 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2004-08-12 03:38
For me, both have come pretty easily to me... I'm not quite sure at this point which one was harder... Clarinet probably... But I would like to know some of y'alls opinions... Some ppl say, if you can play one instrument you can play them all... Not quite sure who, but I've heard it before... I think it could be an assumption, but who knows... I haven't really tried any other instruments... Are all instruments equally hard???
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Author: Jim E.
Date: 2004-08-12 03:57
Really, its an "apples and oranges" comparison. A pianist will strike up to 6 or 7 notes at the same time while reading 2 diferent clefts. (An organist will do this while switching between 2, 3 or even 4 keyboards (manuals) and while playing yet another part with his/ her feet!) Clarinetists will NEVER play more than one note at a time.
BUT...
A piano note will either be in tune or it won't be. Nothing the pianist does will improve or degrade intonation. The only thing the pianist can do is call the tuner (in this case a person, not a gadget.) A clarinetist must always be the master of intonation.
Which is harder??? Beats me! Apples and oranges!
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Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2004-08-12 04:16
so... does Apple=Orange... HAHA! It's an expression I know... I have to admit reading one note at a time is easy, but having to deal with emboucher problems is a different story... Reading two clefs isn't really that hard, it's not as hard as maintaining the correct emboucher... Wait, am I answering my own question... wow I think I am... haha... did I know the answer all along.. hm... oh well... I think I just wanted different opinions other than my own...
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Author: diz
Date: 2004-08-12 04:40
Good answer Jim ... but I might hesitantly suggest an order of difficulty
Strings (due to the fact that all notes have to be manufactured, and to have secure pitch a string player has to have a razor sharp mental map of the various "positions" used)
Keyboards (with organ at the top due to the fee and hand combo)
Horns (as of all the brass, it's the horns that are the most difficult to become proficient, or so my brass playing colleagues tell me)
then just about the rest of the orchestral instruments with triangle at the bottom of the heap
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Author: clarnibass
Date: 2004-08-12 05:43
Jim E. wrote: "Clarinetists will NEVER play more than one note at a time."
I must disagree. First of all, you can play 2 notes at a time for example a low note and an overtone. Also I have played notes and sang a different note (or the same note) at the same time and that is 2 notes at the same time. Also you can use effects but and it's not like you are playing the notes yourself but you still have to do other things while playing.
Post Edited (2004-08-12 05:47)
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Author: ned
Date: 2004-08-12 06:53
""Some ppl say, if you can play one instrument you can play them all... ""
Having proficiency with one instrument does not guarantee success with another.
There are some gifted individuals who can pick up virtually any instrument and make music with it after a relatively short time, but I would wager that most of us feel most relaxed (and therefore most proficient) with just the one.
I would say that all instruments are probably equally as hard to master, but that is assuming one wants to ''master'' it as opposed to just get by.
I wouldn't say I have actually mastered the clarinet you know, but it's what I am best at - I can also play drums, but that is second best, as for my piano - that's best not mentioned, I use it just to work numbers out on.
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Author: ohsuzan
Date: 2004-08-12 14:21
I do think that for some people, some instruments are easier to play than others. And I suspect it depends to a great extent on what instrument you originally trained.
My original instrument was clarinet (well, flutophone, but does that count?). I didn't get to piano lessons until quite a bit later, and to this day, I don't have the facility with bass clef on piano that I do with treble clef. And curiously enough, I find the organ, feet and all, easier to deal with than piano.
But I also have never encountered a wind instrument in whatever clef that I couldn't play pretty promptly. And strings seem doable, too. I have concluded that this has something to do with having been trained only on a melodic, rather than harmonic, instrument. I developed a "melodic" rather than "harmonic" ear.
So I think the moral of this story is that a child who is musically gifted/interested, as I was, should be provided with keyboard as well as wind/string training at an early age -- before those linguistic synapses that close at puberty slam shut.
Susan
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Author: William
Date: 2004-08-12 15:49
"Are all instruments equally hard???"
Short answer--yes. Individual ability and ones perception of what is "hard" is also part of the delemia, but every instrument or voice has its own set of challenges that must be mastered by the player/singer for optimum musical success.
However, it is often personal motivation that is the biggest factor which determines ultimate success or failure, not the particular instrument or voice in question. Aptitude (innate ability) does not insure success unless fueled by interest and the dersire to act. As a teacher, you can lead the horse to the water, but if it does not want to drink........you can make the analogies and complete the thought. For any pursuite in life, you first simply have to "gottawantta"--but if that motivation is matched with special aptitude and ability for that work, success is more readily attainable.
