 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: mkybrain
Date: 2004-06-20 22:30
from the packet i recieved from them, they said there are 600 students who study music there.
how many try out? Is it extremely difficult to get into oberlin?
If there is anybody here who has went through an audition for Oberlin, could u tell me a little bit about what it was like?
Thanx for taking the time to read this and to respond.
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Author: JessKateDD
Date: 2004-06-21 00:29
Well, Richard is a very good teacher, so there is plenty of demand for his services. As far as how hard it is to get into, that depends on how advanced a player you are. One of my students got into Oberlin as a freshman a few years ago and got a top chair. But she was quite advanced and would have gotten into most music schools.
To quantify it, I'd say Oberlin is easier to get into than Curtis. It is probably on a par with most of the big music schools - Eastman, Northwestern, Michigan, etc. Know all of your major and minor scales (melodic, at least), chromatic, and one or two concertos (especially Mozart!). If your private teacher has a history of placing students in competitive schools, then go with his/her advice. If not, then take a lesson or two from a prominent teacher in your area. That person will be able to tell you how you should fare.
On last thing - if you live a conservative lifestyle or have strong religious feelings, Oberlin may not be a good place for you to go. This old-fashioned southern gal never even considered that school for those very reasons :-)
Before anyone has a knee-jerk reaction and calls me names, I would likewise tell an Oberlin-type to avoid BYU or Baylor for the same reasons. You want to go to a school where you are comfortable. College is hard enough without having to deal with behavior that you find upsetting (or likewise, to be in an environment where being yourself is not tolerated).
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Author: mkybrain
Date: 2004-06-21 00:45
just for an example, do u remember some accomplishments that were on your student's resume that was accepted into Oberlin?
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Author: Kevin
Date: 2004-06-21 00:47
Curtis is by far the most selective US music conservatory I know of. My stats say that last year, they accepted 42 our of 787 applicants, good for a knock-your-socks off percentage of 5.3
Oberlin College as a whole took in 33.3% (1976/5934). I would expect their music school's selectivity to be a little more tough than that.
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Author: Katrina
Date: 2004-06-21 03:08
I actually went to Oberlin as a clarinet major...and finished as a clarinet major. This was kind of a big deal, since there were only three from my freshman class of 6 did the same. The others sort of petered out and ended up doing other music-related things. YMMV, though, since I did graduate waaaaay back in 1990.
I loved the whole atmosphere there, though I must say that I had been completely unaware of the general left-wing position most students in the College of Arts & Sciences tend to hold. For me it was good to get out of my small suburban "everyone looks the same" attitude. I do agree with JessKate though, that if you do hold strong religious or political beliefs that it could be more difficult to feel comfortable in general. I will say though that the students in the conservatory TEND to be more middle or right than the very visible "lefties."
I quote:
"You want to go to a school where you are comfortable. College is hard enough without having to deal with behavior that you find upsetting (or likewise, to be in an environment where being yourself is not tolerated)."
This is good advice for any student. Take it to heart and examine yourself as well as the schools you're looking at.
I really have nothing to add about the "current" Oberlin, since my teacher (Larry McDonald) is no longer there...just that it was a fabulous place for me to learn about things I had never seen or experienced before.
Katrina
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Author: mkybrain
Date: 2004-06-21 03:35
fortunately i get along wiht almost all kinds of people, from consertavies to heavy.dark/death metal nutcases. I tend to be quiet and observing, unless i am in a situation where it is needed for me to be outspoken and etc...
in other words, the liber arts type of people don't bother me, at all
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Author: JessKateDD
Date: 2004-06-21 08:21
mky,
My student was ninth chair all-state in Texas her senior year, which probably made her about top 50 in the country (Texas is ridiculously competitive). Richard is also a Texan - I think he was fourth at state in high school. Richard and I both studied with the same lesson teacher, so in some ways my teaching is similar to his, and that may have helped my student just a tad. However, great accomplishments (high all-state chair, competition wins, appearances with symphony orchestras as a soloist) will possibly give you the benefit of the doubt if you bomb an audition. 90 percent of the reason you will or will not be accepted will be based on your audition. Master your scales, perfect your audition pieces, RECORD YOURSELF, and USE THE METRONOME! Also check yourself with a tuner while you're at it. And if your teacher is a nice person but not an accomplished musician, go ahead and spend the 50 to 100 dollars for an hour with a symphony musician or a major college teacher. It will be money well spent, even if you end up being told to go to a state school and try to transfer to Oberlin after a year or two of hard practice. There are some phenomenal teachers out there - the teacher Richard and I had teaches at the University of Houston, and he is as good as anyone.
