 The Clarinet BBoard
|
Author: LeWhite
Date: 2004-06-30 04:22
Hey guys
I have air escaping through the corners of my mouth, 90% on the right side. I play slightly off-center but I can't help it, I don't have the most fantastic model-like perfect teeth!
I'm not sure what to do, I've tried using different types and shapes of mouthpiece-sticky-rubber-things, and it seems that the largest think black ones work best, but still don't stop the air or anything.
Anyone got any strategies?
Thanks.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: hans
Date: 2004-06-30 13:26
You could experiment with a slightly softer reed. It might let you reduce your air pressure enough to stop the leakage.
Hans
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: William
Date: 2004-06-30 13:36
Try double lip embouchure for a while, using the upper lip on the beak rather than your "two front teeth". Actually, the upper teeth support the upper lip, but they do not touch the mouthpiece. Practicing for short periods of time with this method--or switching to it all together (as many fine pro players use it all the time)--may help "educate" your lips to retain the air pressure and not leak.
However, if you were my student, I would encourage (require) you to realiegn your embouchure to be more centered. "But I can't help it" is an unacceptable attitude. Nobody is perfect, but everyone can improve and even a slight readjustment or repositioning may help correct your leak. Basic posture or hand position issues may also be factors causing your "off-center" chops. Someone elses perspective is always enlightening, therefore a few lessons with a professional clarinet teacher would be of great help.
Hope this helps dismiss your hiss..............:>)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: jmsa
Date: 2004-06-30 13:58
I had the same problem. I recently switched to the double lip method, because I tried it and noticed that my tone improved 100%, not realizing that this method would stop air leakage. Hopefully you will start to use the double lip method and will also find multiple benefits.
jmsa
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Clarinetist
Date: 2004-06-30 14:25
I know you are hoping to get out of the bad habit, but I wish I can ease you off a little by saying that I know one recording artist who is having the same problem as you. His name is Guy Dangain, and I have heard a recording where you can hear it almost continually. It bothers me a little, but his overall sound is pretty beautiful.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: LeWhite
Date: 2004-06-30 23:34
See even on a soft reed I leak air - I'll try the double-lip, thanks.
My teacher has gotten me to properly align the clarinet in the past and I've stuck to it for a while but after a few weeks I find myself off-center again!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Alexis
Date: 2004-07-01 01:37
Hi
You could try using slightly more sideways pressure from the corners of your mouth if that make sense - you probably just need to equalise the pressure throughout the embouchure. The problem will probably not go away automatically but if you just concentrate on small improvements every day you can get over it in a couple of weeks I would say.
I have met a couple of people who have actually solved problems by getting rid of those big black mouthpiece pads and replacing them with something considerably smaller but I guess everyone is different. I have a gut feeling that having a thick pad on top of your mouthpiece actually would increase the likelihood of an air leak as it changes the external proportions of the mouthpiece...which in turn affects your embouchure and the area that you have to seal. Just my opinion though...
Alex
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Snowy
Date: 2004-07-01 03:49
LeWhite,
I have the same problem but put it down to age (and fatigue).
But I saw on this BB not too long ago the suggestion of keeping a spare mpc (with reed on) with you at all times and using spare moments to see how long you can hold the mpc unsupported . In fact I think the poster even suggested adding a barrel to make the exercise more worth while.
Snowy
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2004-07-01 04:29
Where EXACTLY is the air leaking?
If it is at the SIDE of your mouthpiece, where your lips meet, then surely you need to draw the sides of your lips together more - left side to riright, and right side to left, i.e. pursing instead of smiling.
But your mention of the patch suggest that you are having trouble with the air leaking somewhere else.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: LeWhite
Date: 2004-07-01 07:33
That's the spot, Gordon.
The other day I tried just a small thin clear patch and it got worse. I felt so much more comfortable with the larger black rubber one because it has more room to put my lips over and less room for air to leak out the side.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Brenda
Date: 2004-07-01 11:54
OK, then that's the problem. I can see from your posts that the large patch is serving as a useful crutch. Put your small patch back on and use double-lipping. At first you'll only be able to use it for 3-5 minutes at a time, rest, then try again. Your tone will be absolutely awful due to lack of reed support. Your clarinet will wobble - support it with your knees. Your upper lip may hurt quite a bit, so be gentle with the fingering. Do this for about the first 15 minutes of your daily practice, then go back to something more comfortable. But persist with this. When strengthening your arms or legs you know that it takes a couple of weeks to see some real results, right?
Somewhere along the way your embouchure has been allowed to be lazy. Not on purpose, it just happens to us as our concentration is placed on other things, reading music, dynamics, and so forth. Also, you may have one side of your mouth that's less strong than the other - my right side is where the leaks happen, and by paying attention to this more I've noticed that it's the whole right side of my face that's not as strong as the left (even though I'm right-handed). A physiotherapist would have you isolate those particular muscles that are weaker and strengthen them with specific exercises.
