 The Clarinet BBoard
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Author: sinkdraiN
Date: 2004-05-10 00:52
I just finished a show where I played 1st clarinet. The flute player next to me was an excellent player. However she played just a tad sharp all the time. I had a real hard time bringing my pitch up to her in the mid to upper register. I play a Leblanc LL with a standard B40 mouthpiece. My lower notes play very sharp but my upper notes play flat. Its very tough to adjust all the time especially with a sharp flute player. I thought that maybe my small bore B40 is not a great match to my large bore LL. So I tried my morgan mouthpiece and the intonation was spot on. Its an RM 28 but It was better than adjusting pitch in every register on the B40. I really like the tone of the B40 but can not sacrifice intonation. Would a B40 13 series clear this up or will I have to either get a RM15 or a smaller bore clarinet?
Post Edited (2004-05-10 01:03)
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2004-05-10 15:32
I'm somewhat surprised none of our "big-bore" players have yet responded, so here goes! I am a believer in bore-matching, so I say yes, even tho air velocities in clarinet bores are not high, I cannot see any advantage to NONlinear flow patterns due to substantial diameter changes, such as "steps" due to tuning barrel "pulling" down to small dia. mis-match of mp to barrel, barrel to UJ, believing that good makers will provide matching of UJ/LJ and LJ/bell bores. The tapered [and polycyl.] barrels and U J's for tuning etc, seem to say that also. The well known necessity of mp selection for the very large [15.3 mm] B&H horns, perhaps also recent Selmers? seems to say that to me also ! Other comments, PLEASE, Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: Noel
Date: 2004-05-10 15:48
I can't answer for your Leblanc, but the large bore Boosey & Hawkes 10-10 famously requires a matched mouthpiece to get accurate intonation. Ed Pillinger, amongst others, makes mouthpieces that replicate - and improve on - some of the original designs of the 10-10 mouthpiece. He also says, on his web site, that sometimes performers like to use large bore mouthpieces on small bore instruments, so this implies the requirement to match bore to mouthpiece may not always be mandatory.
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Author: John25
Date: 2004-05-10 21:05
I have played Leblanc LL clarinets for over 40 years. During this period I have used various Vandoren mouthpieces without any bad effects on intonation. I used a B40 for over 10 years, playing in several professional orchestras. The Leblanc LL is not a large bore clarinet as such, although the bore is slightly larger than some Buffets (perhaps someone could provide exact figures). I think the bore is about the same as the Selmer 10G and Signature models.
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Author: bill28099
Date: 2004-05-11 00:19
I only play old, pre 1960s, larger bore clarinets, Leblanc and Buffet. I find that Clarion HS* mouthpieces work very well EXCEPT for the 1904 Buffet A where a Vandoren 2RV seems to be appropriate. I have an LL and use the Clarions but really don't like the horn. I'll take my Dynamique over the LL any day but much prefer the Symphonie (with the LL's barrel) even though my teacher swears it's blown out.
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Author: Don Berger
Date: 2004-05-11 14:27
Bill - Three of my best cls are a Selmer CT, an LeB Dyn 2 and an LeB L7, so I also have a feel for the big-bores, and yes, the [my] Sel Clarion, made by O'Brien? is large bore [by my little finger test], so all seems well ! I want to call this thread's attention to the "tuning ring" thread above, in partic. to GBK's comment re: the effect of bore gap on pitch etc. Don
Thanx, Mark, Don
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2004-05-11 15:00
Most importantly, you must match the size of your oral cavity to the bore of both the mouthpiece and barrel. If you play a big bore instrument, you need to use a Big Mouth. If your mouth is too small you'll play out of tune. Trust me, I know because I play out of tune. Any more questions, please ask and we'll all give you answers.
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Author: cigleris
Date: 2004-05-11 22:14
I'm a 'big-bore' player and the simple answer this yes you need a mouthpiece with the same bore as the clarinet, I play on the Peter Eaton big-bore as i used to play '10-10s' and in the profession your intonation needs to be as good as you can get it. Don't worry to much about flutes in my exprience they never play consitantly in tune even the top pros that i've played with. Perhaps it's the English weather!?
Peter Cigleris
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Author: David Spiegelthal ★2017
Date: 2004-05-12 14:50
Last night I was experimenting with two different mouthpieces on my big-bore B&H Series 8-10; both mouthpieces had been refaced by yours truly with approximately the same facing, so it was a reasonably good comparison test. The mouthpieces were a stock B&H, which (although I didn't measure the bore) I assume matched the barrel bore pretty well, and a crystal Pomarico which has a smaller, standard French bore size. Although the overall tuning was different (as usual the Pom played at a lower overall pitch), I didn't find any tuning problems using it, with its allegedly mismatched bore, compared to the matched B&H mouthpiece --- both were spot-on when the barrel was pulled out the appropriate amounts needed to achieve on overall A-440 tuning. But again, at my level of playing (advanced but nowhere near top-flight) it's quite likely that my sensitivity to the tuning is just not able to detect differences.
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Author: D Dow
Date: 2004-05-12 16:20
Dear Sinkdrain
I would think the larger bore B40 13 may be the alternative to the Morgan. North Americans certainly play and hear pitch fairly low so I would suspect the B40 13 is the right direction to head if you still want the qualities of the normal B40 and yet retain the flexibility..
.as to bores and stuff I am not quite sure if some of the posters realize the ear also tends to "correct" the sound we play a good deal. Players like Thurston who used very large bore Booseys had extremely focused and narrow tone..
.I have heard many small bore players sound very open....
David Dow
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Author: sinkdraiN
Date: 2004-05-12 17:06
I believe that this last show just has me paranoid about pitch because the flute player was playing very sharp. Her murumitzu (sorry about the spelling) flute is pitched at A=442. The gig really frustrated me in terms of intonation. According to my tuner my B40 plays in tune.
Do some flute players play sharp on purpose?
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Author: leonardA
Date: 2004-05-13 21:52
How do you know the bore dimension of a mouthpiece. I'm sure it's different than the tip opening like 43 etc.
Leonard
Post Edited (2004-05-13 21:52)
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