By the way, it is possible to be too good to get into Oberlin as well. My student told me that a Russian clarinetist auditioned for Oberlin last year and wowed them with Introduction and Rondo Capriccioso by Saint-Saens. Since he was obviously going to get into Curtis or Julliard, Oberlin decided not to offer a spot to him since they knew they would be low on his list, so they offered it to someone else who would be more likely to accept it. This comes to you second hand, so I cannot verify its truth. But if you are that good, I don't think you'd be asking us if you have a shot at Oberlin, so don't worry :P
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Author: Igloo Bob
Date: 2004-06-21 08:43
I wouldn't say Texas is _that_ much more competitive than anywhere else - having spent 3 years in Eastern New Mexico and seeing results from a combo of All-District, All-State, and All-Southwest, as well as whole band competitions (including marching contests, if you'd like), many bands and individual players from certain key cities in New Mexico faired very well against even the best Texas schools and players. Clovis and Roswell, especially, are likely the two best in competition terms in New Mexico, and always manage to do well in All-Southwest. While I'd definitely say that Texas (and definitely Eastern New Mexico as well, Western NM isn't quite on the same page) are very competitive, I don't think that you can really say that 9th in Texas = top 50 overall, there's just too many good players out there, and a lot of quality music programs developing those players. Top 100, perhaps, and even that's assuming quite a bit. If we were to go by your estimates, that'd make me a good shot for top 10 high school Bass Clarinetists in the country. And all arrogance aside, that's pretty unlikely.
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Author: Ralph G
Date: 2004-06-21 13:43
Since I'm a Texan and I never made it past area in high school, I'll agree that Texas is by far the most competitive state. At least that's what I tell myself when I get drunk and nostalgic -- "It couldn't be that I didn't practice enough, it was those darn rich kids from San Antonio!"
--Ralph ("Coulda been a contender... in Delaware")R
________________
Artistic talent is a gift from God and whoever discovers it in himself has a certain obligation: to know that he cannot waste this talent, but must develop it.
- Pope John Paul II
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Author: JessKateDD
Date: 2004-06-21 17:50
Don't worry Ralph, those rich San Antonio kids are getting theirs now. The latest area re-alignment put regions 11, 12, and 23 in the same area, so now the San Antonio kids are getting creamed by even richer Houston kids. Needless to say, when they have the next area realignment, the San Antonio folks will try to go back to the good old days of competing with the Valley.
Igloo - top players in Texas try out for Texas all-state. I've never even heard of All-Southwest. Also, there are a few pretty good bands in West Texas - in El Paso (Coronado HS) and Midland-Odessa, but I doubt they bother with All-Southwest. New Mexico is at least 500 miles away from the best Texas bands, which are mostly around Houston and Dallas. Trust me, you have never heard these bands nor competed with them. Westfield high, for example (www.thebigredband.org) I do not think bothers going to New Mexico to enhance its reputation.
A friend from my high school was 18th in Texas his junior year on clarinet. He moved to California his senior year and got first. He said it wasn't even close - California all-state was far weaker than our region band, one of 24 regions in Texas.
By the way - just Texas and California make up 1/5 of the US population, and since Texas is far more competitive than California, wouldn't being number 9 in Texas average out to top 50 nationally? On the other hand, Alaska and New Mexico combined have 2.5 million people, less than one percent of the US population, so "all arrogance aside", that would mean you're not in the top 100, Igloo. I suspect you are though - your posts reveal a very competitive spirit, and I'm sure you would be a pretty good player anywhere.