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Author: Sheila-music_lover
Date: 2004-08-12 16:26
hmmm, hard Q., but I play piano and flute, and I'm learning the clarinet now, and they are totally different. like, I've been, working on piano since I was 5, and I could do better, and I've been playing the flute for a few years now.
(I started the clarinet 2 days ago, but at least I can play one scale!) They are much different in sound difficulty etc. I would definately not say that it is
not true about the "once you play one instrument you can play them all"! I agree, however that it is equally hard to 'master' the instrument.
Anyway, thats how I see it.
Sheila
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Author: Contra
Date: 2004-08-12 23:08
Piano came relatively easy to me after a while. When I started switching clarinet sizes, I started really studying transpositions and music theory. A few months ago, we went to my grandmother's house for a visit. I started playing on her old piano. As soon as I found middle C, figuring out where a note was became much easier. So if you know one instrument, you can have a bit more luck on another. Now, to use that on the accordion.
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Author: mkybrain
Date: 2004-08-12 23:20
i'd say in the highest difficulites of piano, it is much more difficult, way more difficult. Its like playing every part of a symphony. I've seen 1/128 notes in an extremely difficult piano piece. Clarinet, if ur standard is to play better than u are right now, and it always should be, is really hard too, but it takes some insane skills and a bajillion, yes thats right, a bajillion, hours of practice to be really sucessful at it.
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Author: ned
Date: 2004-08-13 00:05
"" a bajillion, yes thats right, a bajillion, hours of practice to be really sucessful at it.""
Sounds like a lot really! What is this in real hours?
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Author: Rachel
Date: 2004-08-13 05:43
This is the order in which I find my main instruments difficult.
Clarinet and piano are the hardest, but the ones that I'm best on.
Viola would be next, but only because I find the size of it a bit awkward.
I find the violin very easy. I suspect that the fact that I have perfect pitch and thus don't have to worry about the whole 'am I playing the right note or not' thing so much. I know if I'm playing the right note. Also, an easy way to get a mental map of the positions is to break your top string, and don't replace it for months, thus being forced to shift all over the A string to get a decent range.
Saxophone would probably be the one I find the easiest, but it would be a toss-up between that and the violin.
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Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2004-08-13 05:58
""" a bajillion, yes thats right, a bajillion, hours of practice to be really sucessful at it.""
Sounds like a lot really! What is this in real hours?"
Hm... let's see, three hours a day, seven days a week... 1092 hours a year... I've estimated maybe around 450 for me in about a years time... if you were to go my rate, then you would end up playing 15,750 hours in 35 years... But if you actually went nonstop playing 3 hours a day, seven days a week... then you would end up playing 38,220 hours in 35 years... HAHA!
"Clarinet and piano are the hardest, but the ones that I'm best on."
I haven't tried any of the other instruments you mentioned... But between clarinet and piano which one is harder... you kinda put them in the same category... They are both pretty easy to me, it's fun...
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Author: Rachel
Date: 2004-08-13 06:31
It's hard to say which one is more difficult. I find the piano a bit harder, but I've been playing the clarinet for a couple more years than the piano, and I was self-taught on piano. Taking those factors into consideration, I'd have to say that they are equally difficult.
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Author: Kevin
Date: 2004-08-13 17:36
Of course piano is easier. You can call up a Murray Perahia and tell him to play C4 for you. Then, get someone who's never seen a keyboard before in his life and let him play for you the same note on the same piano. Chances are, he'll be able to play it just as well, with just as good a tone and intonation as Mr. Perahia.
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Author: Camanda
Date: 2004-08-13 18:03
The clarinets all came very easily to me, probably soprano Bb the easiest, then bass, A, and Eb at the end because I find the size awkward. Saxophones are next, tenor a little easier than soprano because the soprano is hard to tune for me. Guitar, then fiddle, and piano way down at the end. I have very bad piano habits and fear I shall never fix them, ooops.
It depends on what one means by "easier", I guess, and of course who you are. I tell my students (all 3 of 'em) that the clarinet is not all that difficult to learn to play, but it is difficult to learn to play well. Some instruments can be hard to learn to play, but then relatively easy to play well once the basics are nailed. Our new French horn player, an ex-trumpeter, is finding that true for himself. Once he got past the closeness of partials and playing with his left hand, he has done extremely well with it and sounds as if he's played for more than six months. My 2 cents, and redundancy.