The double-lipping method comes from well documented research, and is recommended as either a remedial method to solve varied problems or can be used constantly as some people advocate. What actually happens (noted from research I've done and then from actual practice) is that your embouchure is then forced to be formed in a different manner. You no longer rely on your jaw to hold the mouthpiece and to press the reed. The entire circle of muscles around your mouth, involving the cheek muscles as well, are now called upon to do the supporting. This can be a painful process to use those up-to-now slightly used muscles. Since the entire set of facial muscles are used, you begin to strengthen the side of the mouth and one side isn't favoured any more since both sides are called upon to cooperate together. (Imagine a comic-strip scenario where the muscles have conversations and fights between each other! "Don't make me work so hard!" "No, but you're the one who's a lazy bum!")
There are many benefits of using double-lipping. Besides strengthening the embouchure, reducing air leakage, and reducing the jaw strain from excessive biting, you'll find that your tone is better, your notes can be more connected (legato), your tonguing is improved. Since the upper lip won't tolerate abuse you'll find that your fingering becomes lighter and you won't bang your fingers down on the keys. Even if you revert back to single-lipping, the strenthened facial muscles will continue to be used and the resulting benefits will continue. Now combine this with relaxation of the shoulders, neck, arms and legs, using only the muscles you need to use, and you've got it made.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2004-07-01 22:55
An exercise mentioned for 'strengthening chops' in the sax forum, that you can do any time without the mouthpiece, is:
Purse your lips, smile widely, puse your lips, smile widely..... etc.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: BobD
Date: 2004-07-02 11:51
After reading all the suggestions I'm thinking that with a naturally off center embochure you should switch to soprano sax. On a serious note....and from a strictly muscular view.....an off center embochure should be viewed as unnatural. Maybe a trip to the dentist is in order so you can correct the cause of the problem.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: LeWhite
Date: 2004-07-02 13:22
Thanks for the suggestion but I certainly can't afford that much dental work!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Gordon (NZ)
Date: 2004-07-02 13:39
If a mouthpiece fits better in the mouth off-centre, I can't see what could possibly be wrong with that.
We are all different shapes and sizes.
Take a look at this set of pictures of flute embouchures, all top players. There is nothing standard at all!
And at least half of them are off-centre!
http://www.larrykrantz.com/embpic.htm
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: theclarinetist
Date: 2004-07-02 14:57
why switch to soprano sax? The only person I've ever seen playing soprano sax off-centered is Kenny G, and from what I gather, he isn't the preferred model for most people (than again, I'm no sax player! = )
DH
theclarinetist@yahoo.com
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: RAMman
Date: 2004-07-02 18:49
First of all....Julian Farrell makes a beautiful sound, is a fantastic player and has the worst air leak imaginable!
It's not a huge problem....I have it too on occasion. It's down to the basic shape of your embouchure, usually you just need to reprogramme the autopilot and make sure you're forming it correctly.
The top lip not being tucked under enough is a common cause, it results in the other muscles being too loose.
Double lip causes more problems than it fixes IMO. You try a fast stacatto passage like that and while the sound is pretty, the accuracy is bad due to the fact that the clarinet is not anchored in your mouth properly.
Dental work is not neccessary, save some money!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: Henry
Date: 2004-07-02 21:43
Escaping air can spoil one's "Swing".
It may impede that bright clear ring.
But relative to other gases
that emanate from human masses,
It hardly amounts to anything!
Henry
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: LeWhite
Date: 2004-07-03 01:43
See I make a point of using the upper lip in my embouchoure - it's not like my teacher hasn't taught me well! I am doing everything right, it just seems the mouthpiece is a little small, but it's not like I'm going to have any luck changing that!
It is of note that I have escaping air, in the same place, on Bass but not on Eb.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: GBK
Date: 2004-07-03 05:59
You're inviting a colleague's critique,
When your embouchure has a slight leak.
No hiss should be heard,
With notes tongued or notes slurred.
It's really just shoddy technique. ...GBK
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: RAMman
Date: 2004-07-03 12:22
LeWhite,
Just because your teacher has taught you correctly, doesn't mean you don't have a problem. We all constantly adjust things without realising, sometimes you need to take a step back and make sure you're being accurate, and doing what you have been taught.
It is not anything to do with mouthpiece size or shape but as GBK so elegantly put, shoddy technique!!
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: LeWhite
Date: 2004-07-03 12:34
I think the answer is simpler than what we're all thinking. I'm just going to be conscious of it all the time, stop it from happening, and make it a habbit.
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
Author: RAMman
Date: 2004-07-03 13:22
That's exactly what I have been saying to you!
Hope you get it sorted.
Post Edited (2004-07-03 15:29)
|
|
Reply To Message
|
|
The Clarinet Pages
|
 |
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
.jpg){kind=small}