One last anecdote. I was at the Interlochen camp one summer in high school. Our band played the Hindemith Symphony. I played a recording for my camp friends of my high school band also performing Hindemith - and these people were top players from all over America. Those who listened to it said my band was the best high school band they had ever heard. We weren't the best band in Texas that year, though we were probably top 10 and had won an invitation to perform at the Midwest convention. But a good Texas band would be great in any other state.
I know I sound harsh, but I'm just stating facts. Kenya has the best runners, Russia has the best chess players, England has the best soccer riots, Philadelphia has the best cream cheese, Alaska is a great place for bashing baby seals, and Texas has the best high school bands.
Sorry about the hijack, MKY. I make an innocent statement that the number 9 player in Texas would be AROUND top 50 in the country, and all of the sudden it turns into bash Texas thread. Go figure.
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Author: Ralph G
Date: 2004-06-21 17:57
Oy... every year putting up with those snots from Churchill and Holmes. You're working me up into a nostalgic fury! I can't decide if I wanna drink or practice right now.
________________
Artistic talent is a gift from God and whoever discovers it in himself has a certain obligation: to know that he cannot waste this talent, but must develop it.
- Pope John Paul II
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Author: Igloo Bob
Date: 2004-06-21 18:20
Hm. I'd be curious, then, to hear any recordings you might have or be able to point me towards of any of those players or bands in that area for comparisons sake. As far as the Clarinet goes, Clovis High School (Clovis, NM) played a pretty good Blue Shades by Ticheli last year, which is an awesome Clarinet piece, and even more heavy in the Clarinet because Clovis High's monster section (ever high school band seems to have one section that just stands out above the rest) has been the Clarinet section for the last few years. I'd be willing to put that forth as a good representation of that band (sadly, which I am no longer a part of) as a whole's ability, as well as some of the better Clarinet soloists.
About your friend who moved from Texas to California: Seeing as he did so well in California, wouldn't that kind of invalidate the importance of Texas and California combined being so large a % of the population? If the difference between Texas and California is so pronounced in terms of musical ability, that sounds about how it was for me, moving from New Mexico, where I practiced for 3 months leading into all-state and and just managed to place 6th overall (2nd concert band) my freshman year, then moving up to Alaska, not practicing or even looking at the music at all until about an hour before I had to make my tape (yeah, we have tapes up here. Alaska is too big and sparsely populated to have live auditions) and easily making it much higher. The ability difference is just that pronounced. And in terms of that, I think you just proved to me that populatio count doesn't matter - odds are, a decent Clarinetist from Clovis or Roswell could move to almost any other state and do very well. If I were to add 5 million population to Alaska, and they all played Clarinet but none were very good, I'd beat them all. But would I be a better player? No. My ability when presented as a % of people I beat would increase, but my ability would not, and my absolute ranking would not (I'd still be under those 50-100 players nation wide who could still beat me). That's why, even though I'm very competitive by nature, I can't take much of an interest in the competitions up here in Alaska. Being named 1st chair Bass Clarinetist (or even 1st chair Clarinetist, really) is like being named king of Madagascar. Aside from Anchorage, the largest city, there is no music situation to speak of in the state. That being said, I believe it's more fair to look at states that are known to put out good musicians more than population. Texas, for sure, and I'd still put Eastern New Mexico. Where else? Michigan or Ohio, perhaps? Any state that could compete with Texas as a musical whole would likely be good competition for a Clarinetist trying to see where he or she ranks across the nation.
Just so you know (since you said you'd never heard of it) All-southwest is much like All-State, just, as you might guess, for the southwest region! I just looked up some more info on it, and it seems that west texas is the only portion of Texas that participates. Strange, I wonder why? In any case, let me know if there's any recordings online I could fine, even a few short clips!
Post Edited (2004-06-21 19:06)
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Author: DavidBlumberg
Date: 2004-07-05 22:46
9th in Texas would maybe put that student in the top 1000 (thousand), not hundred or fifty.
David Blumberg (youngest teacher to ever have a student win the ICA Competition - was 28 back in 1992)
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Author: Igloo Bob
Date: 2004-07-05 23:22
Mr. Blumberg, I agree. Maybe top few chairs consistently in Texas would put you top 100, but not 9th.
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