Amanda Cournoyer
URI Clarinet Ensemble, Bass Clarinet
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Author: mkybrain
Date: 2004-08-13 23:42
Hm... let's see, three hours a day, seven days a week... 1092 hours a year... I've estimated maybe around 450 for me in about a years time... if you were to go my rate, then you would end up playing 15,750 hours in 35 years... But if you actually went nonstop playing 3 hours a day, seven days a week... then you would end up playing 38,220 hours in 35 years... HAHA!
hehe, did u ever see that special on NBC, of the sextuplets that go into julliard on piano, all sic of them!!! They practiced 6 hours a day since they were small children and were homeschooled. I think they all had baby grands in too, in their house. Thats the kind of psycho practicing im talking about. Although, a guy Named Jerry Hall, who makes mouthpieces for people in my state, said he was practicing 6 hours a day when he was going to school under gennusa. But thats jsut college, these kids were playing at that rate for much longer.
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Author: Kevin
Date: 2004-08-13 23:48
Maybe after reading that Mary might think twice before labeling herself as pshychotic? lol
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Author: mkybrain
Date: 2004-08-13 23:49
lol, indeed, but u shouda seen the people who im talking about, i dont think i wouldve traded my life for what they have, just personal preferance though.
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Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2004-08-14 00:31
Well, that was the piano... If you practiced 6 hours a day on the clarinet, then it might do more harm than good... After a while your emboucher would get tired, and it would mess you up.. It's probably useless practicing after three hours anyways... I dunno, that's just what I heard on another clarinet forum somewhere off in the net... Anyways, yes that is what you call truly psychotic... HAHA! LOL! Although I'm glad y'all are amused by my screen name... that's partly what it's there for... HAHA! I would've liked to see that though, that sounds like it would've been awesome to watch... I'm just saying I practice alot compared to ppl who I'm surrounded by every day... The whole reason for the name is because one day this guy asked me why I always practicing during lunch and free time during school, and I said because I'm psycho (jokingly)... It's been a joke ever since... So anyways, yeah...
Clarinet music is much much easier to sightread than piano... But instead of putting one finger down for one note you might put 0-9 down (while your thumb is resting on the thumb rest) depending on the note... I suppose they are equally hard, I can't tell too much of a difference...
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Author: Kevin
Date: 2004-08-14 01:05
The powers at Juilliy should really commission somebody to write a sextet for those siblings! Or at least a trio for three 4-hand pianos, or maybe a solo work for a 12-hand piano? Watch out, Katia and Marielle Labeque!
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Author: mkybrain
Date: 2004-08-14 03:25
actually, when u have played enough, 3 hours isnt to strenous on ur embetchoure i don't think, and uve developed it enough to where playing for very very long periods of time isnt impossible. and i bet someone who plays 6 hours a day would usually play better than some who practices 3 hours a day, though i think ud have to be out of ur right mind to do so
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Author: mkybrain
Date: 2004-08-14 04:40
heh, well thats almost a political comment, almost, and lets not go there
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Author: its the Lencho
Date: 2004-08-14 16:45
"Of course piano is easier. You can call up a Murray Perahia and tell him to play C4 for you. Then, get someone who's never seen a keyboard before in his life and let him play for you the same note on the same piano. Chances are, he'll be able to play it just as well, with just as good a tone and intonation as Mr. Perahia."
Sadly, most songs in the piano repertoire consist of more than a single note.
But speaking in a more serious tone, the difficulty of an instrument partly depends on its history and its own brand of literature.
The more literature that's written for an instrument, the more opportunity there is for the instrument to explore new possibilities for its mechanics, expanding them.
The music of composers such as Beethoven, Chopin, and Liszt were laughed at when published - their difficulties being tossed off as "impossible". Paganini has done the same for the violin.
In my mind, no one has done such a thing for the clarinet. Sadly, the clarinet never reached the popularity of instruments such as the piano or violin.
The piano is the easiest instrument to begin on, yet the hardest to master in the end. Any string instrument is the devil to master at any stage.
And as for the recent remarks on practice - if you're going to practice, please realize that down-time is as important as the actual practicing.
Keeping your body and mind in shape is far more important than spending time with the clarinet in your mouth, in my opinion. Go swim or something.
