downbeats. Everything else is secondary. When you play each beat, immediately look toward the next beat and visualize where your fingers will be at that point.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: Camanda
Date: 2004-09-10 23:50
Ever subdivide? My director does this with us. Instead of the quarter note (or half note or dotted quarter, et cetera), he'll tap eighth or sixteenth notes. Eighths are especially helpful for dotted quarter-eighth rhythms, and sixteenth notes for dotted-eigth-sixteenths. I do it with my metronome when I can, by increasing the tempo twofold or threefold. I half to live with the half note pulse for Overture to Candide, I don't think my metronome does 304 quarters per minute.
I also find that if I move in my seat while I play, I can follow the rhythm better. We have a jazz tune in 12/8 and I sway to the dotted quarter but tap my foot to the eighths.
Amanda Cournoyer
URI Clarinet Ensemble, Bass Clarinet
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Author: EEBaum
Date: 2004-09-11 00:54
If you do tap your foot, be sure that your foot taps a steady beat. I've often seen (and done it myself) people tapping their foot completely out of time, or worse, hovering their toe above the ground waiting to find the next beat.
Rather, I'd recommend the following when you practice:
First, play part of the piece, playing only the first note (downbeat of beat 1) of each measure. Repeat this until you are in time and can play it well. Now, do the same thing with the downbeat of each beat of the measure, repeating until you are in time and can play it with good musicality. Then, add a subdivision (eighths, or the third note of triplets) and do the same. Continue until all rhythms have been worked out.
On each step, make absolutely sure that you are still playing the notes of the previous step as well as you did then (i.e., when playing eighths, make sure the quarters still sound like they did when you were just playing quarters). Above all, as I said before, know where the downbeats (the quarters in 4/4, for example) lie, and play them in time at all costs, each leading to the next.
-Alex
www.mostlydifferent.com
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Author: D Dow
Date: 2004-09-11 13:35
Get out the Cooley Rythmn system and you will play perfectly forwever....
David Dow
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Author: William
Date: 2004-09-11 15:43
Pam H wrote, "Tap your foot. (when practicing anyway) There's good reason so many students do it. It's an external movement that becomes instinctual and internal over time".
In the spirit of diversified opinion, our local university's retired professor of percussion (former tympanist with the Boston Pops under Fiedler) recently told us that he really didn't feel secure in his rhythmic timing until he stopped taping his foot and started internalizing the beat.
To tap or not, there is probably no correct answer (except if it distracts during a performance). For me, my rhythmic timing seems to improve with a more rigorus playing or performing schedule. The more involved I am with interpreting and performing rhythmic patterns, the better I get. And I think the same thing will work for you. Listening to a lot of music of all styles--and maybe tapping along--playing next to other players and matching exactly what they do rhythmically, using that (grrrr) metronome to keep your tempo steady (it is a normal tendency to rush the beat), counting out loud and internally, doing a few rhythmn sheet (theory).........what ever!!! The more you get involved with rhythmic decision making, the better and steadier you will become.
BTW, one of the hardest postions to fill in a combo or jazz band is to find a percussionist (drummer) who can keep the beat steady. It's not as easy as it seems to the uneducated (non musical) observer. So, as Lawrence W always said, "OK boys, A 1 n A 2......" and, with a lot of practice and experiance, you'll aomeday find the beat and get in step. Good luck.
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Author: allencole
Date: 2004-09-11 16:03
Also tap your foot or keep time through some other physical means when LISTENING to music. (When driving, I just tap my finger lightly on the steering wheel) This causes you to measure everything that you hear, and much of it will come back to you when you try to execute rhythms.
Also be sure that this isn't a finger, articulation or hesitation problem. I lot of inexperienced players are actually inclined to play their rhythms correctly, but sabotage themselves through too much mental double-checking.
When you see a rhythm, GO FOR IT without hesitation. Either you'll get it right or you won't. If you don't then practice it at a slower speed.
One final suggestion, which may already have been given. Sound it out before you play it--and then MAKE yourself physically move to that rhythm.
Eebaum mentioned the importance of tapping your foot steadily rather than hesitantly. Truer words have never been spoken. You cannot allow any technical difficulties or hesitation get in the way of your tempo:
ergo...
Don't tap along to your playing....PLAY along to your TAPPING!
Best of luck
Allen Cole
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Author: Tom A
Date: 2004-09-12 02:03
Just going further on Camanda's point, is the problem one of pulse, or is it rhythm? One depends on the other, but they're not the same thing. If you have a metronome for the beat but can't nail the rhythm, maybe you're not certain of how long the notes should actually be. I remember hearing teachers and conductors saying something like "Wrong rhythm, you're not counting", when my own experience in these roles tells me it should be "Wrong rhythm, you're playing the wrong type of note". BTW, not knowing your experience, pguy, sorry if I'm insulting your intelligence.
Subdividing into the smallest necessary note length helps to work out how a rhythm (which is a combination of many note lengths) should sound, even if it has to be slowed down. Once the combination is known and remembered, it can be brought up to tempo. Future encounters with the same rhythm will also come to you much more quickly, until you reach the point where you're "reading" the rhythm instantly rather than counting it, in the same way that a child sounds out an unfamiliar word (a combination of many letters) then gradually remembers how the whole combination of sounds should be said.
Cheers
----------------------------------------------
Confucius say, "Why you always quote me in silly Chinese accent?"
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Author: pguy
Date: 2004-09-13 17:53
Thanks to all for your many suggestions. I will try them and see what works.
I am not familiar with the "Cooley Rythmn system", and initial research (including Google) came up dry. Would you please let me know where I can find out more info on it. Thanks.
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Author: GBK
Date: 2004-09-13 18:33
pguy wrote:
> I am not familiar with the "Cooley Rythmn system", and initial
> research (including Google) came up dry. Would you please let
> me know where I can find out more info on it. Thanks.
Edward Cooley was a percussionist and music supervisor in the (Connecticut?) public schools. His idea was to combine drumming principles (hands and feet) to teach rhythm to instrumentalists.
He used simultaneous and alternating hand and foot tapping to simulate instrumental playing and loosen the body for more fluent rhythmic technique. The opposing physical movements of the foot and hand permitted the rhythm to be felt internally by the body.
Today, his rhythmic notation is universally used by teachers:
Example: in 4/4 time, with the foot tapping quarter notes
Hand tap and vocally count quarter notes: 1,2,3,4
Hand tap and vocally count eighth notes: 1 and, 2 and, 3 and, 4 and
Hand tap and vocally count sixteenth notes: 1 a and a, 2 a and a, 3 a and a, 4 a and a
Hand tap and vocally count triplets: 1 tee toe, 2 tee toe, 3 tee toe, 4 tee toe
Many teachers (myself included) slightly alter the rhythmic syllables ( 1 e and a, 2 e and a, etc...) but the principles are still the same.
The Cooley system is also excellent for deciphering elementary tied rhythms, as the foot stays steady, but the hand and voice attempts the tied notes ...GBK
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