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Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2004-08-14 17:55
I am in shape... It's not like I play clarinet, and then go sit and chug down a 2 liter of dr. pepper or anything (although that would be mildly entertaining to watch)... I'm pretty active, especially during marching band season... I do swim sometimes, I was on the swim team earlier this summer (that ended)... But it is important to keep your body in shape...
One of Chopin's pieces for the piano is really hard, for me anyways... It's called Fantaisie Impromptu... I wonder if there is something equally as hard for the clarinet...
I really wish that clarinet had reached a level of popularity, where composers, such as Chopin, Beethoven, and Liszt, would've written more songs for it...
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Author: Kevin
Date: 2004-08-14 23:05
Don't get me started on the Chopin impromptu...the most overrated and overplayed work Chopin ever wrote.
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Author: ned
Date: 2004-08-16 04:26
''that's just what I heard on another clarinet forum somewhere off in the net...''
Which other clarinet forum are you referring to please?
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Author: chicagoclar
Date: 2004-08-16 05:49
Well, one of my great friends is an amazing pianist and she finds the piano very natural to play. Now if you give her a clarinet she struggles. She can make sound and has some basics, but it's much more difficult for her than piano. Me on the other hand........piano is terribly hard! I guess one difference is our physical atributes. She can reach over an octave and a half, and I can't reach one.
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Author: WinJ
Date: 2004-08-16 21:30
Err...I think it depends which instrument you start first. I agree that each instrument is equally hard in its own way, but for me, piano is the harder of the two. Even though I have played piano for nearly 7 and half years now, and clarinet only for 5 years, piano is still harder. This is probably because I'm on a completely different level of difficulty in piano. I'm sure clarinet will get harder as I progress.
^.^ I agree about Fantaisie Impromptu being overrated. This summer, at Interlochen I believe it was performed...seven or eight times, sometimes twice in the same recital!
-Winnie^_^
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Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2004-08-17 00:49
HAHA... fantasie impromptu = very overrated... AND YET I CAN'T PLAY IT! HAHA!
I got exciting news that I'd like to tell everyone... haha.. even though ya probably don't care... I joined choir this year, and I get to accompany my choir teacher on the piano... WOOHOO... ok... that was my little burst of excitement...
But, I dunno... I kinda think clarinet is a little harder... Of course, I've been playing piano for 2 years, and clarinet for 1... But with the embouchere and everything, and having never had to do that before, it was quite a challenge... When I started piano, all the notes were there and in tune... It was a matter of hitting the keys at the right time with the correct fingers... So, I still dunno... I suppose it does depend on the person...
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Author: Kevin
Date: 2004-08-17 02:50
If you're talking of "playing" the instrument, I guess anybody can easily see that a keyboard is as easy and simple an instrument and idea as anything else, except for maybe some percussion stuff.
People who generally find playing piano natural and easy for themselves are usually excellent music readers, where as those who prefer, say clarinet, and find piano itimidating are generally good at purely "playing" their instrument and very often not good music readers.
Take a look at a piano concerto by Tchaikovsky or Rachmaninoff, then take a look at a horn concerto by Strauss or Mozart. Quite a difference. Now play any piece on the piano, then any piece on the horn. Same thing.
I've met lots of people who frustrate over their piano playing...but none of them are really frustrated over their playing, but more likely stumbling through learning a repertoire solo, which of course may subconciously make them doubt themselves and actually rethink their basics...and in the world of piano, the basics are pretty darn simple.
Bottom line is... comparing piano to a wind instrument is just like apples and oranges. What criteria is available to judge? But if I have to give a definate answer, I go with piano if for nothing other the reason I've stated in my previous post with Perahia vs novice.
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Author: WinJ
Date: 2004-08-17 02:59
Er, I also wanted to mention that it seemed (at least to me) to be a lot harder to play musically on the piano than on the clarinet. Maybe this is because piano is partly a percussion instrument? Now I don't have this problem on the piano, but I when I was younger it was a large problem. On clarinet, a wind instrument, I feel it is easier to express moods/dynamics.
-Winnie^_^
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Author: psychotic lil clarinet girl (don't as
Date: 2004-08-17 03:04
I agree... It is much easier to express yourself on the clarinet... On the piano, when I'm mad, I just bang on it and go really really fast on one piece... Piano, for me, is a way to get my frustration out... So, yeah...
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